How long did it take for you to get your black belt?? The reason i'm asking is my wife and i started Hapkido a few months ago and we are wondering if its reasonable to have a rank worth transfering in four years time. My wife is in grad school and when she's done we probibly will move for her job. Mr. Cather if you read this your imput would be appreciated.
"Transferring" a rank school to school is based solely on the rules and regs of governing bodies and schools. If you get rank in an IHF school, and then move and train at a WHF school, the instructor is not bound to recognize your rank. Most of the time, instructors will recognize the rank and allow the student to wear their belts in class, but will make them learn the curricullum of their new school/governing body. This is more true when it comes to black belts. I have new students that sign up all the time that want to maintain rank from another school. I ask them what governing body it is under, do they have their certification, and who was their instructor. I verify their rank- not that i don't trust them, it is for their safety- then if the curricullum and training is dramatically different from mine, I allow them to start as a beginner or maintain their rank with the understanding that they will maintain that rank until they have not only learned my curricullum, but put in the time and effort to really embrace it and the training. If they are a black belt, they should expect a long wait anyway, a newbie will obviously learn the lesser requirements quicker. Good luck and enjoy your training. Don't let rank and its pursuit color your training. Focus on the information and techniques and the rank will come on its own.
no we aren't doing Hapkido for the rank but she's started at a couple of different schools and is discouraged to be a blue belt after 3-4 years training in martial arts due to moving a lot.
Nice posts above! A lot of it depends on the individual school, how many times you attend per week, and how much work you do outside of class. It also depends on how often a school tests/promotes. Beyond that, as a generalization, most Hapkido schools I have seen tend to promote to 1st dan within 3-5 years. Attending class 3-4 times a week and working hard, I would imagine she could earn 1st dan in 4 years. Earning a 1st dan in Hapkido is a good accomplishment and not a bad preliminary goal to set. Once she has her first black belt, generally I think she'll find it easier to tranfer into other schools and pick up on what they doing and learn quicker, regardless of whether they "recognize" her rank or not. Best of success.
Hello all, I have to agree a bit with all that has been said. I believe that if someone comes to my dojang from somewhere else, I allow them to wear whatever belt they come with - its a belt, and saves me having to give them one. I tend to have a different mindset about the notion of what exactly a blackbelt is however. In my opinion, a blackblet is a novice who understands the arts principles, and a few techniques, and can take a breakfall. I have seen many examples in Korea of blackbelt given out in one year with training 5 days a week - because they have a realistic notion of what being a first dan means -that person is still a novice. I think that if you and your wife train and get blackbelts, they are yours forever in the sense that knowledge cannot be taken away from you. As someone that has trained, anyplace you go that is worth their salt and not just out for grading cash should recognize your rank - and even if they request you start fresh with their curriculum, should allow you to move MUCH faster that a standard beginner, and should infact see what techniques are common so that the ones you do not know get more concentration. Hope my rambling makes sense.
Hi Nick, Good question and good responses. I pretty much follow what my instructor did when he had people come in with previous martial arts experience. Colored belts keep their current rank then learn all of the material and then test to the next rank. Black belts wear a brown belt with a black stripe (Black Belt Candidate) learn everything up to 1st Dan and then test for 1st Dan. This is what I went through when I started Hapkido because I was already a 2nd in TKD. I'm still a little confused about your question. Are you concerned because getting a blackbelt from me won't be easily transferable to another school? In the past we belonged to a less well known organization the IKF (International Kido Federation). But, since my instructor has stopped teaching regularly and I've started there has been a disconnect. Hopefully everything will be resolved in the future. I'm not sure how many IKF schools there are but I know there are some. Are you worried that after you leave here that you won't be able to find a Hapkido school that has the same curriculum as me so you'll have to start over again? That's a valid concern because our curriculum is pretty uniquely ordered, but hopefully if you do find a good school they will recognize your skill level. I can't promiss anything but if you guys continue to come to class as often as you do, you will progress very quickly, we've just to get over the "Basics" hump. I'll try to bring this up tonight after or before class.
