Actually, the main 'Cons' to ALL of these systems listed herein, is that they, as arts contain so much information, techniques and stylisations, that they overcomplicate 'Self-Defence' to the point of being an 'Art'. There is a fundamental difference between 'Martial Arts' and 'Self-Defence'. Whilst the practice of Martial Arts can and often does equip its practitioners to become better at protecting themself, often they merely assist the practitioner in becoming better at 'Martial Arts', but not necessarily better at 'Self-Defence'. Taking a guesstimate, I'd say that probably 10 percent of what most Martial Art Systems contain, is immediately relevant to 'Self-Defence' and the other 90 percent consists of techniques that are either for usage against practitioners of the same art and/ or techniques to counter other Martial Arts (example Hapkido Counters to Judo throws). For immediate usage from a Self-Defence POV, any 'system' worth it's salt, must contain realistic answers to Habitual Acts of Violence (HAOV). As an example, (becoming a bit of a cliched question now), but, 'If you knew that you were going to Prison (let's hope not) in thirty days, what would you train in? Kata, stance work and etiquette or learning to smash things with hard parts of your body, emergency tactics etc etc?' Those thirty days would be immediately relevant to 'Self-Defence', everything after would be veering towards 'Art'.
You have to try to understand it....it takes a little bit of thought to get around normal martial arts paradigms
yeah, i agree, but my point was that the training could save your life just as easily. you just have to be able to judge what you need to do to survive. if they do, youre safe. i usually dont wear it on my wallet anyway. i wear it on my wrist or hip. anyway, mine is plenty strong enough for the grappling stuff, and it is heavy enough to cause serious pain, but not to do the damage that a kusarifundo would. also, you can put a carabiner (mountain climbing clip thingie) on each end to attach it to the belt or beltloop. THEN it is heavy enough, not to mention the fact that you can quickly clip it to something heavier, if you see someone coming(and you are willing to do that much damage)
Mental toughness and heart If you want to survie If you want to survive a street attack you have to have the right mind set and not freak out.Also you have to have the heart and willingness to use what you have learned. I know a lot of martial artist that are skilled but would freak out if they where attacked.Train your mind as well as your body
If you were going to supplement your striking art with one other, which one would people choose? Ju jitsu, judo, BJJ, san shou, aikido or something else?
Judo or Wrestling would be a good supplement as they cover stand-up Grappling and Groundwork, albeit in Stricter forms, dependent upon the Rules of the Sport. Most BJJ you find is almost totally Groundwork Orientated. Apparently Alot of Gracie Schools are more Self-defence Orientated whilst maintaining the same Training Methodology. I've only ever trained at Schools that were Points/ Sport-orientated, but would love to train at either a Machado or Gracie School, cash-willing. JJJ is a great Art, but often the training methodology is lacking in a certain amount of realism, this is in part to the fact that if you could apply some of the techniques against an attacker, then they would indeed be Very Nasty. Problem you face with mixing JJJ with a Striking Art, is that because Japanese Ju Jitsu is a somewhat 'Complete' Art, alot of the striking methods can detract from the striking art that you are already practising, depending upon what it is, also the Principles of the two may well inferefer. San Shou would be a decent option also. So alot of it depends upon the Striking Art that you are doing, as to what add to it. Don't neglect Sombo as an Option, also.. Thread Returns to Original Form...
Many thanks for such a comprehensive reply, SoKKlab. I primarily have a Thai/kick boxing background, but have recently branched out into jun fan/JKD. I had been weighing up whether or not to take instruction in a seizing, locking and throwing art for a period, so that I at least know something about it for self-defence. Options locally are BJJ with a black belt from Brazil, very traditional Japanese ju jitsu, and a Shaolin school that includes chin na as part of its curriculum. From a self-defence point of view, I would be interested in which would fill the gap. (Although my JKD class includes some locking, etc, and I tried judo as a kid and didn't overly enjoy it, even though it's certainly effective.)
