Why I Prefer Dating Women Who Are Martial Artists

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussion' started by Subconscious Sailboat, Apr 24, 2021.

  1. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    Try this link: Placebo Use in the United Kingdom: Results from a National Survey of Primary Care Practitioners
     
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  2. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award


    Interesting study, of note:

    "Several impure placebos were used frequently by at least a quarter of GPs. These included non-essential physical examinations (54%, 95% CI 50 to 57), positive suggestions (52%, 95% CI 48 to 55), non-essential technical examinations (31%, 95% CI 28 to 34), conventional medicine whose effectiveness is not evidence-based (26%, 95% CI 23 to 29), and antibiotics for suspected viral infections (25%, 95% CI 22 to 28).

    These arnt placebos is the accepted pure sense.

    I'd like to see what the prescribing data says, as far as I know, you can't prescribe placebos (in the pure sense) in primary practice, (the systems don't allow you too) and you can't order them in from general pharmacutical stockists.

    I've not seen any in six odd years of analysing primary care prescribing, and just the once when part of hospital drug trials, for over a decade.

    In hospital when running trials we've had to order them in from abroad, which was a large undertaking, due to the legislation around it.

    I'll see what I can find that's upto date.
     
  3. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

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  4. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award


    Rereading this, 1% of GPs in the study said they prescribe a true placebo regularly.

    That's not many, although it is a number it's a statistically insignificant one.

    I'm still interested on how they are getting a legal supply though, they don't appear in the drug tarrif, and arnt available from the two main pharmacutical distributers, I wouldn't imagine any chemist is going to order a special item for free and loose a lot of money, they also can't be electronically prescribed, so that just leaves a private hand written script, fulfilled by an in-house dispensing doctors.

    Which is all sorts of dodgy.

    Interesting.
     
  5. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    1% give pure placebo at least once a week, and 12% have given at least one pure placebo in their career, so between these two figures lie the percentage who regularly give pure placebos less frequently than weekly.

    But almost all GP's who responded to the questionnaire have given impure placebos during their career, and 77% give them weekly or more.
     
  6. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    GPs will have several hundred script items per week, having 1% of them give an actual placebo weekly, isn't a large percentage and doesn't mean it's being used widely, and as I've already said, the method they use to get that placebo tablet is in question, chemists can't just relabel tictacs.

    The "impure placebo" is just general doctoring, patients want antibiotics you give them paracetamol, and say it will help they feel better, as the study comments say, many of the GPs disagreed with that term and felt it misleading.
     
  7. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    It could be 10% of GP's giving pure placebo every other week, which wouldn't be insignificant.

    Annoyingly, I can't seem to copy/paste from the link, but your paracetamol example doesn't cover the kind of impure placebos listed.
     
  8. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    It would be covered by :

    conventional medicine whose effectiveness is not evidence-based (my emphasis, for the complaint).


    Right since just asked a mate whos a GP.

    In his opinion as a qualified GP for 8 or so years,

    A) actual placebo sugar pills, shaky legal / ethical ground, everything has to be labeled up correctly, and most chemists wouldn't touch it with a barge poll, also The most popular GP systems don't even list them, so you wouldn't be able to do a script.

    B) placebo injections, big no-no, if you had an infected injection site for an unnecessary injection, you would get in big big trouble.

    C) the big one is giving people saline nasal sprays when they have a bad nasal cold, or ibuprofen etc for sore throats, it makes patients feel valued and keeps the ABX usage down which keeps the CCG happy.

    So C is using the placebo effect in a way, but not in the way you seem to be applying it.

    But that is just one GP, I know they can be quite different in there approaches.
     
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  9. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

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  10. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award


    That's spot on, really good criticisms, under the original studies definititions, all off label prescribing would be a impure placebo, which is plainly rediculous.

    Thanks for posting!
     
  11. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    And, as they point out, even the pure placebos could simply saying "have you tried aromatherapy?" just to get someone out of their office.
     
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