Multiple opponents

Discussion in 'Kung Fu' started by Shou Tu, Mar 4, 2004.

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  1. Shou Tu

    Shou Tu New Member

    I know this has caused controversy on other threads but here it goes.

    Realistically speaking how many opponents with your current skill level in your art do you think you can take on at the same time. your average street thug or bar fighting patron. everyday life type of opponent.

    Honestly i feel unscathed i can take on 3-4 at my skill level.


  2. shifu tiger

    shifu tiger enter my circle of death

    ya blue that's about right at your level and possibly more. i'm pretty confident i could handle 8 10 however many attack. it doesn't matter, just have alot of body bags ready with tags that say, "remains unviewable"! a shou shu blue belt is as good if not much better than any blackbelt in any other system. i'll bet good money u could take on at least 4 to 6 at the same time...... salute
  3. Andy Murray

    Andy Murray Sadly passed away. Rest In Peace.

    Many are going to flame you on this being unrealistic, unless you also provide your methods.

    Personally I've taken on 10 and had the crapola kicked out of me, so what should I have done?
  4. wcrevdonner

    wcrevdonner Valued Member

    No offence gents, but are you sure you could handle that? If three come at you at once, two for the arms and one for the legs then surely that becomes difficult? And what if they grab on to your clothes?
    Could you briefly explain how you deal with multiple opponents?
  5. jroe52

    jroe52 Valued Member

    whoa... i'll start with one.

    some advice our sifu gave us is to fight them one at a time (obviously) but doing this takes thinking...

    try to fight them from the side that single files them, or gives you a better advantage. why take 4 on at once coming at you... when you can move to the side and take them 1-2 at a time in the few second window.

    so as people close in on you some advice is to move to your advantage, put a passive guard hand up (twittle your thumbs, pretend to be cold ect... have your hands ready but not agressive), and maybe think about it and plan things out a bit!
  6. wcrevdonner

    wcrevdonner Valued Member

    Thats sounds like a sensible tatic Jroe52, might have to train it some time, however I would also add if an 'out' presents itself, then run like the wind!!
    How about you Shou shu guys, you haven't explained how you deal with multiple assailants?
  7. Xia

    Xia Dragon of Heaven

    In the level of skill, needed to accomplish a defeat for the average Joe. I'd stay roughly 4-5.Though I wouldn't beat on an old man. Frontline stradigies and tactics are key.

    For an example:4 guys are surrounding you if there is a way to run into a place where they have to fight you one on one, take it! (small alley-way)
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2004
  8. shifu tiger

    shifu tiger enter my circle of death

    blue you're right, this will just open up a huge can of worms! when we discuss this topic all the unbelivers and doubters come out of the woodwork! i for one know it works and have no doubts and will not waste time and energy trying to explain how it works. words can't possibly paint a clear enough picture. my suggestion to all the doubters is to find a fighting system that teaches attacks against multiple opponents. good luck
  9. Shou Tu

    Shou Tu New Member

    somewhat the same method as the single line and we do train that one too.

    Multiple opponents are like a pack of wolves. They dont all attack that the same time, if they do then hey works to your advantage. An out isnt an option for us, the opponents meant to do us harm all of them will get dealt with.

    to start say its six in front not surrounding you (like in the movies). you find the one that is closet to you, attack him and get him in the way of the others. and continue this manner until they are all in the ground. it doesnt matter how you do it. break their neck, take out the eyes. knock em out they tried to hurt you so its your life on the line. Key is dont go down with them. stay up and alert. Our Brown Belt Kata is a full speed, full KI Mass Attack simulating 16 opponents. as i am not there yet i have heard that it is done for real during your black belt testing.

    I would go into more detail but im running late for work. I will post more during my lunch hr.



    P.S. train with six of your fellow classmates, no set timing just have them attack you start off slow take one at a time but continous, then speed in up once one is on the ground the other attacks, but you dont know which one keep your head on a swivel. then speed it up once you make contact with the first opponent the other will attack. then you speed it up once you make contact two will come at you. But keep your head on a swivel. start out crawling and eventually you get a run.

  10. Shou Tu

    Shou Tu New Member

    Salute Shifu,

    I know alot of wont understand but im trying to be as helpful in explaining how we get there. there will be non believers but there will be more that get off here an got hmmmmmmm wonder if blue was right about training that way.

    and they will try it and if they get it they will perfect it. and then they will become more confident in their own skills and as a MAist. Im just here to help Shifu.


  11. wcrevdonner

    wcrevdonner Valued Member

    So its basically use one to defend against the others untill they are all finished. However, surely human error would mean that at some point you might make a mistake and so get taken to the floor. Does Shou Shu defend against multiple attackers on the floor?

