MANTIS Child Protector

Discussion in 'Self Defence' started by rne02, Nov 4, 2015.


    CPMANTIS Valued Member

    Thanks Aegis for your thoughts.
    How about we visit you and or any of your team and demonstrate in person all we do and all that is involved. At your convenience.
    From there you could comment from a complete and informed perspective.
    Also you could meet our team.
    Please also could you reply to the letters that have been sent to your team.
    Wishing you all a very happy and safe Christmas and new year.
  2. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    The thing is....release techniques, breakaways (that's what we called them when I did Hapkido), encouraging kids into martial arts, useful training tools (like the green arm thingy), awareness of self defence, creating self assertion and confidence to counter unwanted physical contact. Those things I like.

    Unrealistic expectations (an 8 year old kid can reliably break away from or armlock a large adult man), scaremongering marketing based on unfounded fears, using those fears to build student numbers to bring in more money and not actually tacking the real self defence needs of children. I don't like those things. At all.
  3. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    I agree. Companies are responsible for their promotional material.
    If it doesn't properly represent you then don't allow it out out of the building/server/printers. Simple.
    If you have no control over what goes out then your business is badly set up, you need to scale back and get some control over everything that goes out with your name on it.
    If you can't trust third parties to promote you as you would like then don't use them.
  4. Dean Winchester

    Dean Winchester Valued Member

    Well given the background of some of the people here I would say they are already informed as far as that particular technique goes. The one in that clip is only working due to the compliance of the partner.

    There are regular MAP meets that are held to raise money for charities, you could always pop along to one of those.
  5. 8moves

    8moves Banned Banned

    Again, someone questioned the legitimacy of SIMON LEE BROOKER and/or MANTIS. I have replied to the inquiry of SIMON LEE BROOKER.

    The warrant lists the revised code numbering sequence that can be looked up and you can see the warrant for arrest is for fraud. Simon drove his car into a utility pole on 27-4-2014 and then filed a false police report stating that his car was stolen. CC footage at the pub shows it was Simon entering the car, no one else. Also there are witnesses. This is fraud for 46,000 USD

    The facts can be seen here

    Select public records - incidents and enter 21404160

    These are documented factual events, all public record for anyone to view.
  6. Aegis

    Aegis River Guardian Admin Supporter

    Thanks for the information. That said, I would prefer to see this thread return to a critique of the system that has been proposed here rather than the potentially criminal actions of someone related to the development of the system, especially if there are no new pieces of information to add here.

    Can we therefore return to the topic of whether this is fit for purpose or likely to be effective?
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2015
  7. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Of course

    No it isn't it is complete shash marketed at the ignorant

    *ends thread Hannibal is 3 bottles of mead in style*
  8. 8moves

    8moves Banned Banned

    Agreed, marketed at the ignorant and fearful. I'll see if someone will put on he promotional videos he used in the states. Ominous voicing over empty playgrounds, a small child thwarting a very large man, all of the requirements to scare the wits from you and empty your wallet at the same time. You lot know this is rubbish and as soon as called to question by someone more informed than average mum and dad, he pulls videos down. Many posts, but has yet to answer the questions asked on page 1 to verify his credentials.
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2015
  9. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    8moves, are you just on MAP to pursue your agenda against this company?

    I see no introductory thread by you, just you coming on here to bash another.

    I personally don't like people using MAP to pursue an agenda and whatever opinions I may have of this company, aren't going to be influenced by your obvious vendetta. Posts like yours carry no weight to me.

    Having a discussion about the reality of a child pulling off techniques and seeing how this company defends itself carry far more weight to me. Done by people who are known for having other such discussions in their history here and who contribute in other ways, so I know they are being evenhanded in their evaluations means a lot more.

    How about you introduce yourself? Post elsewhere?
  10. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool the merc with the mouth MAP 2017 Moi Award

    As long as 8moves posts factual information I welcome his input.
  11. Knee Rider

    Knee Rider Valued Member Supporter

    Please tell me that is that guy's real name and not one you hilariously dubbed him!

    Regarding the op all I have to say is "how did I miss this thread???"

    CPMANTIS Valued Member

    If you go on to search and type Simon Brooker you'll see another thread from about 13 years ago. Wing chun dummy. Another creation. Just to show he's not new to Martial Arts. Anyway a long post to come.

