John Wong and Paul Pung

Discussion in 'Kenpo' started by BGile, Apr 23, 2007.

  1. BGile

    BGile Banned Banned

    No, people have told you the truth, but it's not what you want to hear, so you accuse them of being liars, or having a agenda. What's your favorite word for it? Oh yes, "duplicity".
    Mutt and Jeff, You guys are a real tag team match posting so close to each other Hmmm time wise...

    Yes duplicity is a good word and used for a reason. Liar is not a word I use much, except to counter one that has used it first.

    I wish I was a picture taker back then, I don't even have pictures of myself in uniform as a LEO other than the official ones. Some friend do but I did not take many or pose. I sent a pic to Dan, and you two did what with it, jeez.

    Not some thing I did or do much. I took some recently for others sake, at seminars I was at. I don't do much of it sorry.

    The picture shows the studio and the name, can't be that hard to pull up...I mean it is in your pictures in your computer :rolleyes:

    Now the duh...what did I do, from Dan and you coming on like a train wreck, team is a good word for it.

    So, which is it...Irish, Japanese or Hawaiian??? Your connection? I always thought it was Hawaiian. As in Kajukenbo...Nothing sinister about that, is there? :D :D :D
  2. BGile

    BGile Banned Banned

    Hard to see, I'll take your guys word for it :rolleyes: LOL

    Since a lot of Kajukenbo, is Japanese or Okinawan, and others of course. I used the term Sensei.

    I actually like "Sigung" I think that fits John now. "Professa" is Chow, I think of John as "Sigung".

    I am an expert, have badges and things for it, plus I was deemed an expert by the court. Has a nice ring to it, but I just like my name, Gary or "G man".

  3. DAnjo

    DAnjo Valued Member

    Well, since Chow referred to Emperado as Professor and since he promoted Godin to the rank of Professor, I think he was cool with others using that title. Gary, seriously, I posted two photos of that certificate. The first one was so blury as to be nearly unreadable. The second one is clearly a cut and paste job. Don't tell me that you can't see that YODAN isn't superimposed over some other typing. Heck, it even overlaps the following word on the certificate.
  4. DAnjo

    DAnjo Valued Member

    Also, I was taught that the spelling of fourth degree was Yondan, not yodan as it is on the certificate.
    Last edited: May 22, 2007
  5. John Bishop

    John Bishop Valued Member

    What? This picture? Where's the secret message in this photo?


    Let's see. Robert Conrad, Poncie Ponce, and Connie Stevens star in a television show called "Hawaiian Eye". Conrad is interested in martial arts, so he starts training with John Leoning. He brings his friends around the school to visit. Poncie Ponce thinks it would be a good investment to start some karate schools. Turns out it's not, so he goes his way, and Leoning goes his.

    Now let's hear your version of it, since you are always in the know.
  6. BGile

    BGile Banned Banned

    Yon as in the yonder hills over there or Yo, as in yo yo, Dan

    Ok First.

    Next, it could have been added and no I am not seeing it that clear, maybe all the certs are made and a space there for the name of rank received.
    Is then added, rather than replaced.

    The picture is nice but John you are only bringing up the hairs on my neck as to why you don't post the one with the name of the school on Lankershim. That looks like the one on Burbank blvd. to me (Sonny's) But it has been a long time ago. Think "Kung Fu and Karate" over head.

    I also have that one of Ponce and Connie Stevens.

    Thanks for all the trouble that you are going to :rolleyes:
  7. BGile

    BGile Banned Banned

    Yondan is a word and is used

    It is also Yodan as I already showed in prior post..
    This is one of the things that comes up in various arts as you well know I'd think.

    The reason I am now going to post it again, it comes from Tracy's.

    I know you feel the Tracy's are upstarts in comparison to Sijo and his art...
    But one thing I always think about is where did it come from.

    Mitose, and they are mentioning that now. Something that was not in vogue in the 60's or the 70's not until Bruce brought the man's name back and out of the prison cell he was in.

    Now it is ok to use the term Kenpo and Mitose in the same breath.

    So why now is Thomas so keen on him, and not telling more to the public?
    How about this for a question and answer routine.
    Is Thomas still on the board of directors of Kajukenbo?

    Who was the first to name his son Alvin? Who first wore the cross and the robes?

    This is like all the rest of us and for what?

    Last edited: May 22, 2007
  8. John Bishop

    John Bishop Valued Member

    Well, the K.S.D.I. doesn't have a board of directors. So are you talking about the K.A.A., A.K.A., K.N.F., P.C.K.A., P.R.K.A., K.S.D.S., N.A.K.A., or one of the other Kajukenbo organizations?

    If your talking about Alvin Mitose and Alvin Emperado, Alvin Emperado is older. But maybe you should ask James Mitose Jr. in Hawaii. He's much older then both of them.

    What that's supposed to mean? We all know Mitose impersonated a minister as part of his con games. But I got no clue who else your referring to. Will Tracy maybe? He had his own imaginary church too.
    Last edited: May 22, 2007
  9. BGile

    BGile Banned Banned

    Well back to asking and getting some answer's.
    Thanks for some of the answers, to my prying question's...

    John it has come to me as I have been mulling over some stuff about the picture. I could have seen that picture on a web site that was owned by a person who went by the name of Fox.

    He lived in Oregon and had a dance studio, played the piano, and he had a funny name for a martial art. I saw his name on the guest book of Charles Fisher's site and tracked him down. Any thought's??? When I wrote him several computers ago, now on a disc, who know's where right now. It really has been along time ago and a far away thought that has come back to me.

    He was astonished that I found him, I told him how I tracked him down and after that and the name disappeared from the guest book. It was about the time I sent the kanji and discription to Charles Fisher, regarding Johnny Leoning's Patch... The one you posted for me in another thread. He would be a good one for you to talk to I believe if you are trying to put something together for the memory of Professor Leoning.

