The role of meditation in a training routine..

Discussion in 'Health and Fitness' started by BrendanCassidy, Jun 29, 2020.

  1. BrendanCassidy

    BrendanCassidy Valued Member

    I believe in meditation and strongly support it for what ever reason you can come up..whatever you believe about meditation and its benefits is probably correct..

    Being more calm in a situation can have you thinking and moving more efficiently..including attacking and defending..All together meditation can account for allot of the reason why the skill level exists of the subject and the way that they do things..

    A peaceful mind is allot easier to work with than one in conflict..

    But a conflicted mind is good to go as far as practicing internal martial arts..or should I say martial arts for the mind!

    The difference between martial arts in the body and mind..

    The mind in martial arts is more about adopting the correct alignment using depth and energy in an efficient way..because things still exist in spaces in the mind..

    The body in martial arts you need to be able to utilize your basic body movements in a way that is both dynamic and efficient.. So the body has it's limits..but the goal is to take them to their farthest possible reaches..

    So the next question is: What is the relationship between mind and body with regard to martial arts?

    Well the determination and control signals..come from the mind FIRST! So the thought process is a precursor to moving..because you are choosing to move in a certain way..though the moments can be limited based on body structure and dynamism..

    Dynamic bases are always being considered within the mind.. And the body is a flow for that outlet..

    So I see as meditation enabling better control over your body..thus demonstrating that your body will therefore have more freedom..or better utility functions!
     
  2. axelb

    axelb Master of Office Chair Fu

    What methods do you favour for meditation?

    Three terminology of a peaceful mind may not fit with martial arts.
    A balance is needed, a focused mind for combat, but peaceful could be seen as passive, which is only part of the mindset required.

    A calm mind in combat can lead to complacency.
    An aggressive mind can lead to mistakes.

    I believe it is also subjective to each person, some people need to work more on each part of their mindset.
     
  3. Xue Sheng

    Xue Sheng All weight is underside

    Chinese Internal Martial Arts stance training is basically standing meditation. I do those.
     
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  4. Grond

    Grond Valued Member

    I learned this form of standing meditation the other day. Felt it right away. It isn't easy to do this for even five minutes!! I was flabbergasted by the simplicity of this simple exercise, and hooked forever.

    [​IMG]
     
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  5. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    This is simplifying the process too much, I feel.

    "Mind" is a vague term, but reactions happen before we are consciously aware of them. A lot of training is simple behavioural conditioning of reactions to certain stimuli, such as a punch flying toward your face, or someone shooting for a takedown. The nervous system runs through our entire body, it doesn't stop at our brains, let alone our minds. It is more of a feedback system than an all-powerful mind controlling the body like a puppeteer.

    I would say that there are crossover skills between stereotypical meditation and fighting, but it takes work to apply them to that context and it is something that happens anyway. Everyone experiences meditative states while training - if you're thinking about what you're going to have for dinner during a class then there is a problem. Training gives you a number of meditative exercises - from repetitive drilling allowing you to experience an empty mind, to sparring where you live in the moment, softly guiding your unconscious reactions while keeping your mind calm through cardio-vascular biofeedback and breath control. Sparring gives a much easier route to experiencing one-pointed consciousness than more stereotypical meditation exercises.

    For me, those stereotypical sitting or slow movement meditation exercises transfer more to pre-and-post-fight stages, because that happens more in the mental space.
     
  6. Xue Sheng

    Xue Sheng All weight is underside

    There are multiple standing meditations. Many found in Xingyiquan and more found in Yiquan/Dachengquan

    Wuji Standing
    [​IMG]
    Yang Chengfu

    Wuji - Sun Lutang
    [​IMG]

    And the basic stance of Xingyiquan - Santi Shi
    [​IMG]
    Zhang Yun

    there are many others
     
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  7. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    It's enough to make you think the posture doesn't matter... ;)
     
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  8. Grond

    Grond Valued Member

    Learned this one too, with the weight sunk a little with pelvis turned in a little for support, and the hands kind of resting bowed a bit.

    Might be a stupid question but what's the difference in body types (since this feels like body weight training of a sort)? Is it more ideal to be lean and thin or is it fine to be a bit on the meatier side? I'm not obese, definitely a bit overweight since I began my take out binges in March, but curious how important it is for me to cut weight before really getting serious in Tai Chi. Or is that just not something to worry about specific to learning forms etc. (I have not learned any form yet).
     
  9. icefield

    icefield Valued Member

    For general health especially right now it's best to think about losing weight regardless of whether it makes your tai chi better or worse.

    Tai chi is low impact slow exercise as practised by most so your size doesn't matter, but it also means it's not an optimal form of exercise if you want to lose weight and get aerobically fitter.
     
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  10. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    Dude, can you see the guy in that photo?! :D
     
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  11. icefield

    icefield Valued Member

    Surprisingly he was the one who took the low stances and explosive movements out in order to make it more accessible to the general public and more of a health system

    Oh the irony :)
     
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  12. Xue Sheng

    Xue Sheng All weight is underside

    Thats Yang Chengfu when he was older and no, you don't need to lose weight to start training taijiquan training.

    Yang Chengfu young

    [​IMG]
     
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  13. Xue Sheng

    Xue Sheng All weight is underside

    And he was working on a fast form, with fajing, with his student Tung Ying Chieh, just before he died
     
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  14. Grond

    Grond Valued Member

    Thanks, that's kind of what I was getting at. I didn't intend to try to lose the extra pounds with Tai Chi but I can already tell that's not really where things are going to lead anyway. Right now I'm going to focus on correcting structure, those bad habits, etc. Whenever in doubt, I jump rope, and I've been neglecting that (partially because it's not as fun when you've got an extra 20-30lbs on you). My ankles are both bothering me lately and I know it's from the excess. It'll all come together eventually, I hope. A little Tai Chi here and little road work there. :)
     
  15. Xue Sheng

    Xue Sheng All weight is underside

    Not all Taijiquan folks of the past are heavy. The branch of the Yang family that comes from Yang Jianhou to Yang Chengfu seems to have some weight issues

    Sun Lutang
    [​IMG]

    Chen Fa Ke
    [​IMG]
    Yang Shaohou

    [​IMG]
     
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  16. BrendanCassidy

    BrendanCassidy Valued Member

    Meditation makes me feel lighter in my body..

    Which can lead to more mobility..

    Easier to function in the set of consequences that you are involved in..
     
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  17. El Medico

    El Medico Valued Member

    P'raps,but depending on what one is doing during such practice it may or may not qualify as "meditation".

    The posture doesn't matter.Posture matters. But different postures may be for different types of practices while standing.

    In 1920 or slightly after Yang and Wu,C-c performed their long forms together at a demo.Took 'em 5 minutes. Maybe they shoulda just kept it that way!

    Shao-hou was Cheng-fu's brother and he didn't. Neither did Cheng-fu's eldest son,Shou-chung. So it's not that whole branch of the family. Just some. Cheng-fu was a lean rail type when younger.

    The weight issue comes from having a greater caloric intake than expended. Unless perhaps there is a thyroid malady which some of the Yangs get/got when older,but I've never heard of this being the case. Henry VIII too was quite athletic when younger,y'know .
     
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