Possibly the most shocking UFC event ever Since the words "Spoilers" and "Results" are in the thread title, we don't need the tags Matt Wiman def. Michihiro Omigawa by Unanimous Decision at 5:00, R3 Christian Wellisch def. Scott Junk by Submission (heel hook) at 3:19, RD1 Jeremy Stephens def. Diego Saraiva by Unanimous Decision at 5:00, R3 Rich Clementi def. Anthony Johnson by Submission (rear naked choke) at 3:05, R2 Tyson Griffin def. Thiago Tavares by Unanimous Decision (30-27, 29-28, 29-28) at 5:00, Rd. 3 Lyoto Machida def. Kazuhiro Nakamura by Unanimous Decision (30-27, 30-27, 30-27) 5:00, Rd 3 Jon Fitch def. Diego Sanchez by Split Decision (30-27, 29-28, 28-29) 5:00, Rd 3 Forrest Griffin def. Mauricio "Shogun" Rua by Submission (Rear Naked Choke) 4:45, Rd 3. Keith Jardine def. Chuck Liddell by Split Decision (29-28, 29-28, 28-29) 5:00, Rd 3. Yes, really. Griffin beat Shogun who looked like absolute crap. He actually gassed after the first Jardine looked good against Liddell too. I don't know exactly what's causing Pride fighters to come over and be soooo crappy in the UFC, maybe it's the adjustment, maybe they just miss Pride, I don't know what it is, but I've never seen Shogun even close to gassing before
shoguuuuuuuuuuuun! how could you??? to be fair, forrest is a cardio machine, but for shogun to gas out like that, man, that suxmajor... i'm now re-thinking if he is my fave killer at 205.
Hahahahaha, I had a niggling suspicion Jardine would win but didnt want to say anything for fear of sounding like a Troll/ being flamed silly.
Not a bad card overall but not the best... I was a bit dissapointed with so many "decisions" in the televised matches. F. Griffen had a great match with Shogun and I have to sort of go along with the OP's sentiments. I've only watched the PRIDE matches they show on TV and never really followed it. As a UFC-guy sometimes it's dissapointing to hear all of the buildup of these PRIDE fighters (which I've seen very little of) only to have them come in and take a top spot (sometimes even main event) and then perform like crap. I wish the UFC would make them do a few undercard fights with some jobbers to let them get back into the flow and be ready for the top level. Then again, maybe it's just UFC trying to show how much better their fighters are (yes, even the reality show ones) compared to the so-called "top guys" of PRIDE. The main event was really good and I enjoyed the match. I was rooting for Liddell but even I saw the look in his eyes when Jardine put him down... what a rough loss for Liddell. I hope he comes back (either that or he can have Rogan's spot at announcing).
I enjoyed the card also, but it wasn't the best I've seen. I think one of Chucks problems is he never changes strategy. He does the same old thing everytime. He needs to change things up a little, Couture uses a different strategy for every fighter. Jardine was very smart in this fight and out scored him in the last two rounds.
shogun had to have been sick. he normally never gets tired. i don't know how he got gassed in the 2nd round like that.
The Tavares Griffin decision was a sham, yet again proving that 10 point must ****s over good grapplers...
I was so ****ed off on shogun's loss and even more ****ed that he lost by RNC, a BJJ blackbelt from chute box losing by RNC? who would have thought... and as of Liddell....from the looks of it his performance it seems like his time in the UFC has passed its prime.
I don't mean to brag...but I picked both upsets here for MMAplayground. Shogun looked horrible, if you ask me it is a result of Pride fighters halting their use of steroids resulting in deteriorating performance. Thats not all though, I also think guys like Couture and Forrest are using HgH and other steroids that can be used without being detected. So what you have is a completely natural Shogun fighting a superhuman Forrest Griffen. Not to say Shogun+roids would have won last night as he was horrible from a skill standpoint as well but I think he would have been able to go the full 3 rounds without gassing
Ah, Apotheosis, how I've missed your "glass is not only half empty but poisoned and covered in pond scum" attitude. So your overall theory is that only American fighters can get the "good" 'roids? Just how does that work? How does Crocop, one of the top-paid fighters in the world with government connections in his own country, not get the same stuff that Forrest Griffin, who two years ago wasn't even on the radar & has spent the last three years living in someone else's home, presumably consumes? Isn't it possible that Forrest trained properly while Shogun took him lightly, and/or suffered some sort of undisclosed injury or illness before or during the fight? Isn't it just slightly possible that Crocop went up against Gonzaga & Kongo with poor strategy? Isn't there the remotest of possibilities that Herring simply got out of shape before his deput (and apparently forgot how to sprawl)? Good fighters can loose to opponents they're supposed to walk through, and going off of steroids doesn't have to be the cause. For a boxing example, Tyson lost his title to a 13:1 underdog in Japan. Serra beat GSP, Jardine beat Liddell. In the early days, Randy lost to Vitor, who was being heralded as the new face of the UFC. Back when Pride was still alive, Arona and Little Nog lost to the unknown Sokoudjou, and Crocop was KO'd by Randalman of all people. And can you please tell me how steroids relate to cardio? 'Cause that's what Shogun was missing. Steroids are supposed to increase muscle growth & recovery, right? If anything, they should have a negative effect on endurace. I'm pretty sure Mark Coleman would concure with that. Lastly, I think it's a bit insulting to the fighters to assume that they have to be on something to get anywhere. Oh, it's certainly possible, but after seeing the "All Access" shows on Randy & Forrest, I'm more inclined to say that they are simply very disciplined athletes. If they were taking HGH, there'd be telltale signs, like an increase in their skeletal structure. I can think of two cases (Barry Bonds, pro wrestler Big John Studd) where there was an observable increase in the size of their head. Again, I'm not saying it's impossible, but you'd think someone would have brought it up already. Bottom line, it's entirely possible to be an Olympic-level athlete without juicing. Give credit where it's due.
