Vaccination status affecting martial arts relationships

This is very sad and I do understand your reasons. Your friend is probably also frustrated everyone tells her to get the vaccine, when she's probably quite against it. To be honest, I quite don't understand the fear some people have of vaccines. I mean, we got vaccinated with a ton of different things in our life already, haven't we?

It is hard to see any way you can resolve the situation Unless you give in and practice with her, which is probably not the clever decision, or someone forces her to get vaccine.

For me, here our government is trying to force people to get vaccine and it is going to become mandatory for people 60+ and people in health care. For now people without the shot can't go to places like restaurants and free time activities. So although I do know several people who didn't want the vaccine, I am not meeting them at the moment. Well, mostly. When teaching karate to children, I do feel a bit worried there as children weren't vaccinated and covid is spreading in schools, so we started wearing masks for that training at least. As of now, all my trainings are inside and without masks, but we try to avoid practicing in pairs. Though honestly, I am not sure if that would actually have much of an effect.

At first I was baffled why some people wouldn't want the vaccine. Mostly they said due to reasons that were hoaxes. Some people didn't want to discuss it or said they wanted to leave it to their immunity, not get an atificial one, etc. But I have just given up discussing it. The result of these conversations wasn't positive and no one would get the vaccine just because I thought it was a good idea, obviously. And I thought I should probably respect everyone's opinion as much as I want mine to be respected. It not like I can do anything about their decision anyways, as anyone who wasn't really against it would be vaccinated by now, so there's no reason to argue with them. I guess I just won't see them for the time being when they can't go much anywhere ...

It is a pity it has gotten you into some situation. But you probably can't do much about it except avoiding practicing with her. She should respect that decision of yours, at least, if you try to respect hers. And you can pray she'd be somehow forced to get the shot, I guess

 

It is very awkward and I feel for your dilemma.

I have tried debating with people who are against the vaccine and I have never heard a good reason for not getting it.
No one ever says they are allergic to it or immuno-compromised or even needle phobic. Those reasons I can agree with.
It's always selfish nonsense like "the virus isn't that bad", "I lead a healthy lifestyle", "it's a liberal conspiracy", "it's against my freedom", etc etc.

To be honest I'm finding the divisions and "tribes" in culture/society impacting more and more. They seem so much more front and centre.
I know my instructor voted for Brexit and is an ardent Tory (conservative) for example and that causes me some internal annoyance. I have to push those feelings down to interact with him and in day to day life he's a good bloke.
I know some people who are anti-"woke" and anti-PC. I have to ignore the memes they share.
Relatives who are very right wing.
Some things I can quash and move on but some stuff really does give an insight into their characters and that insight is not pleasant.

Can't say I have an answer though.

I think the base rule in martial arts, and it must be a sacrosanct rule as far as I'm concerned, is that you must only train with people you feel safe and comfortable with. You must be able to set boundaries, enforce those boundaries and have people respect those boundaries.
If training with this person makes you feel unsafe then you shouldn't train with them in the same way you wouldn't/shouldn't train with someone who made you feel unsafe because they hit harder than was agreed, cranked submissions, didn't respect the tap, sparred in an unsafe manner, had poor personal hygiene, were too aggressive, rude, etc.
I don't see this as any different to that really and if she was truly a friend she should respect that.

 

I think a little empathy is in order. You said yourself that you were initially hesitant to get vaccinated, so this person just hasn't had the realisation you did, and possibly they have been misled by the widespread and worryingly successful disinformation campaign aimed at any mitigation efforts against this global pandemic.

Make your boundaries clear, and accept that it might permanently sour your relationship, but being angry and judgemental will only be detrimental to you and probably cement her decision even more.

