My thoughts exactly! Do i need to say more...?! It's something that you just know, there's no math formula for it... Thkz VFarias
This conversation is getting dangerously touchy-feely! I have no problem with the Tomiki/Shodokan gang would love to try their stuff out sometime. There is often the danger that aikidoka will play the "There is no competition in aikido" card as a way to make sure that no one ever tries them out to see if their stuff works. It then becomes a passive-aggressive game of one-upmanship to see who is most in touch with their key and can elicit the most cooperation from their uke, in my opinion. I find that some healthy doses of judo randori (or even call it aiki shiai and then toss them by their hakamas and choke them out) are great for keeping this problem from going unchecked.
Budd blame Dave for giving KickChick the moves ... One of the best things about Ki Aikido is that it must be done correctly to work due to the fact that it is so soft. As soon as nage makes a mistake (assuming uke is a decent uke) it becomes blatantly obviouse not only to nage but to uke and anybody else who happens to be watching. Although we don't have the randori that other styles have we do have four-man-attacks which all students must complete as part of their 1st dan grading and the number of attackers increases for 2nd and 3rd dan. It might not sound very realistic but it does the job of showing how much each student has realy developed.
I did Judo when I was younger and always used to end up being paired off with this massive 6ft guy. At the time I was very young and only 5ft at best. I used to get picked up and slammed on my back every single time. I admit that was along time ago but I still have a cleare recolection of what it was like to get pushed around.
I must disagree with this set of mind, that is, i'm glad that there's no competition in Aikido, and honestily why should there be? Why people always want to put Aikido on the test? Don't they trust what they're practicing? Don't they trust the techniques? Is this the way an Aikidoka puts in practice Aikido out of the tatame? I'm not from the Green Peace, but pacifism never did hurt anybody, did it? If O-Sensei was beside you right now, or if you were one of his ushideshi, would you talk like this in front of him? I doubt it! I'll be glad (although i can only speak for myself ) if in my whole life, i never use what i learn in Aikido to hurt another human being...!!! I do agree with randori, but let's not get obcessed by it! Thkz, VFarias p.s. i'm not been sarcastic but i was a kickboxeur, why don't you try it, it will give you another perspective...
personally i dont belive that there is a "true" akido, they are all alike and all diffrent in some way or another, ive faught against many expreicned akido teachers, ive never found the style its self very impressive... for instance in 1997 in the WMMA tournament (world mixed martial arts) witch took place in korea, i faught a grandmaster, proabably the best ive ever seen in akido altough he did shatter my arm as soon began to use keens and elbows he quiclky lost any advatange, witch is for the most part true to any akido scholar.. to every style there is a counter style, in akdios case moui tai is begnning to be a very anti akido style in the types of drilles and even the way you train some would say "tank fu"... pain is just weakness leaving the body in that case, once your pain tolorence is to the point were you enjoy it then akdio becomes very pointless... altough i would like to add not everyone is as deranged as myself..
Ok... let's see if i can make myself clear... first of all i think that there's no true or false Aikido, for me Aikido is Aikido, despite the different styles. I know some styles of Aikido have competition, but in my humble opinion, if O-Sensei thought it was necessary to have competition in Aikido to make true a Aikidoka, he would have said it in his enoumerous books, or he should have left that information with his son or the present doshu, Moriteru! I think this is not the case. True Aikido is what O-Sensei did, period. O-Sensei's ushideshi that decided to incorporate other features in Aikido, made it at their own will; i don't believe they were instructed by O-Sensei to change some features in his teachings of Aikido. Notice that this styles appeared after O-Sensei died... Hope this helps... Domo Arigato, VFarias
To begin with, gradings and/or training in the dojo have nothing to do with competition, unless you think that when you're taking a grade or training, that uke and nage are competing... i see it from a different perspective, that is, they're teaching each other Aikido! Don't get me wrong but that's almost like saying that, because you can't see the wind that it does not exist... nevertheless you can feel it! Don't you get to test the techniques you've learned in the dojo? 1st thing we agree... LOLOLOL!!! yes, that is correct, but that doesn't mean they had competition among them or towards O-Sensei, trying to be better than him... 2nd thing we agree... Last but not least... I left Kickboxing... altough it's like riding a bike you just don't forget it! Be cool, VFarias
Your logic is faulty on a number of levels and, frankly, I think it's attitudes like those listed above that give aikido a bad rap amongst other martial artists becase of the 1) Double-speak 2) Passive-aggressive sense of superiority AND 3) Slanted historical interpretations to justify one's stance. 1) Double-speak. You say, "first of all i think that there's no true or false Aikido, for me Aikido is Aikido, despite the different styles." Then you say, "True Aikido is what O-Sensei did, period". You can't have it both ways, either you believe one or the other. I suspect many might believe the latter, but for the sake of being politically correct, at least espouse the former when it's convenient to do so. My own feeling is that arguments regarding who has the "True aikido" or the correct interpretation are what's been causing the divisiveness between aikidoka for far too long. And if it's anyone's blame then I feel that the ruling bodies at the aikikai have attempted to overcodify and extend too much control over something that should be evolving, rather than dying the way it's doing in so many places that have lost martial relevance in their practice. I understand when O-Sensei died, actions needed to be taken to preserve what he started, but look at the recent H. Saito split and the betwee-the-lines bad-mouthing that's been going on between inter and intra-organizational shihan. Just do a google search and read interviews and you find plenty of finger-pointing and general inconsistencies. The fact is that O-Sensei created something that he wanted to grow and evolve. It's telling that in his lifetime the Yoshinkan, Shodokan and Yoseikan aiki-related arts were developed, with his blessings. Those that deify him and profess that only at the end of his life did he find the real truth are grossly missing the point, in my opinion. That type of logic only serves political and pseudo-religious factions, not personal development, intra, inter and otherwise. 2) Passive-aggressive sense of superiority. When kickboxing sparring and judo randori are brought up, I hear, "Oh, been there, done that" and "You never forget how". Well, newsflash folks, those skills are like tools, if they aren't put to use they eventually get so rusty that it takes a lot of work and polish before they're of recognizable use. I say this from experience in both arenas and it's something, through crosstraining that I'm certainly going through right now. Whever I see or read the "We win without breaking a sweat", I get the urge to hip-throw and armbar someone. The sentiment is nice, if you're strictly talking non-physical interactions, but here's another newsflash, when it gets physical, you will likely sweat and you may even bleed. Pretending otherwise is pure foolishness. 3) Slanted historical interpretations Talk to enough folks that were there when the split came between Aikikai and Tohei and you'll get some interesting perspectives. You'll also probably have a hard time really believing in the Aikikai as a purely benevolent organization. If an Iwama aikidoka starts blabbing at you about O-Sensei only finding the true aikido at the end of his life and Saito Sensei being the only true recipient -- quickly hit them with a shovel. It will make you feel better and be a good life lesson for said other person. I'm being facetious . . . or am I? My recommendation is to do some research from various accredited sources and don't always believe everything you're told. It's called common sense. That is all for now.
Hi Budd, i'm not going to comment nor quote your statements, you're free to express what you think and that's why this is a democratic forum. This conversation is useless from my point of view. I apologise for my behaviour. Goodbye, VFarias
Hi VFarias, Please remember, I'm not trying to offend you. If I come on strong, it's simply because I have strong feelings regarding certain matters. I apologize if I appeared to single you out or personally attack you. It's not my intention. Best/Budd