Remember the good old days when the common wisdom was that PRIDE fighters were far superior and that the UFC ran a distant second? So much for the common wisdom. And is this just the year of upsets or what? Nothing seems to make sense any more. Have to say I enjoyed the show.
thats what i said! NOTING makes sense anymore. watching crocop lose to c level fighters twice in a ROW! has driven me closer to driving forks into my wrists and jumping into the river than anything!
Steroids GREATLY increase rate of recovery so it seems perfectly viable that they can seriously improve cardio. I find it more than a tad suspicious how many of these fighters claim to do grueling 3 hour workouts, twice a day, 6 days a week without falling flat on their backsides from overtraining. I'm not one to speculate without proof so won't point fingers but i believe they are more prevalent than many would like to believe.
I'm gonna stay away from the steriod subject as I don't know much about that stuff. For the Main fights my thoughts (not necessarily who I want to win) on the results Fitch defeat Sanchez Shogun defeat Griffin Liddel defeat Jardine Wow was I surprised Fitch vs Sanchez I remember seeing Fitch fight ages and thought that guy will is an up and comer, I saw a couple of fights and kept an eye on him. When I heard he was fighting Sanchez I already know who would win and he did not disappoint. I think Fitch should fight someone like GSP or Parysian (spelling) to see how good he really is and to prove himself to everyone. Liddel vs Jardine I thought that Jardine would be destroyed as he is a good but not great striker and I was wrong, he has a very akward way of fighting and can make him very hard to hit and his round house kicks are amazing and they took there toll out of Liddel. I think from all those kicks Liddel took made his striking was not as strong and less likely to knock out Jardine. I think Liddel has been fighting one way as it worked for a long time he does not know how to fight differently. Shogun vs Griffin I like Griffin because he seems to have a good work effort, his first fight with Bonner and he always makes me laughs in his interviews. I have never seen Shogun fight but he was defeated some good fighters and has a great rep so I was worried about Griffin. Wow Shogun looked very mediocre and Griffin defence on the ground was great and his Cardio is what made him when the fight. When the ref stopped fight the next thing I knew I was off the couch going yeah, come on Griffin I don't know if Griffin has what it takes to be Champ but if he keeps the positive attitude and style of fighting then he really has a chance. Overall it was a good event and I enjoyed it.
I prefer to look at it as reality He trains and lives in Croatia, he doesn't have access to the chemists that a guy like Couture or Bonds has. Forrest trains with Couture, he has been described as Coutures "protege". Certainly possible, but I sure find it odd that all these Pride fighters forget how to train hard when drug tested. I actually am of the opinion that Mirko lost both fights not because of steroids but because he doesn't want to fight and his body is beat up. Yep, there is a remote possibility of that. Absolutely, and I didn't think Shogun would walk through Forrest. However a Chute Boxe fighter gassing in 6 minutes? Just look at a picture of him now and back in the Pride days, he has gotten smaller. I'd be happy to educate you on how performance enhancers can increase your cardio. There are a couple of ways that I know of and I am no expert on roids so there are likely much more. 1. Increase muscle recovery- With roids you can go out and work out more strenuously and more often leading to an obvious increase in cardio. 2. Non-steroid enhancers that can increase your bloods oxygen carrying capacity. Have you heard of the Tour De France? Perhaps the most demanding endurance sport out there and it is also heavily ridden with performance enhancers. Discipline doesn't allow a 44 year old man to stop time in it's tracks... In regards to his head, check out his recent pics and compare them to his old ones. It has grown and changed, I don't have any hat size numbers but feel free to check out his closet. It is also very possible to be an Olympic level athlete while juicing. Can you honestly say that you do not believe there is a performance enhancing problem in the UFC when you consider these factors? 1- No test for HgH which experts say has replaced steroids 2- Fighters often go 3 or 4 months without a test, allowing them to cycle off drugs before testing. Some drugs could even be used up until a week before testing without being detected. 3- Huge motivation for people to use them $Money$ 4- The HW champ is 44 years old, even Barry Bonds is not the MLB batting champ. The guy is as fast and strong as ever, odd since he seemed to be declining before he retired.
Just because there is a drug-abuse problem with *some* athletes in MMA does not mean that there is a problem with ALL MMA athletes. I can rattle off any number of legal suppliments which would mimic the effects of steroids but aren't steroids. Hell, I take them. I should own stock in GNC with all the crap I buy from them. As for the PRIDE/UFC debate, I don't know the answer. I don't know if it's money, or maybe thePRIDE guys just aren't taking the UFC seriously, or maybe, just maybe, some of them are falling into the trap a lot of foreign athletes do, and letting stardom get to their heads. Why do we always assume the worst?
Yeah... there are no freelancing chemists roaming around that part of the world. No illicit labs, no smuggling of any kind, no roids, no drugs... it's an absolute desert.
wanna bet!? the right combonation of supplements and diet, can easily give you near illicit substance results.
