Here's what I found. Source: http://www.bugeikanninjutsu.com/bujutsu.htm Source: http://www.kobudokwai.sk/History_2.htm On the site below there is a table that also lists this school as coming from Fukuoka. http://cjj2004.tripod.com/budoryu/id99.html Merry Christmas
Huh? Thanks. There's the explanation then. It seems to be a mix of 1980s Hayes-jitsu mixed with karate en español. I had seen some mention of some style by that name, apparently in a Muso Shinden Ryu dojo web site in Estonia: http://www.mitsubachi.ee/?page_id=19 I wasn't sure what to make of it, as it's not often one sees ryu of ninjutsu among most people's credentials, and I'd never heard of such a style before. I won't go further in mentioning anything about the list of credentials, though.
As it happens to be, I speak estonian. That man seems to be very interesting. And if you look at his credentials, kuroda ryu ninjutsu is placed at the very end - he's got some high ranks in other schools like 8th dan in Hozoin Ryu Sojutsu... that's pretty nice.
That's pretty cool--have you ever heard of him, or of any student or instructor of his? (I don't know a word of Estonian, and just happened upon that site due to a combination of my interest in Muso Shinden Ryu iaido and some strangely-allocated free time on my part. I know, a question like that is like asking an English speaker about whether they've heard of some English person, so feel free to just laugh at this post if you wish.) While the list didn't seem to be entirely coherently made (e.g. Keishi ryu iaido is Keishicho ryu iaido, it's just an alternative name), I just found it curious that if someone has such high ranks in several such arts, that he'd be a bit better known among koryu circles. Were you able to make anything of that site?
Hehe Estonia is extremely small, so I was surprised to even know there existed japanese kobudo there (well, except for Bujinkan, but you know what I mean). It seems that the main instructor there studied Shotokan Karate 'til the early nineteens (since martial arts where prohibited in Sovjet, he apparently has many interesting stories from those times - or so the site says ), and then did some tai chi and didn't start doing the kobudo until 2000 (started then with MSR under some finnish guy). Training there seems pretty cheap, and they have classes every day. They seem to do different things every day though, and I see now that each "art" has its own price list per month. Kind of a weird system. But not too expensive in any case. Takada Gakugo seems scheduled to come to Estonia twice next year. Here's the only english part of the site that I could find - luckily for everyone here, it's a transcription of Takada's lecture in 2006 - http://www.mitsubachi.ee/?page_id=114 That's all the info I could gather
Kuroda-ryu was a system from the Kuroda-han (The feudal domain where modern Fukuoka and Oita Prefectures are now situated.) The last headmaster of this school was a man named Matsuo Hiroshi (He was also called by his Bugo, Kenpu 剣風 ) Matsuo Kenpu is better known as one of Nakayama Hakudo's original students. He was also a member of Shinto Muso-ryu under Shiraishi Tokugoro and was the soke of Araki-ryu Gunyo Kogusoku. Matsuo Kenpu was my teacher's teacher. At the Shinkenkai dojo in Yokohama, we learned most of the disciplines he taught, except for Kuroda-ryu. Noone was ever given access to that apparently. The Kenshinkai taught Muso Shinden-ryu iai, Araki-ryu Gunyo Kogusoku, Shinto Muso-ryu jo, Yamanouchi-ryu shurikenjutsu and a Yagyu-ryu tessenjutsu (An offshoot of Yagyu Shinkage-ryu by way of Kubei Hirauchi Heibei.) Takada Gakudo san teaches mainly Muso Shinden-ryu under the auspecies of the Zen Nihon Iaido Renmei these days. As far as I know, he does not teach the other disciplines he learned from Matsuo. He has a couple of Shibu Dojo in Finland and other places in Europe the last I heard.
So what conclusion can be drawn from the information provided by Kogusoku, the obscure post by Kouryu and the information found and translated by Big Will? Is this another case like Seiko Fujita's where Fujita san claimed to take his secrets to the grave but others claim otherwise, or has another branch of Kuroda Ryu made it to the modern day, and if so, how?