    CPMANTIS Valued Member

    Let us respond once and for all and then you can get on with your comments and slating and negative feedback all you want.
    Complete shash, marketed at the ignorant? There’s a lot of ignorance out there, certainly on forums by so called informed Martial Artists, that keep their identities hidden and just comment on others creations without seeing, talking or feeling.
    Most people before learning something, at the beginning of a chosen subject, are ignorant and need to be sold an idea that can benefit them. So marketing at the ignorant is obvious. Martial arts academies already teaching for years have mostly seen it all before and are sceptical as they should be with a new programme. When they see the Mantis programme, feel it, talk to us, see what, why and how they come on board and the common phrase is “Wow, this is a no brainer!” The common phrase on a forum is “This is shash.” Lol. Normally this is from seeing the limited info online so let us address that.
    When we collectively created the interactive DVD it had a lot more detail in it but this had to be edited time and time again to please the aimed market. Mainstream schools, colleges and organisations didn’t even want the terms “martial arts” anywhere. They see it as violent and the common phrase was, “We don’t want children punching and kicking.” Now all of us should agree, I hope agree that Martial Arts is much more than that and the benefits that come from it can and should be far greater. So how do we gain more students with terms that are initially ignored with noses turned up?
    We gave a speech to a large group of students that were gifted in music, a lot of these children were picked on, they were loners, not the captain of the school football team, not excelling at physical activity. When we spoke of martial arts to help in their confidence and mental and physical ability we again got that response, are you all mad, I don’t want my child punching and kicking, they play the guitar, or the piano or whatever. We also did a test study and many parents responses to martial arts training was oh he/ she will never stick at it. The aim and end result in their mind was black belt (rather than that being the true beginning) which took years to attain or they had at some point tried a free class in a local martial arts club and they didn’t like it. We even did a study on terms in martial arts and over 80% out of a questionnaire thought Ju Jitsu was cage fighting, not gentle way as it translates but the sport that’s marketed as mixed martial arts. The opinion is ignorant and wrong.
    We wanted to introduce more and more children to Martial arts and realised that we did have a method to do it. When we approached any business with our phrases they support, help market and promote the training centre of that area and fill classes. We have one of the largest Tescos promoting through their own teams to all their customers. Also McDonald’s, Subway, Pizza Huts, B&Q’s, the list is long. Try and do this with a local martial arts flyer. Also this “come to a free class” doesn’t ever work. It entices the wanting parent but a nervous child will remain nervous and needs more than one free class to over come this. The parent that realises the long road at the beginning is a hurdle to jump also. But, 8 weeks is not only affordable but is workable with their schedule. “Hmm, an 8 week course every wednsday evening, I can do that”. It is easier to sign them up. During that 8 weeks they meet the instructors, feel the environment/ the academy, meet other parents, see other children excelling in the clubs own programmes and their own schedule is changed. They get used to the Wednesday evening class and at the end of 8 weeks they sign up to the academies existing programmes, further developing the introduced child.
    So to sum that up, we can market to more people, market in areas closed off normally, have help promoting from companies with much more experience, ability and credibility and be adopted by main stream schools because of the programme itself. Once the foot is in the door much more can be introduced. And we all know that’s needed.
    The programme itself is much more than any of you can see online. Yes some tweaks have to be made and are being made as with anything that evolves. But the techniques are just that, physical techniques. The elbow is a hinge, the shoulder a ball and socket, obviously a frame is just but a frame and has limited techniques what ever.
    There is only ever a difference of applying, instilling, teaching and learning them. The method of simplicity is just that, the method and way in which they are taught and the speed the reflex is instilled is from the method, the methods introduced to the mind from drilling, miss direction, memory games, projection and comradery promoting confidence. The techniques work because of the speed in which they are applied and this has to be seen to be appreciated. There are no locks, no bars just circular movements using maximum muscle groups at speed. The whole idea of grabbing the little finger just gives aim of focus right from the beginning and over 8 weeks when grabbed anywhere their reflex is to automatically turn against the finger and not whether its left or right or that technique or that one.
    You can say all you want behind your screen about techniques not working and that’s your opinion but the clubs onboard, the schools adopting this, the teachers and instructors that are known for not taking on board other programmes.... now are. They see this, they hear the method, receive the instruction and see how the over all intention is to help, create positivity, open doors to more members, increase awareness, offer new methods of teaching, work with larger groups and they are impressed and they agree. Even skeptics that agree to meet with us after doing so are completely happy with what why and how we do things. We have had other groups, groups that have deep routed martial arts back grounds that specialise in childrens development slate us in the beginning, just like the comments on this forum but after a meeting they work with us, understand what we are doing and why and we’ve become friends that speak well of each other.
    We have offered to meet you, we have offered to speak to you, we have sent emails to you and received no reply. So that in itself says a lot. Keep blinkered, keep anonymous, keep commenting in a negative way. This isn’t about us, this is about helping children that are not being helped. This is about educating, supplying information on support, introducing new ideas and collectively growing a group of people with the same morals that come together to support children. That we are doing. We extend the offer once more. To speak and or meet with anyone in person.
  14. Simon

