Sparring advice.

Discussion in 'Tae Kwon Do' started by Holgate, Sep 8, 2003.

  1. Holgate

    Holgate New Member

    I have just come back from the Scottish nationals in which I entered (for some reason) the ladies yellow belt sparring.

    Now my sparring is shocking, I'll be honest about it. I don't like being hit or hitting anyone for fear or hurting someone or being hurt myself. Part of it comes from the years when I did Karate and entered a tournament in which I was kicked and recieved a bad cut to my ear and side of my face...it's something bound to scare an 8 year old girl.

    But anyway I was just wondering if anyone had any advice on how I can imporve my sparring...unfortutanly I can't make tournament training with my own club as it falls on a saturday when I referee football (soccer) so I was wondering if there were any steps I could take at home to improve my chances. sparring is something I want to get better at even if it is just for self defence.

    Just so you know I train with the TAGB (Tae Kwon Do International - basicly ITF) and we work on a point stop sparring system so what may work in WTF may not necessarly work in my form, although any advice which can cross over would be good.

    Any advice is greatfully recieved.

    many thanks

    Holgate (aka Nik)
     
  2. KickChick

    KickChick Valued Member

    The only way that you can improve upon your sparring is to spar consistently.... you learn by doing. It helps to spar with an advanced student with the understanding that they can point out your weak points.You need to approach sparring with a strong and positive mental attitude. Pay no attention to past "mistakes" ... visualize and relax.
    Its too bad that you cannot make your school's training session... I believe that would help you out immensely but maybe someone can get together with you outside of class.

    On your own you can work on single techniques ...concentrate on specific form and technical problems, master single techniques before you put them into combinations.

    Do combination work on a heavy bag to see what goes together well, and what techniques are effective. It's very effective in training your positioning when doing sparring techniques makes you aware of your distance and timing.

    Also....
    I see this happen alot with new sparrers ... don't stop after you land a good strike or score a point, follow up!! Also goes visa versa.... if you get hit, don't stop to access damages get that point back with a quick counter-attack.

    If you lose remember that is part of the process of learning.

    Think positive! Beat the pain mentally and you can go on forever.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2003
  3. flyingblackbelt

    flyingblackbelt New Member

    i a couple pieces of advice for you. One, master your techniques and foot work thats obviously the best way to become more proficient at sparring, and if you can manage to pull off a few techniques that few people can you have a big advantage. Two, get your front leg fast, thats one of the biggest things i worked on and its definately payed off. try kickboxing it helps. Three, try learning defensive sparring. Let your opponenet get tired and just make sure you dont get hit, when you see an opening take it. Defensive sparring is much harder to master then offensive sparring because you have to learn how to read your opponent better and you have to learn how to react. believe it or not one of the best things i can tell you is to keep everyones advice in mind, but dont really follow it, you have to find your own comfort level with sparring and thats the only way you will be a good fighter. you must spar enough to bring yourself to the point where you no longer need to think when you spar, thinking takes time so get yourself to the point where you dont really have to. Train your mind to have include sparing techniques in your reflexes and you ll be much better off for it, but this takes years of training to get yourself to that point. and finally, never underestimate your opponent or over estimate yourself, go into every sparring match like your life depended on it and make sure you do your best this way it will truly come down to skill. relax, it takes time. I consider myself a decent sparrer(dont think thats a word) and these are really the "rules" i follow.
     
  4. jokl

    jokl Valued Member

    all the above advice is very good. a good way to be more relaxed while sparring is to get a sparring partner (someone who you are comfortable with and who can also push you as well) and spar with them (outside of classes, squash courts are handy). Sparring outside of lessons means you can agree to lower the intensity of sparring so that you can experiment, overcome your fears and also improve your control.

    of course this won't make you a complete sparrer (for one you need to try and spar as many different people as possible to gain experience (your own club, other clubs and tournaments are good ways to do this) but it may well help you be more relaxed about sparring.

    For point stop don't stop when you think you've scored, keep going till the referee stops you, 'playing to the whistle' they call it in football.

    happy sparring!
     
  5. Holgate

    Holgate New Member

    Yeah is a pain about not being able to get to the tournament training, I believe my diary for refereeing this year will allow me one saturday off a month so I can at least go once a month, really better than nothing.

    KickChick: Good advice there. I can pretty much work with all of it. Only problem we have with our form of sparring is that when a point is scored, we are literally stopped and then have to start again not allowing us to get a counter attack in. I personally really don't like the point stop system because just as you get a flow going and score you have to start again. I would go more for a continious 3 minute round system which is then scored by the three referees in and around the ring. It allows for a bit more freedom in the match.