    The one against all method is quite sound, but I would have to say that if I'm going against more than one, then if I can run, I will. I value my health (and the adonis like beauty of my face!) too much to take them all on. Only if there is no choice, and am backed off into an alley way due to my own stupidity, then I'll fight untill I have to.

    Each to their own I suppose...
  12. kickcatcher

    kickcatcher Banned Banned

    I'm about 80% confident that I can handle one agressor. Say between 30 - 70% that I can prevail over two.

    Where am I going wrong?
  13. johndoch

    johndoch upurs

    you guys talk a good game I'll give you that :rolleyes:

    So how many necks have you guys broken and eyes gouged???

    Have any of you actually faced ten opponents and put them to the ground and they stayed there. Hey I guess you guys are the supreme ultimate

    personally listening to this bull just puts me :eek: to sleep
  14. johndoch

    johndoch upurs

    I can tell you where you are going wrong.

    The simple answer is you dont talk crap like some people on this thread :D
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2004
  15. kickcatcher

    kickcatcher Banned Banned

    Damn! and there was me thinking that I might be enlightened by some mystical system.....
  16. Ninestep

    Ninestep grumpy old man

    The next time I am in California I am definitely going to visit at least one Shou Shu school, simply because you either really are being taught something that no one else has ever seen or been able to fathom for thousands of years (which I'm afraid I have to admit I find unlikely) and really is awesome and deadly, or, on the other hand the, 'average street thug or bar fighting patron' where you live is really really hopeless and could be beaten up by a hamster. :)

    As for talking a good game, I agree, a hell of a lot of people talk at the TV when watching professional sports, but you never seem to see them up there actually doing it. Funny that.
  17. shifu tiger

    shifu tiger enter my circle of death

    i agree and it's kool that you're trying to help but once before i allowed myself to get caught up in this debate and no matter what i said someone would come back and say how insane it was to fight multiple ooponents. someone actually said "what does fighting have to do with the martial arts"? that's where i drew the line. you and i know our shou shu works on several ooponents at once and the truth will always set us free. but try if you want.
  18. Samurai_24

    Samurai_24 self-own3d

    This shou shu sounds like poo-poo. You can never say that you are undefeatable. There are infinite factors that take place in any confrontation, and no one is perfect. I'm just kidding about the poo-poo part; I'm sure it is a good martial art, but to claim that you can defeat multiple opponents with 100% confidence is simple foolishness.

  19. Shaolin Dragon

    Shaolin Dragon Born again martial artist

    Perhaps I misunderstood you shou shu blue, nut your post says that you can take on 3-4 attackers at your skill level? Does that mean that the attackers are at your skill level? If so then your logic is clearly flawed - one man at your skill level should be able to give you a run for your money. 4 would clearly be impossible.
  20. jroe52

    jroe52 Valued Member

    hmm the forming them in the alley line , a straight line, or between cars so they have to come one by one was the point i was trying to make earlier (like someone else suggested)

    hmm what happens if your taking 6 people on in shou shou (sorry if i mispell it) and something goes wrong? i mean the scenerios sound like everything could go wrong if out of sync?

    if its like wing chun, then maybe you know moves/combos/patterns applicable to all situations... not limited to your forms to a certain situation (like i have seen from forms like karatee)

    example:wing chun... you learn a move/reason why your using it, and geometry ect.. then you can use it in multiple situations.

    then theres a karatee form i've seen for "if two attackers are holding your arms and one is behind you blah blah blah" well what happen if theres 3? or if one is on the side ect...

    so maybe shou shou is like the first example that it is very addaptable to situations.

    to fight opponents of shoushous like 6v1 is going to give the 6 an advantage if all equal skill, just by math.

    if it is 6 unskilled vs 1, then maybe your form will rock.

    what about 6 martial artists vs 1 shoushou? hmm... or what about 1vs1?

    the way it sounds to me is shoushou work slike the movies where the fighter fights 6 guys perfectly like it was sequenced. then i don't know much about your MA:)

    even if these people neve were in 6vs1 fights, that does not mean they could not do it. for instance, in wc we practice fighting 1vs1 against punches ect... well i know i can do it in class and feel confident i can do it out of class. now what if the shou shou guy can fight 6v1 sparring or training in classs... then it builds his confidence for out of class.

    there is a difference though between half speed practice and full speed sparring. i have only done the first part, where i can do it in theory but what if i faught 2 guys at full speed doing the same art? see in class often the instructor has you do things outside your MA. like the drunk bar guy scenerio where he throws a roundhouse at you.. then the wchunner steps, tan sao's and punches the guy. what if you trained only this way then you fight a wchunner? are you screwed? yes/no, and same for shou shou.
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