    Simon Moved on Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    I think your technique in the context you are promoting it is flawed.

    I probably have more videos on here than anyone else and have left them all in the open for critique.

    I've never taken one down when they've been criticised.

    We have world champions here, very high dan grade black belts running very successful clubs, one of the top JKD guys in the world, fighters, writers, self defence experts and the list goes on.

    At our yearly charity meets we have some of the best instructors in the country, including Paralympic medalists; so before you say we're hiding behind our keyboards, or are "so called informed martial artists" I'd advise you to do some homework on us.

    Don't try to justify your work by trying to discredit others, it's a poor ploy.

    We've explained why we think the technique won't work and you aren't doing a good job of explaining why.

    You are the one taking videos down and admitting your website isn't that good.

    Big companies join because it looks good on their marketing campaigns, not because they believe a child can break free from a grown man's grip.
  15. bassai

    bassai onwards and upwards ! Moderator Supporter

    You've been invited to a meet , are you coming ?
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2015
  16. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    CPMANTIS, you come across as caring far more about marketing your product than the quality of the product itself.

    You have not addressed the criticisms of the actual techniques to my satisfaction. You say your video's did not represent your product. When are you going to put up video's that do so we can see what you say your system does accurately? To put up video's you think don't represent your product, but put up anyways, then get all annoyed at others for responding to your own video's.............well- you only have yourself to blame for that.

    Don't blame a bunch of experienced martial artists because our opinion is based on the admittedly flawed video's you put up to represent yourself.
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2015

    CPMANTIS Valued Member

    Well happy to meet any of you, your world champions, high dan grades and top jeet kune do guy. We have also worked with some. We were at Richard Bustillos Instructor conference back in 1999 (instructors only) Bought Chris Kent over to Seni along with Dan Severn and Cynthia Rothrock and Royce Gracie promoting us. As past directors and publishers of Blackbelt magazine we have worked with lots too. Hard to do any research on a forum name id though so apologies. We don't know who you are.
  18. Simon

    Simon Moved on Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    Where have you sent the emails?

    Click on my username, or that of any other Global Mod or Admin and they'll be a link to contact us by email.

    You posted on our Facebook message page and those messages have been discussed.

    We saw no need to act on them.

    For clarity you wanted this thread taken down.

    As I've said we're not anonymous. While we do allow users to choose an internet name and an anonymous profile, many of us are easy to find.

    Some of us have videos here for you to critique.

    We have a You Tube channel and a Technique Thread where you can see many of our members.

    We have threads on our charity meets where there are videos from the last two years.

    You can critique those too.

    What do you expect to gain by meeting us in person?

    How about one of us brings along a son or daughter and proves that the breakaway doesn't work, what then?

    Will you say we grabbed too hard, or did "your technique" incorrectly?

    So carry on saying we're hiding because we won't meet you (we are at home with our families over Xmas by the way), but we have grown MAP by being no nonsense, honest, getting together and meeting each other and guess what, by helping others through our charity work.

    Personally I'd like to understand what you do to help vulnerable children before they're grabbed and what programmes you have to empower children and how you go about dealing with bullies, trouble at home, abusive parents and the like, which is a far greater danger to children than being abducted, despite what your advertising would have us believe.
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2015

    CPMANTIS Valued Member

    Would love to come to a meet. Thank you.

    CPMANTIS Valued Member

    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 26, 2015

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