ya maby i should explain it a little better, where we did Aikido it takes almost 2 years per Kyu (gup in Korean) and LONGER for Shodan because they test once a year and you wait until next testing to recieve rank. We aren't by any means looking for a "belt factory" we both think Mr. Cather has a great curiculam but we don't want to train for years and years to be a "yellow belt" do you know what i mean? i think i got the idea of what a blackbelt means you can look through my posts if you want
Black Belt I received my 1st thru 4th dan Black Belts in Hapkido from GM Ji. The 1st Dan came after about 4 years. When GM Ji closed the school California I joined ICHF. My 4th Dan was recognized by then Master Pellegrini. I waited the required number of years for time in grade and eventually was promoted to my current rank of 6th Dan. But since leaving ICHF last year, I don't see a 7th Dan in my future since I made the decision to become independent and not belong to any association or federation. I would have been eligible this year, but with all the politics and unhappiness I was experiencing, it wasn't worth sticking it out.. Besides, my students respect me for who I am, not my rank. Bob Ingersoll Defensive Arts Academy Seaside, CA 93955
Just curious master Bob, how do you plan on keeping further development of your own techniques going? Will you just train on your own? Follow seminars? Are you still in touch with a teacher?
How long to get your black belt? How long to get an advanced dan grade? It is very difficult to ascertain just how good someone is anymore by what grade they claim to have. Years ago when I was a lad if you had a brown belt in judo or Karate you were invincible and highly respected. Nowdays people can bounce from one organsiation to another picking up dan grades like they are lollies. You can even create your own certificate, print it off and claim the rank! As silly as this sounds, it is happening. So what makes one art better than another? What makes my qualifications better than yours? Nothing. We have arrived at a point in time now where we must physically see you demonstrate your skills and hear you explain why you did this, or what you would do there etc. Taking someones word when they say "I am a 7th degree black belt" is no longer a gurantee of legitimacy, credibility or indication of skill and experience. I have a very good friend who cross graded his TKD grade for a Hapkido grade. Is it right, fair, honest or a reliable indication of time spent in grade or skill? That is for you to decide. All that I am saying here is that unless you have impeccable credentials, and these have been documented from day one in the open, where everyone knows who you are, this grade issue cannot be relied upon. There is a 20 something year old 7th dan advertising in NZ as I write. He must be really good? Lets pick him............ I would not worry how long it takes to get your black belt my friend. As long as you are proud of what you have done, you feel you have achieved something, and it was all worth while. Because someone else will always be a grade higher, and claim to be a step quicker and have a better Instructor than you, such is the nature of the beast. Be proud, stand tall. All the others? What others......... Gan Ba Re.
Train for yourself. I have trained on and off for 15 years. All kinds of styles based on where I got moved to for work. At first I was frustrated due to starting out again and focusing on belts. After a while though I realized maybe I had learned a good lesson. My training was for me. I also learned alot of differences and what works for me. At one point in TKD I even found it funny as the teacher did not transfer belts but I could be a yellow belt and spar with the BBs with ease. 15 years and I still dont have a BB. Oh well. At the same time if you are there and you have a good school/teacher, dig in. You may get the Dan but at worst you will learn a lot. Thats cool. p.s. I now am settled and really going to focus on the HPD program.
Greetings I know this will sound bad but, How did you train with Ji until 4th and get promoted to 6th dan by someone who probably had a 10th of your skill in Hapkido. Makes no sense!
Greetings People who train until 4th with Master Ji plus some other stuff can probably spend years refining all by themselves, or just with a little help from their piers. :love:
Well, you know Combat Hapkido is different than "traditional" Hapkido. Perhaps getting to 6th dan entailed learning other skillsets like grappling, stick and knife, trapping and other skills not covered in Sin Moo Hapkido. For me going from 2nd dan in IHF Hapkido and getting "reconciled" (recognized) in Combat Hapkido (and later promoted) involved quite a bit of learning different skills and ways of doing things, even though I found the two systems to be very close in the root operating systems. I found Combat Hapkido just a different way of expressing the core philosophies in an open-ended atmosphere where borrowing and testing other systems and styles is open and acceptable. As far as GM P goes, I've never had to fight him so I don't know how much "skill" he has in fighting, but his students sure are great people to learn from and the ones I've sparred with/trained with are the "real deal" in my book. If you can evaluate a martial artist by the students he produces, I'd say he's top-notch.