I'll post my thoughts on Kuk Sool Won: Pros: Very effective at trapping (standing grappling) range, with joint locks, joint lock throws and joint breaks. Very active "self-defense" mindset. KSW System is "open" in that you can find an instructor who will focus on grappling or boxing within the Kuk Sool Won system. Cons: Many schools do not focus on grappling. Emphasis on variety of traditional weapons at higher levels, few of which can be employed in a street fight.
I know this is a bit of thread necromancy but it's an interesting thread (and doesn't have all the styles on it really) My thoughts on Wing Chun (at least my teacher, who does Judo and JKD as well) Pros: Focus on defense turning to swift attacks and simple methods of trapping as well as knocking the other person over Cons: Lack of locks and grappling techniques, leave you a bit unawares against the more aggressive attackers
I'm still a complete noobie at Judo, but I'll answer anyway. If more experienced Judoka want to shoot me down in flames, them at least I'll have learnt something! Pros: strong on stand-up grappling, throwing/take-downs and ground work. Techniques can be tested against a fully-resisting opponent and can be tested in a competitive environment. Cons: the absense of striking means that in terms of self-defence, it is focussed on a very limited part of the bigger picture.
Wing Chun for me (based on my personal observation and experience) 1) Pro's= The WC that I am learning has opened my mind set to more than just the "fighting" aspect of the martial arts. I have now come to the realization that on the streets ANYTHING goes. Often your attackers will not want to "fight" you per se but OVERWHELM you. I.e dirty tactics/unconventional methods. Multiple attackers, weapons, ambushes, etc. So in training I often stress the fact (to myself) that I am not training to be a "Champion" or to be a guy with ego/over confidence to win fights and such but, to be a smart guy who avoids isolated areas especially at night, be aware of my surroundings, and to do my best to not escalate things with people. HOWEVER, if the sh1t DOES hit the fan, I will do EVERYTHING and almost ANYTHING to survive the encounter, evade and escape with my life and ensure my loved ones survive and are also safe if they are with me during the incident. And/or if that involves fighting so be it, but if I fight I will fight dirty and not care about rules of engagement. Since its my life or theirs, cuz on the streets the aggressors are not going to feel sorry for you as you lie there on the ground dying, in fact they may feel obligated to continue the attack by stomping you in your head as you lie there semi conscious or unconscious. You do no want to be on that ground like that... Cons= Wing Chun to me is a martial art yes BUT, it is also a life style. I had to learn the hard way and now realize that you cannot just practice the principles of Wing Chun in the class BUT, also everyday and everywhere in your life. And I don't mean technique only. But also the way you address people, the way you present yourself, the way you observe your surroundings/environment everywhere you go, and of course the way you train at home outside of class... Unfortunately many students of various W.C systems do not realize this so they are trapped in a mind set of "who's better at fighting, who's better at Chi Sau, who's art is better, who's the toughest, etc etc". It has taken me many years to slowly get away from this thinking, and I am still learning it even now. Basically the art of fighting without fighting ehehe. I.e "fighting is a last resort, but when you need to, do it with all your heart/mind to survive"
Hello SoKKlab, I have read your post here and have found your views very interesting. I will say that I agree with many of your point but only on a “short term basis”. If someone only has 30 days or even a few months to train I agree that a large part of traditional – classical training should be modified in order to face a potential foe. However, I have been training in the aspects of classical martial arts that you seem to discount here as having nothing or little to do with self defense have proven to be very useful to myself and others. I believe that there is a point that a martial art becomes a science of self defense (if practiced correctly). Pure self defense, what is this? If it is a QUICK solution it is buying a big dog and an alarm system for your home. It is using good common sense, avoiding bad situations etc. Let’s face it there are no short cuts. If one only has 30 days to prepare for a horrible situation (and it is a rare thing to get such a notice) time and money would be better spent on pepper spray or a hand gun. I train because I love it not because I am looking to get into a fight. I am able to defend myself however because I train in a classical martial ART. I do not feel that I have wasted ANY of my time doing so.
