just got home from a 3hr hour seminar with former hawkeye and UFC coach kenny johnson (well i say 3hrs, i left after 4 and a half and it was still going strong if he could im sure he would camp out on the mats) as always im amazed at the skills a good wrestler has, if you have never touched hands or been shot on by a national level wrestler i suggest you get hold of one, its an eye opener he covered stance, sprawls, front headlock series (also darc and anaconda and the schultz choke) the blast double, setting up the knee tap, double and single in the clinch and god knows what else after i left the place.......... All stuff i have seen before, but the small details were amazing as were the coaching cues, seeing the lightbulb go on for guys who have been grappling for years (inculding me) is funny as hell lol it re-enforced to me how great a base wrestling is (it dictates where the fight happens) and how the attitude wrestling instills carries over so well to all aspects of fighting, and why wrestlers seem to dominate so much in the cage at international level Just thought id share lol
Sounds great bro. I wrestled some years back and mixed it with my Muay Thai skills back in 1988,I belived then and still belive now that those two sports work great together
Funny that considering the rich wrestling heritage the UK has that there is so little of it here. We had it as a school boy sport and I know that both my si-hing and myself found that the base skills, not the least the strength/coordination and timing, helped in everything else we ever studied. LFD
If you didnt play football, baseball, or basketball, we (wrestlers) were called sissies in high school.
Sad lack of Wrestling clubs in the Uk in general eh LFD,In the north east we have had 1 club only for many years,such a great sport to
well wrestling has been effective for centuries and something i really like about it is that it always evolves with the times cant wait to see how far it comes now that college wrestlers now have another avenue to go to besides the olympics now with mma
really explain how, a wrestler can get stood up for inactivity after a takedown and have to do it all over again, when did you last hear of a striker being made to start off his back on the ground due to inactivity on his feet? both fighters start standing in a big cage with lots of room to move, and the wrestlers slams are made null and void by the nice mats you have to land on 5 minute rounds mean after a takedown and domination on the ground we get stood up and have to start all over again standing....thats unfair why not start us in the same position we ended the round in? a wrestler in the clinch isnt allowed to fish hook, eye gouge or headbutt, which sucks seeing as im the one controlling all the tie usps..... all in all id say the rules favour the striker
I think what Infrazael kind of meant by wrestling is favoured is due to the amount of wrestlers that are winning by lay and pray. Judges are seeing a takedown, then not understanding that just because they lay on top and dont do anything, the person on top must be winning. (especially if you got someone like Cecils Peoples judging then God help you) Wrestling is an awesome base to have, because if youre good enough then you can control where the fight goes. Wrestlers in MMA focus more on the striking in their training as they'll then be able to defend themselves to get close enough to takedown if necessary, and when theyre on the ground they're wary of positions vunerable to submissions. Personally I think the time of "just put a wrestler on his back" is long gone, everyone is so much more well rounded now. Saying that, my submissions suck !
I don’t know or think he meant that, he mentioned rules and I would like to know which rules he means, because you are not talking about rules you are talking about judges interpreting a fight. The rules state a fight can be broken up and restarted due to inactivity on the ground (the same can happen in the clinch), the rules don’t state the opposite, ie if a striker is just dancing around and winning on points (like Anderson did for several fights) you get penalized by starting on the ground and this for me is a big disadvantage for wrestlers and grapplers in general. Lay and pray gets stood up, lay and hitting without improving your position like GSP does…. well then it’s the opponents fault for having a bad ground game Takedowns score heavily that’s true, but then you should be penalized for letting your opponent put you on your back in such a bad position
Yep very strange, even stranger when you consider the large Pakistani and Indian cultures here ion the uk, and how big wrestling is in those countries I think with the rise of submission clubs a form of wrestling is taking hold, but a lot of those clubs are BJJ clubs without a real clinch or takedown game, the MMA club I attend is known for its clinch and wrestling skills but even then those skills don’t compare to the takedown skills of someone who wrestled in school or college over in the states or Canada, simply not the competition pool or time spent on the mat those guys have Personally I think its incumbent on those lucky enough to have wrestled in abroad to open schools when then come to our fair country ……
Although all fighters have a "base" like wrestling, jiu-jitsu, muay thai, or boxing, the best ones nowadays are generalists like Anderson Silva, GSP, Jon Jones. They can fight at any range so it does not matter what the rules favor. Granted, wrestling is an excellent base to have. They are some of the toughest, best conditioned athletes in the world.
I also think jello wrestling should become a more common sport. It's really quite amazing how much skill it takes when they're all greased up. Seriously.
A lot of my family members were involved in pehlwani in india and pakistan. Weirdly enough, when they came to the uk they thought they should be "civilised" and abandoned the sport. Even Sikh's that practice gatka and shastar vidiya dont wrestle anymore, when wrestling and submissions were the main form of unarmed combat. Even religious leaders emphasised that wrestling was more important to learn than weapon combat. But we slowly abandoned it. Sad really. (I heard from some people at my club, that the best thing you can do before training BJJ in brazil is earn some wrestling, because most Brazilians bjjers arent used to the tactics involved.)
since i started the thread about the guy, heres kenny teaching at BJ Penns place [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lze1qzpJU2s"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lze1qzpJU2s[/ame] and here he is in action [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKz9nf8ZXRk"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKz9nf8ZXRk[/ame]
Hi Icefield Sounds like a fantastic course with kenny johnson were did you hear about it??? Can you let me know when he will be running a course again I wrestled a bit as a lad and that early close contact and fitness inoculation has really never left me even though like most I have gone on to other things. One thing that always upsets me is when marital artists show techniques against wrestling moves; it clear they have never wrestled. Their distance against the single and double leg take down is always too far way . No wrestler is going to try a take down from that far out. I remember to this day the guy who taught me wrestling an ex school boy and Olympic wrestler said ‘If you can touch their head then grab their leg’.
kenny is paul daley wrestling coach and comes over here a fair bit to coach him, out head coach is good friends with Paul and he introduced him to kenny. The seminar was run at leicester shootfighting, its the second one they have held there and its normally open to non members so ill post on here next time they hold one Yep he taught the same thing, use the hand to judge distance for the shot
