You dont know how to post links, i dont believe that. just copy and paste the link address. il have a gander tonight after ive been to taxi school.
Practical technique in my experience never looks as pretty as anything seen in a demonstration. It's also less clear cut with respect to what one would call the technique. For example a practical technique might start as something like a kokyu nage, become and ikkyo and end something like a nikkyo. Practical technique is something spontaneous and unpredictable. Something that genuinely works because the opponent at the time was unable to counter. I think that's something that comes with experience and dedicated study and not something that can be taught in any dojo where everybody is playing the same game.
Yeah but training against a committed, forceful attack has got to be better than handholding. Hasn't it? The handholding and lack of atemi are two of the biggest steps to making Aikido ineffective. The Bear.
thats if you see grips as the only way to train in aikido. Plus the grips are there to make the body strong when moving, if you dont practice them and some who knows how to grab asa restraint is going to casue you big problems. just like if you dont learn atemi, but in ki-no-nagare moves there is not a lot of atemi, but you shpould still have learnt when to use atemi.
have a read of these articles if you have the time. ive never found articles as good as these, ive been reading them for years, they come from a real old school iwama deshi for the hell days of the 70s, he has translated from the chief's words of training levels. they explain alot of why we grip in training. and atemi http://www.iwama-aikido.com/levels.html http://www.iwama-aikido.com/offense.html http://www.iwama-aikido.com/resist.html theese come from www.iwama-aikido.com its a very good site ,theres plenty there to read
I wouldn't say it was better. But I would say something is definitely lost when atemi and committed attacks are dropped from the training. In particular I think by dropping atemi and committed attacks many students fail to develop decisive responses to threats. I hold that opinion because in my own experience, the students I have trained with who could produce the most effective technique on demand have all had experience of living in rough areas. Even if they hadn't been in any actual fights, they all seemed to have a more immediate and effective intuitive automatic response to a punch in the face. In contrast however the students from more affluent areas seemed to be a lot more casual about their technique, saw Aikido as a hobby and never really seemed to learn the lesson of a black eye delivered at the end on an atemi. In my opinion it's the attitude of the student that produces effective Aikido. And I think to forget that is the single greatest step one can take in producing ineffective Aikido.
well said aiki, agree 100% its all down to each persons own personal aikido. 100 people can learn exactley the same thing at same time and only 1 may be able to use it.
Sorry Dento I must disagree 100% If only one in a hundred students can make the technique effective then it is the TEACHER who is ineffective. This ocurs when the interest is in attracting as many students as possible even if it means making the training "user friendly".Martial arts have become a commodity rather than a life long effort. That one in a hundred should leave the club and find a group with the same spirit as himself. I was there during ,as you put it, the hell period of the seventies , and the emphasis was on aikido not numbers, politics or personalities.These are what produce ineffective aikido. regards koyo
nonsense! If the techniques are correctly taught they should work for everyone learning them. If it only worked for 1 in 100 then Aikido would be a complete waste of time. Where do people get these ideas from! The Bear.
Hi wolfie. I agree that the attitude of the student is THE most important element in his training BUT he MUST be given proper direction by the teacher.I have seen so many students train in aikido sometimes for years only to leave simply because the "teacher" had stopped learning and had been teaching ineffective technique. I had one karateka come to my club after he had visited an aikido group and was told "we don't do kicks or punches here!!" What was the teacher teaching? regards koyo regards koyo
I completely agree koyo. There must be a teacher, student partnership. Both need to play their parts. I would also agree with Bear. If Aikido only worked for 1 in every 100 people it would be worthless. The point I was really trying to get across is that the student has to be willing to learn. The best teacher in the world with the best training methods can't force a student to learn if the student turns up willy nilly and stands there holding a conversation for half the session. When I was talking about attitude I meant the student really genuinely wants to learn and is committed to learning 100%. When the student isn't 100% committed then it becomes a hobby, a pass time, a social event.
Again nonsense, almost no-one can be 100% committed. People have jobs, kids and partners. All that matters is the mindset on the mat. If the environment is there with serious study in mind and the instructor has good control of the class then everyone will get something out of it. The Bear.
Perhaps then you need to learn to let go of the days distractions when you're training? Nobody should be thinking about their dinner when they're performing or receiving technique.
I think you are BOTH saying that time on the mat is precious and should not be wasted. I have gotten into the habit of stopping a bit early and standing at the side of the mat and allowing the students to teach themselves.This is a good practice because they tend to figure out how to employ what has been shown during the session. regards koyo
So you guys are saying that if that even if the teacher is a great teacher not just a great martialartist ,its a guarantee that all there students will be able to use there tech? totally nonsense. yes a good teacher could turn more students into compantent MAs but its still done to the student to have the intelligance to make a tech work in the street. a good teacher can not guarantee anything, thats what im trying to get across. that last part about your class is a n excellent idea, its something that is demanded in iwama, jukeiko-free training. after class you should go back over thngs again or different thingss but owrk with other people to find the tech. the only thing i would agree with polar is that its all down to the persons mind set on the mat. without that even god aint going to teach you anything that you can translate into your own langauge.
If he is a good teacher and the student has the desire and spirit to accept his direction then yes the student shall become an effective martial artist. If the student does not have the commitment and spirit to endure the sincere training he shall leave. True martial artists shall always be in the minority. It is better to have a small class of dedicated students who continually "push" each other than a large class of hobbyists.Constant sincere and demanding training outwith the "comfort zone" shall create effective budoka. A good teacher CAN guarantee two things. You shall become an effective martial artists or you shall leave.If he asks you to stay on when you do not have the desire and spirit for the training then he is deceiving you. Martial arts are NOT for everyone. regards koyo
Never a truer word spoken. Martial Arts today are too much about ego massage in the guise of humility. Personally I don't have a problem with hobbyists, It is a great British tradition and has lead to some of the greatest military inventions in history. However even a hobbyist must have a serious mindset to their hobbies. The Bear.