    I have learn't one thing from the past weekend and that it to keep things simple because they are often the moves which gain the points...simple things like perfecting side kicks turning kicks and front snap kicks. Watching Becky Riggs in her fight against Louise Fisher I realised they both used simple combinations to gain their points, seeing them fight was something, both were strong and both fought well.

    I am certinally going to give some of the indivdual techniques a go as well as work on my flexibility (something I lack at the moment due to a very stiff back, getting it sorted with any luck). I also know I need to over come that fear of getting hurt or hurting someone else but I think that will just come with time and practice...that or I should get out and take a few more falls on the skateboard ;)

    Thanks so far, anything else anyone comes up with is more apprechated :)
     
  6. Tosh

    Tosh Renegade of Funk

    He he, one of the things that I try to drum in to my stpdents.

    K.I.S.S. = Keep it super simple

    or if they continualy get it wrong

    K.I.S.S. = keep it simple, stoopid!

    Sorry if all this advice seems overloading!! :D

    Most Important Lesson in Sparring ever!!!!

    Develop your guard... as you already know, from being a ref, if you don't score you don't win. If you can ensure that your opponent has no oppurtunity to score then the best they get is a draw. Beginners always tend to leave exposed areas when attacking either immediately after the attack or just before it is initiated (either through telegraphing or other body language).

    Use this to your advantage and counter spar opponents. Let opponent attack and safely block or avoid. Then unlesh your salvo when they are most vulnerable.

    A good exercise you can do anwhere is to get someone to throw hand technique (slowly at first) around your head. Slowly build up confidence about what lands, what you can block/avoid and increase speed. Then include feet and concentrate on defending only for 2 mins. Once you have a solid defence to rely on revert two you can then concentrate on your attacking game.

    Good luck and don't let failure get you down. Here's a brilliant inspirational quote!

    "There are defeats more truimphant than victories"
    Michael Montaigne
     
  7. Holgate

    Holgate New Member

    strangely enough I don't mind losing if I lose fairly...but then that's like anyone. As long as though I feel as though I have learn't something then I come out a winner in a way.

    from this past weekend I have learn't I need to improve even if sparring will never be my strong point, now have to build on that
     
  8. Tosh

    Tosh Renegade of Funk

    However, make sure that "not mind losing" does not fester and settle as complacency.

    I had students who refuse to improve, because they don't mind losing so what's the point in improving.

    Keep the mind keen and competitive even if it's only in competition with yourself. Life is short and before you know it your turning around saying "was that my best".

    Winning in comps is not the be all and end all, but what about your personal battles?

    Don't take this as heavily as it comes out, needing some self motivation of my own right now :D
     
  9. Holgate

    Holgate New Member

    nope your right it shouldn't be a case of not wanting to improve. I'm someone who dosen't mind losing if I know I have done well and improved because of it...saturday I knew I hadn't done well and needed to work on it.

    I can take losing if I know I have done better than before it's about winning the battle against myself and not a physical opponant.
     
  10. djhallib

    djhallib Guest

    One thing no one has mentioned is the physical part of sparring.
    Being from WTF I can't really give you any other advice, but since this subject has been left untouched, I will touch it.

    Being at the peak of your physical state helps alot with sparring. Being faster and stronger is always better, never worse. Any spare time you can put into weights training, plyometrics and speed/reflex drills is time well spent for sparring improvments.

    Perhaps, this doesn't need saying since it's pretty much common knowledge. Just in case, here you have it. For any further advice on this subject, I recommend the "Health and fitness" forum here.

    As far as sparring-technique goes, decide on 3-4 attacks/combos that you can and want to use in sparring, and then drill these over and over and over and over again, doing it absolutely perfect everytime, despite speed and agility. Then improve the speed and strength of the technique.

    Make sure that you can throw your offensive techniques even if only your eyes see the opening, not the mind. Offense is also a reflex if you train it hard enough.

    Once you get your 3-4 attacks as near perfect as you think you can get them, add more techniques to your arsenal, but be careful not to "overstock on weapons" :).