Greetings I would say he's the GM of CH 100% because it not really HKD but a type of mixture of systems. That's Ok I hav no issues with that at all. JP never paid his dues in Trad HKD that's a fact he started the Org ICHF as a 1st Dan or "honorary" 2nd dan? Next he proceded to buy his way up the ranks in order to acheive a status to set the tone for CHKD marketing. I have friends that started their own systems but learned what ever they learned and just said I'm the 8th dan and GM master of XYZ now. That's fine because he just said this is my art these are my skills and you like them or not. I have too much respect for HKD to have any joe shmoe not just JP buy his way up the food chain and claim to be a master when it's clearly a sham! CHKD may have good skills and JP may be a good MA agreed, but was founded on very unethically tatics!
The little emoticon that you used is usually only reserved for showing... um let's say "affection". It's generally not used when one man is talking about another man. The smiley or wink would have been more apt I would think. I won't comment on Master Bob's Hapkido skill level in comparison to GM P's for political reasons. I can only say that Master Bob's Hapkido surpasses a lot of higher (7th, 8th, etc.) dan's out there that I have seen.
Wow,where to start: Lets see GMP was a First or Second degree when he started CH? GMP was promoted by whom? Oh yes,those who know some one who know someone who were there heard GMP was promoted to First dan By GM Wollmershauser, or was it second Dan,just before he,GMP started the ICHF???lol. Well then how do we explain GMP being pictured in GM Myungs Book "ancient art of Warriors" wearing a black Belt?( oh yes he was allowed to pose for the picture in his TKD Black Belt,well then why is he doing the role of Uki in several pics?) I have seen video of GMP touring with GM myung,sort of a then double impact seminar,in which GM Myung has GMP demonstarting techniques to the seminar attendees,I guess GM Myung just had a high ranking TKD do the seminars??,lol. In the videos GM Myung refers to GMP as Master,did he just call him that out of respect for his TKD rank while demonstrating Hapkido? My instructor has Known GMP for around 25 years and says GMP was a 6th Dan when he left GM Myung,the videos would back this up,yet we all go by the word on the net,the same word that states that GM Wollmershauser was only a first degree under Choi,not an eigth dan,but we will leave that out. We had a student from Myungs organization a Black Belt who came and brought a picture of his Master,GM Myung and GMP all together and this Master ,who Teaches out of Virginia said he has the Greatest respect for GMP and his Organization and told his student to come train with us. I believe GMP got his first Degree black Belt in Hapkido in the mid 1970s by a Korean hapkido Master in NY,I do not have the name of the master at hand ,but it is written about in several articles and I have posted it before but I cannot find it at this time,will look and post it later. GMP left GM Myung as a 6th degree prior to founding the ICHF,he left due to increases in rates By Gm Myung and many felt they were not getting their monies worth so GMP started the ICHF. GMP as founder of the ICHF did not rank himself he stayed as a student and was promoted by Verified Masters,he was ranked 7-8- and 9th dan by In sun Seo,10th Dan . If people have a problem with GMP and his accelerated ranks,then they should contact the Masters and Grand Masters who have promoted him (9th dan in 27 years since he got his first Dan,does not seem impossible to me as there are MANY who have DEFINATELY been promoted and self promoted well in advance of GMP ranks) I can rattle off a BUNCH of Korean Masters and some Americans who flew up ranks and or were Given Ranks in arts they never trained in just to get the name of the art or organization out,I can also show articles that will disprove many claims by many so called Hapkido,or Korean arts masters and maybe put a good few holes in their stories. There are many Hapkido masters claiming high ranks they say were given them by Masters who they trained 4 days a month with for 6 months when the Master died,yet no one questions these men,I wonder why? GMP also holds black Belts in TKD,Judo and Shotokan as well,no one questions those??