    Not much to go on but still might help if you can find anything with what I have mentioned.

    I believe the picture was one that was copied from a newspaper, the Times or Exaimner, been awhile now.

    As I am typing I am thinking the art was one that had no contact in it and was of the highest value. Weird really. Some what of a take off on Mitose's stuff. Ring any bells?
    Said he was raised in North Hollywood and went by a different name then.
    Sorry that is it for now.

    I'll look around and see if I can find anything more about it.
  10. Matthew Barnes

    Matthew Barnes Valued Member

    Silly question.

    What year is that picture from? I may be missing something here, but isn't that the old 'first kajukenbo school' picture? How come it says 'Kenpo Karate' on the sign and not kajukenbo?

  11. Nuck Chorris

    Nuck Chorris I prefer North South

    Cause that is what it was called then.
  12. BGile

    BGile Banned Banned

    I was curious about that a few years ago and mentioned it because I had read that Johnny was a Chow student also and had a black belt in it, but John said no. The thought that the first school was in Hollywood on Sunset Blvd could be a reason for it also.

    This was the time frame I believe.
  13. BGile

    BGile Banned Banned

    So it was developed in 1947 (Kajukenbo) and when that picture was taken in the late 50's or early 60's it was still called "Kenpo Karate"?

    Yes, it was by Chow, but not Emperado. Or so it has been mentioned for the last few years. According to some, Chow was using another name also, and then another. Until he settled on the name Kara Ho.

    One of the things I have mentioned about Johnny Leoning being a Chow student, also the name being Chows, then the difference on the Mainland. But John Bishop menitoning no, it was Kajukenbo since 1947.

    But for some time, and other times it was called other name's, by Johnny and Sonny Gas after the incident of renown, (visit from the org for pay for use of the name), and maybe before? So again why the name being that of Chows organization at that late time frame/date?

    The situation is still hinging on the picture, "North American Kung Fu and Karate" that was on Lankershim Blvd, in the 60's and 70's.
  14. Nuck Chorris

    Nuck Chorris I prefer North South

    Look at the old pictures Gary. Hell, it is 2007 and my old instructor still has "Kenpo Karate" listed, not Kajukenbo. I think when they first came over here it was called Kenpo Karate. I don't remember exactly when they started to use the Kajukenbo name regularly. Probably in Prof. Bishop's book.
  15. BGile

    BGile Banned Banned


    I am pretty much in the know about much of what seemed to happen but the spin is always changed, so I will and am just trying to get the latest one on record.

    You mention:
    Let's see. Robert Conrad, Poncie Ponce, and Connie Stevens star in a television show called "Hawaiian Eye". Conrad is interested in martial arts, so he starts training with John Leoning. He brings his friends around the school to visit. Poncie Ponce thinks it would be a good investment to start some karate schools. Turns out it's not, so he goes his way, and Leoning goes his.

    Now let's hear your version of it, since you are always in the know.

    My thoughts:
    Time frame 1957 to 1963 or so, probabley the earlier rather than later. But you are being elusive as always. But as I have mentioned I am grateful for the information. Thanks
  16. KempoFist

    KempoFist Attention Whore

    Kenpo is Kempo is Kaju is Kara is Kosho is Karazenpo

    Depends who you train under, on what you're learning. Same reason why the Pit is labeled as Hawaiian Kempo, when what they do is no longer really Kempo or Kajukenbo.
  17. John Bishop

    John Bishop Valued Member


    No it was a school that Poncie Ponce owned. He paid John Leoning, and Ben Salvador to teach "kenpo karate" for him.

    Poncie Ponce preferred that Leoning use the name "kenpo karate" because many of the Hollywood actors trained at Ed Parker's kenpo karate school, so "kenpo" was well known with the Hollywood set.
    The business relationship with Poncie Ponce and John Leoning only lasted a year or so.
    Last edited: May 23, 2007
  18. Matthew Barnes

    Matthew Barnes Valued Member

    Thank you.
  19. BGile

    BGile Banned Banned

    Leoning's school in No. Hollywood, Ca. was funded by the Hawaiian actor Poncy Ponce. Pictured is Poncy Ponce, and the actress Connie Stevens.
    Poncy Ponce, Connie Stevens, and Robert Conrad starred in the 50's-60's TV detective show "Hawaiian Eye".
    Robert Conrad, who was a student of John Leoning, was to use his Kajukenbo skills later in his next T.V. series; "Wild Wild West".
    In fact when Conrad (as James West) fought actor Don Stroud, it was the first time two Kajukenbo stylists fought each other in a TV show or movie. Don Stroud had been a student of Sijo Emperado's at the Palama Settlement school.

    Hi John I got this off of Martial talk and one of the reasons I have the picture, you mentioned this also back then.

    Did John Leoning come over to the Mainland because he knew Poncie?
    You mention the No. Hollywood school. Was that the one on Lankershim or Victory Blvd? I am not really sure now if Sonny took over the one on Victory when John moved to the one on Lankershim?

    Since both John and Sonny had one in the No. Hollywood area, one was very close to the border of Burbank and North Hollywood as I remember.

    This story is one that is what I was saying about the two different locations both these locations are where Johnny and Sonny were I believe???
    Right next to Nudies.

    It might have been something Nudie owned and they rented, any thoughts on that John?

    Last edited: May 23, 2007
  20. BGile

    BGile Banned Banned

    Thanks for the information.

    Getting clearer as we go on :confused:

    Remember I mentioned it was called something different, but no one said anything about my recollection, except "probably because I was not there" hmmm LOL ;) My point Dan T.

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