    That last part has been said here before with a bit fewer words, but I hope it helps. :)
     
  11. Stewart

    Stewart Valued Member

    All of the advice above is excellent. I am also a member of the TAGB and attended the Scottish. One thing I will add is always take something away from a defeat. Having been on the end of a defeat myself, the area I look at is how did I get beat. Was it a close fight where I was narrowly beaten or was I kicked of the mat? Take it away and build on the areas you feel need work. If your instructor was watching the fight, ask him / her where they feel you could improve. USe the senior grades in the class to learn from

    Also, as you progress through the different belt levels within the TAGB, the tournaments will change from point stop to continuous. The Scottish was unique for the TAGB competitions as all levels of belt fought in the point stop category. The other fixtures for the year (English / Welsh / British) will have both depending on your belt level.

    This means that you may need a different 'fight plan' when you step onto the ring. Your preparation should really be focused around the type of fighting you will be doing.
     
  12. Holgate

    Holgate New Member

    don't quote me on it but I do believe the TAGB are planning to go fully to point stop sparring, I was in the Northern Irish this year and it was run that way for all grades there. I think this is how things will be going. It seemed to cause a bit of contention between the long established members of my club who had known a continuious system.

    Having done karate in the past I find continious to be better because it allows you to get attack after attack in...or even defence ;) so I hope the TAGB dosen't go the way of point stop for everyone.

    as I say I have learn't something from it, the fact that I need to improve my sparring hugely. I may not be a natural to sparring but there is alot I can do to make it better than it is.

    So you planning to go to the anniversary event in October?? looks like it could be good fun.
     
  13. mattsylvester

    mattsylvester One proud daddy!

    Hello Again

    That is great news! Point sparring is a great discipline as it is far more crowd pleasing, the techniques have to be cleaner, and it doesn't rely on the tickcounter method LC does (a lot of points can be missed because of the number of clicks need, kick to the head, then body followed by a blitz of 3 scoring punches is 10 clicks, not counting the counter techniques on the other hand).

    Ah, but unless the fighters are very clean and technical (and even then! :)) it can get really scrappy. It also means that those with less skill can use more force. I used to see at least one knockout a division in LC when I was with the TAGB, and plent of nose bleeds.

    Perhaps a better option would be to allow people to choose what they want to fight in?
     
  14. Holgate

    Holgate New Member

    Now that would just make too much sense ;)

    I would go for that though, at least a choice would be there :)
     
  15. flyingblackbelt

    flyingblackbelt New Member

    Holgate said:
    Having done karate in the past I find continious to be better because it allows you to get attack after attack in...or even defence so I hope the TAGB dosen't go the way of point stop for everyone.

    Id really have to diagree with you there, especially at the lower ranks. When you launch attack after attack you have a tendency to lose technique and for the lower belts they need to be concentrating on making their technique the best it can be. Also, when you go crazy throwing techniques you just get sloppy, you come in with your hands down, you start to cross your feet and screw up your foot work. You must finess an opponent, get them to do what you want them to. Its a much more satisfying victory.
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2003
  16. Tosh

    Tosh Renegade of Funk


    Really?? I have to disagree that where TKD is concerned (fully padded) point-sparring is not crowd pleasing at all.

    I've rarely seen a TKD competition go above 5 points in 3 minutes of sparring let alone in one 90 second round!!

    Just personal opinion but point sparring takes some of the excitement about setting up techniques and tends to sow the process down to a crawl.

    Atmosphere is a really big problem unless you've got 2 evenly matched competitors. Just my opinion mind.

    Speaking as a ref people rarely score more than 2 techniques at a time that can be counted.
     
  17. jokl

    jokl Valued Member

    If the TAGB were to move to point-stop only wouldn't they be shooting themselves in the foot in terms of international competition (run continously) ?

    just a thought
     
  18. TKD

    TKD New Member

    Holgate, I would just like to point this out. Point sparring and continuous sparring are not anything near real fighting. Therefore the only thing sparring is going to do for you in a self defense type manner is teach you how to string together techniques without thinking. Most things that you do in sparring would not be advisable to use on the street.

    Also, someone mentioned how they'd rather do continuous sparring over point sparring. In my opinion continuous sparring only leads to bad habits, such as, rushing someone throwing straight line techniques at you. When continuous sparring you tend to forget that if you were sparring that person full contact or in point sparring, you would not be moving in to attack just because you can hit his head five times with your hand before he can kick you twice. In either point sparring or full contact sparring the person doing the afore mentioned scenario would be DUMB.

    That's what I think.
     
  19. flyingblackbelt

    flyingblackbelt New Member

    i definatley agree with you tkd
     
  20. Tosh

    Tosh Renegade of Funk

    But as you've already said sparring is not self defence so whther you do point or continous neither are appropraite for self defence purposes.
     

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