 

The politicization of Covid has done amazing things for tearing apart families and friends.

a few months ago I started a training group. We meet in the park and train outdoors . I insist that all participants be vaccinated, and I delayed starting the group until that became possible. I have two students, and I really enjoy our training together.

my son, age eight, received his second vaccine dose yesterday. YAY! Getting him vaccinated was the final hurdle in my mind, and while I believe we are a long way from being done with the pandemic and we all still need to exercise cautious behavior, I feel like I can breath easier now.

my younger brother continues to resist getting vaccinated. He and his wife won’t do it, and won’t let their teenage daughters get it either, although one is nearly 18 and will be able to do it on her own soon. And we have two other brothers and a sister-in-law who are medical doctors but we can’t convince him to get vaccinated. I just don’t understand this. It isn’t a political agenda. My agenda is simple: I would very much like for my brother and his family to not get Covid and die or have long-term health problems from it. That is it. It isn’t about making a political point. And this causes tension within the family, it feels like something we need to tiptoe around. It is very frustrating.

i guess this just became a rant, but yeah, I understand your feelings.

 

It's a bit of an impossible situation though, as the disinformation campaign has made compulsion and stigma part of their propaganda. The more these people who've been duped by crazy libertarian billionaires, and grifters who've hopped on the gravy train, feel pressured into getting vaccinated, the more they will resist.

 

People often decide things in an emotional level, and when they do, it's very hard to change their mind on a rational level.

Lots of people have found this time very hard, and sometimes people try to feel less anxious by deciding against all information that it's not real and everyone else is over reacting.

Denial isn't just a river in Egypt.

Unfortunately I don't know how to approach this in family and friends, so I've just cut them out without telling them, and when this is over, I can forgive/understand them then, but until then, I can only control what I do personally, and limit the risks I can.

 

That can be very tempting to do, but my fear is that it may deepen rifts and make them more difficult or impossible to repair. I’m trying to just keep things calm and keep communication lines open, we have a family Text Message thread that we all banter back and forth on. We tend to avoid certain topics, but with the holidays coming up, people are making decisions whether or not to get together. I live halfway across the country so I won’t be there, but my other brothers are making decisions about if they will gather, or if so, under what conditions and with whom. We flew back to visit the family last summer, the kids were not yet vaccinated so we were careful about who we stayed with, only adults who were fully vaccinated. We visited with others but kept it outside. We visited with that brother even though it was a drive out of the way for a couple hours each way, but I wanted to not give the impression that we deliberately wanted to avoid them. We have had some tense exchanges, and I just didn’t want anything to add to a perception that we were slighting them. Especially because we live far enough away that we never really got to know their kids as they grew up, but I don’t want anyone to believe it is because we don’t want to. We want to keep the door open. We are all going to need to dig deep and let our frustrations go, or our families will be truly torn apart.

 

The problem I have found is largely that it isn't about the vaccine.
It's about being on one side or the other of the division that is happening.

I can understand people having legitimate reservations, but as people have noted it is always related to very false information.

It's not left or right politics, it is to some degree understanding of science, but it seems to be largely a tribe thing.

Did want the vaccine? Ok then make sure it test, wear a mask, socially distance? But no, there are reasons for those also.
For some people it is there way to "stick it to the government", others are brain washed by their favourite platform (podcasts, actor, band) who hold an opinion against it.

When was the last time anyone wanted to find out information on up and coming movies, or music from a science journal?
No one ever does.
But science from your favourite pop star? Sure send all the meme's and they will take it on board.

I also think that the more you try and openly change peoples opinions on it, the more they stick to their guns.

I know far too many people sharing nonsense actively trying to convince people against it, but also those on the fence. Many who I spoke to about it, but didn't try and change their mind, but then they did and got the vaccination.

 

As far as training with non vaccinated people goes , smitfire said it perfectly.

 

the karate lot i play with are just starting up contact training. As i get paired up I shall politely explain that I will only train with vaccinated partners. If they are non vaccinated I will politely excuse myself.

 

Something I don't understand, well at least not beyond concern for family members such as @Flying Crane stated.

But if you are vaccinated..... why are you so concerned about those that are unvaccinated? And before anyone asks, I got the J&J vaccine and my symptoms were basically a bad head cold. However a colleague at work got the Moderna and he too caught Covid, but his symptoms were more like a case of the flu. Not saying any vaccine is better than the other, I am saying it depends on the individual.

Although I do know from personal experience, being vaccinated does not mean you will not get covid.