Kuroda-ryu was small and obscure, the ryuha never made it past 1986, because probably the last menkyo kaiden, Matsuo (Kenpu) Hiroshi passed away in that year. If you do a little research in the Bugei Ryuha Daijiten, you shall find Kuroda-ryu. You'll find very little information, but you will find Matsuo's name there. There were some eye-witness accounts of Kuroda-ryu being demonstrated, The public demos were very much Shaolin type parlour tricks that you see when the monks and their troupe do a tour - Having someone cut at the demonstrator's arm with a shinken, after doing tameshigiri with the same blade. A kendo rokudan (Prewar kendoka under the Dai Nihon Butokukai did a lot of tameshigiri and knew how to cut very well.) apparently did so at one demonstration and was counfounded why the blade did not even penetrate the first layer of skin. Outward appearances via embu seem to show the school as a bit of an odd school, but in the dojo, it was much a different thing according to the seniors. There was a lot about landscape reading, mathematical study for guaging distance and other factors, scouting methods on open ground, etc. Some things were taught to the seniors, but noone ever got to learn the whole ryuha per se. There is one of the ryuha's weapons still at the Shinkenkai dojo, which is one of the strangest types of weapons I have seen; A tetsubo with a spirit level inside for measuring distances. It didn't make much sense until one of the dojo seniors explained it's function.
I have not heard that name in a long time. I remember him from Chris Roworth's place in Ruislip in the late 80's/early 90's. No idea where he disappeared to. Kogusoku (Mr. Delaney) Thanks for the embu accounts on Kuroda-ryu. I wonder how many small ryu like this have died off over time.
So not openly taught, yet not secret enough not to perform a public display, and no Menkyo Kaiden after 1986. And if enough people knew enough to perform a display, it isn't impossible that people knew enough to pass on, even if they weren't Menkyo Kaiden (how many of us today are taught by non Menkyo Kaiden?) Stephen Hayes and others were passing loads of stuff on long before they were even shihan. So what is happening in Estonia? I would suggest that someone like Big Will check out the gentleman's legitimacy in the other arts he has listed and then find out where his Kuroda Ryu came from. I don't hold out a lot of hope but it warrants more investigation than anyone else who has come out of the woodwork in recent years. I don't believe all the ninjutsu ryuha except ours are dead, but I do believe that the lid will stay on any others for a long time to come, due to xenophobia, cultural value and basic responsibilty not to make dangerous information widely available.
Hundreds. Literally hundreds. Quite a few went the way of the dodo when the bombs were dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Whole segments of martial culture completely gone. Well even if they did know, they weren't going to teach it. In the eyes of old school budoka, if you don't have the licence to teach, you don't teach. There were lots of talking about how it was, but noone would ever show a technique if asked. I think you know the answer to that all too well mate.
Big Will and Kogusoku: Tänan väga, arigatou gozaimasu! (Hope my google-jitsu served me well enough for the first one of those, and I just didn't make an ass of myself here.)
Bronze, Google wouldn't have served you much good. There is very little in terms of proper written material on Kuroda-ryu on cyberspace.
Oh, I'm sure that's true. The google-jitsu reference was regarding my previous attempt to use Estonian. As I mentioned, I wandered onto that website rather weirdly via looking for Muso Shinden Ryu information and not through intentional search for Kuroda Ryu (I'd never heard of the art before).
I would say I *know* but I can only make an uneducated guess without further information on the chap's legitimacy in the other arts listed. I'm thinking that if you have 9 genuine University Degrees you probably wouldn't invent a 10th in an obscure subject. So if his other ranks in other arts are genuine, why add a ninja element, especially in today's climate, where the N-word devalues the rest of one's curriculum vitae rather than enhance it. But then we have had people who appeared to be respectable politicians or other public figures (David Icke for example) who turned out to be barmy.
Sure is as I think that ryu still uses the menkyo system. If he holds the rank he is claiming then the only authorised Hozo-in Ryu dojo outside of Japan (Hamburg German) will now of him. When I visited them they told me they were the only ones outside of Japan ranked in that Ryu.
