Now, this is quite interesting in a lot of ways, so please don't ignore it or rush to judgement. There's a lot to unpack here, and there are multiple episodes already released, with more to come. So I'm going to ask everyone to keep their comments to the particular video, in this case episode 1 I'm sure many MAPpers will know of Sensei Seth, Icy Mike, Raaaamsey Duey etc, and like me will have found much to value in their youtube content. These guys are pretty well respected, come from a variety of backgrounds, and can all walk the walk to some extent. Bringing them all together for some sort of competition is clickbait heaven, but add in "self defence" and you have a clickapocalypse. I think I just invented a new word Ultimate Self-Defense Championship | Episode 1 - YouTube I like what they are starting towards, and I hope they develop more in future vids. Watching this first vid makes a few things clear IMO. Years ago, getting two blokes to do 20 press ups whilst you shouted at them, then they jump to their feet and fight, was considered self defence training. We've moved a long way since those days, and now if you want your training to be considered realistic it has to include a much wider range of situations than, "you and the bloke on the bus decide to fight for no reason and with no other factors." So I look forward to the development of this series, and we'll discuss subsequent videos in later threads, but this one left me thinking, "Yes, you've changed the setting, which is interesting, but there are so many other factors you've ignored." I think there's lots more to say, so I'd love to hear the thoughts of my fellow MAPpers
Really enjoying the videos so far. My thoughts... The guy who appears most "skilled" (Jeff Chan/MMAShredded) and with the most "fight" experience seems to be doing well. His skills seem to transfer into arenas and scenarios outside his usual MMA/BJJ world (but not always!). In the clinch in particular he seems pretty calm and collected and naturally seeks, and finds, dominant positions and strikes when the opportunity is there. Think his higher level of fitness helps too. I predict he will do well (but probably not optimally) in pretty much every scenario due to that good overall "athletic" base. Being able to control and operate in the clinch seems a pivotal and foundational skill. Some form of clinch/upright grappling seems to come up very often and if you can't fight in that area you are gonna have a hard time no matter what the particulars of the scenario/s are. Size counts! The bigger dudes (Seth, Rokas and Ramsey) seem to be having an easier time of it in some areas. Icy Mike would (on the surface) appear to have the most "real" experience (ex cop and all that) and I was looking forward to how he approached things. But I think, sometimes, he falls into wanting to entertain or do weird stuff rather than, perhaps, doing the most optimal approach to something. The bus scenario was really interesting but missed so much of what makes something "self-defence" rather than just "MMA on a bus". Now being able to do MMA on a bus is a valuable skill but I would have liked to see some different parameters like designating attacker/victim, assigning "escape" as a victory condition, maybe being able to hold out for time and minimise damage could represent help arriving or the attacker fleeing before help/the law arrives? Stuff like that.
Yeah, I think if it was actually self defence scenarios, rather than having a good natured spar on a bus, we might have seen more interesting stuff from Mike. It's still fun, and obviously there's self defence crossover from scrapping on a bus, but the rules of the competition are almost diametrically opposed to sensible self defence training. I'm sure it would be much less profitable if you could win by avoiding a fight though. Icy Mike made a good point on his channel; that tactics change depending on the context, and stalling on a bus could be a good tactic because criminals tend to have a limit on the amount of time they have eyes on them (again, begging the question: what is the context? Why are they fighting and what are their respective roles?).
... also a shame they couldn't get any women to participate. It's a very macho and 90s representation of "self defence".
This comes up much more in the subsequent videos though. Maybe the first bus scenario isn't indicative of the series as a whole? As there are other drills (which we can discuss when we move onto later episodes) where avoiding the fight is the primary goal or one of the ways to "win" in that drill/scenario.
I think perhaps that's a by-product of the Youtube-sphere? What female martial artists are there as prominent on Youtube as the guys in the challenge? And would they be able to fly to Australia for a couple of weeks to participate? I'm struggling to think of any much to my own shame. As it is I'm completely unfamiliar with one of the 6 as it is (the Reality Check self defence guy). This has made me realise I don't follow any female martial artists on Youtube and I'm sure I'm missing some good content as a result. This will be rectified! At the end of the day they want eyes on the video and to feed back viewers to their own channels. It has to be entertaining and walking down a street and going another direction when you spot a drunk guy ahead isn't going to sustain interest in the same way as fighting on a bus. I think it'd be ace if they got someone like Michiel Mulder from Urban Combatives Netherlands involved!
Actually I just put "female reality based self defence" into that there Youtube and the results are not good. And Hard2Hurt/IcyMike is very prominent even though he 's a guy as he's done a few videos on female self defence.
So in a one on one encounter that gets physical we learned 1 Size matters 2 Aggression matters 3 having good clinch skills matter 4 if you are on the bottom get your legs involved and ideally between you and your opponent Gosh It's like the lessons we should have learned from early MMA and Gracie in action videos On a serious note at close range protective gear hinders your ability to use your best weapons at that range (elbows, shoulders and especially the head) Said safety gear, especially the head guard make the situation fairly unrealistic especially at said close range If a sharp pointy weapon had been deployed at any stage people would have died and quickly Stylistic differences go out the window and everyone looks the same (only difference is those with more experience look sharper and more composed)
They're having a lot of malfunctioning going on with the head gear. Falling off, getting rotated or lifting up, etc. Part of me thinks that hinders performance but part of me thinks that adds in some way to upping the difficulty and, in some ways, replicates things like reduced or tunnel vision or getting hit or compromised. Even things like having clothing pulled up over the head (which can't happen with what they're wearing).
True but my main issue is it takes away your ability to use your head to strike, At the range their are at it's probably your best weapon, along with your elbows I think the ability to use and do damage with those two weapons would have changed the dynamic a lot.
I would be very interested in seeing an Urban Combatives guy in free sparring against actual fighters. I don't follow them a lot, but I've only seen drilling against HAOV attacks.
I came to post about this, I thought it was some good exposure to the idea of self defence training, but mostly concentrates on the part were both (assuming it's always 2 which is also a flaw) are expecting to engage, rather than a large part of self defence which is the interview up to the point of violent engagement. So putting that aside, the physical combat in various environments (I won't talk of the other episodes) is similar to the HIP show and car Jujitsu style events that are around. It is a good indicator of what still is needed in any situation once things kick off; a whole range of skills, experience with those skills by practise under resistance, observation of surroundings and how to adapt to use then to your advantage.