Also we need to take into account there are those that, even though they are high risk, it is not medically advisable they get the vaccine. I do have a friend who has an issue with cardiac inflammation, and his cardiologist advised him to not get the vaccine, since a side effect can be exactly what he has and in his case it could make it much worse.

 

Good questions.

As you pointed out, it is still possible to get breakthrough infections even after being vaccinated. When that happens, you can pass the infection to others, including those who are at high risk, and they could have a bad outcome. However, the risk of this is lower when you are vaccinated, so it protects others around you. It is also a good reason to keep wearing masks whenever in public indoor places and in outdoor places where it is impossible to keep distance between you and others.

my sister-in-law is fully vaccinated, but got a breakthrough case from my nephew, who is too young to be vaccinated. She had a bad outcome in spite of being vaccinated, and ended up in the emergency room. She is fine now, but it was scary for a bit. This just illustrates how scary this disease is.

furthermore, when there are populations with low or no vaccination rates, the disease continues to spread widely and rapidly. Every time that happens, it is another chance for the disease to mutate, and it does mutate constantly. Most mutations are meaningless to us, but some, like delta variant, are bad news for us. We need to get everyone vaccinated for the safety of us all. It is absolutely possible that we could end up with a variant that spreads easily, causes high rates of severe illness and death, and evades our current vaccines. This would bring us back to square one, with a completely unprotected population, with a super-version of the virus. This is absolutely possible, and this is what we must avoid. The best way to avoid this is to get everyone vaccinated (very important: everyone internationally, because there are regions of the world that have almost zero vaccinations yet) because as long as the virus continues to spread relatively freely, we are all in danger of the next mutation. We all need to be vaccinated, and even then we all need to mask-up and keep a level of distance between ourselves and others, until the virus is truly stamped out. These are the best tools that we have so far, but we need to look at this as working together to protect each other. This isn’t just about the individual. It is about all of us, we are in this together.

And yes, there are those in the population who have genuine health problems that prevent them from getting the vaccine, such as allergies to the ingredients. It may be that those people are unable to be vaccinated. So once again, the rest of us need to get vaccinated in order to protect those who are more vulnerable who legitimately are unable to do so. We need to work together, we are in this together, all of us.

 

That I agree with, thank you

What I am running into a lot are folks running on fear that have no concern for anyone else and they are also creating yet another division in this country (USA) between vaccinated and unvaccinated that is being highly politicized and becoming as big a division as we have between right and left and republican and democrat which just leads to more arguing finger pointing and blaming all while getting absolutely nothing done. I am running into this online and in the real world. I guess I am just getting fed up with all of the fear, accusations, derision and division

 

We have cases of Omicron in NYS and an interesting statistic was given by the NYS Commissioner for the Department of Health today. 99% of all hospitalization are the delta variant, 1% is omicron.

And I have serious doubts that you will ever reach a true global heard immunity.

 

Yes I agree. I don’t understand it. It makes absolutely no sense to me. The vaccine is free, it is safe, it is easy, it is effective and it protects you and those around you, from a disease that can kill you, is killing people around the world, or can leave you with serious health problems for a long time. Why someone would refuse such a thing makes zero sense to me, I simply cannot fathom the decision.

i actually heard someone say, “I got the vaccine, but I got it under Trump, not under Biden.” WTF does that even mean? If they hadn’t gotten it before Biden was in The White House, then they would not have gotten it, because somehow it had changed at that point? The politics around this are astronomically bizarre.

We need to keep up the messaging. Giving up is not an option.

 

Yes, omicron is still new in this country. It may become more widespread because it is considered more contagious. The fact that so far, it seems to be less potent, leading to fewer cases of serious illness, is good news for the moment. But if it is more contagious and evades the vaccine and continues to spread quickly, then it opens the door to a mutation from the omicron variant, that is more potent and leads to more serious illness and more death. We need to keep looking down the road to where things can and perhaps are likely to lead. We cannot let our guard down just because a new variant is not yet shown to be potent.

I agree that we may have missed our chance at true herd immunity. Because we could not collectively get our act together and behave with caution, the virus has spread far and wide. That horse has left the barn. Because we are selfish idiots.