My name is Ken Moffat, my training started with 1992 with karate at the golden knights martial arts group-Kin Bushi Ryu with sensei P.Koegst who moved on to his own club naming it TeJitsu and then KarateJitsu at the adelaide academy of self-defense and martial arts. During these years i also trained jim fung wing chun most days and weekends and even a Doce Pares seminar or two during this time. Work and Family created a move to the country where i took up shotokan with sempai J.McGreggor of the Shindo karate assoc. Becouse of my previous training i was soon assisting in instruction and thank sempai McGreggor for this experience. Heres where my story starts, as my children grew up i realised that karate tkd wing chun etc could give them nothing to save their lives with...i dont mean defense from bullies or something silly like that i mean realworld abduction, rape etc. Before you say anything realise that a mugger will gain your confidence first and assess you by asking for a light of his smoke etc then within range ko you.. If you have had REAL violent life death struggles you know what im saying, also my daughter could hardly punch, kick, or worst of all wrestle her way out. I teach my children a lethal art, one which they could realistically use to save their lives with, not win a point tourny or kickboxing match with. 88% of the population are not built to outBrutalize their attackers! let alone wrestle them lol.. They would need an explosive vital point attack using full bodied compact flowing shots at neck/eyes.... Welcome to Ba Gua, the art of overkill.... Master Erle Montaigue is the only bagua master to share completely all he has learned. As a matter of fact there is no-one to match his knowledge in these matters in my opinion. Even now there are still people realising that they need to train flinch response etc for the realworld. This is been the essence of BaGua for nearly 4000 yrs along with the I-ching... Anyway thats a bit of my story and i have respect for all martial arts and artists alike so i am open to all points of veiw and any constructive criticism about mine.. Peace
Croeso/Failte?welcome- clearly you're a Bagua guy then. I've read some BKFrantzis and Lu Shengli and Bagua looks interesting. Isn't this Erle Montaigue the Bagua teacher here in Wales, uk?
Actually Bruce Frantzis has said he was trained by the same master as Erle Montaigue, a master Dung (doo-ng). Combine Mr Frantzis teachings with a listen to Terrence McKenna with his time/DNA I-Ching theory and things look differently Erle Montaigue is now based in Wales however for many years he resided in the eastern states of Australia. He has the whole book so to speak on the internal arts of China, especially the proper way to walk circle and perform fa-jing etc. With respect Mr Frantzis has centred on the energies, bringing out the aikido like quality to bagua gained from walking the circle at a fair pace... Look at you-tube for dragon form, search dragon form and select moontagu, thats proper circle walking for fa-jing shakes etc. In fact just search moontagu to go to the moontagu channel and watch some bagua animal forms... Now compare what you see to your current idea of BaGua zhang..... Also bagua is packed with qi-gong, it really is a viable road to the Dao..
Hiya Ken, Welcome to MAP. I like a lot of Earle's teachings and incorporate some into my practice of Hsing YiQuan and TaiJiQuan. I hope to see you around the forums as I shall very likely want to pick your brains!.
Welcome to MAP,Griffin. While he studied under various people,Bruce's main PK teacher was Liu.Could we have a full name for Tung? I couldn't find anything in Bruce's or Erle's sites which mentioned either having an instructor of that name.Can you direct me to a place I can look up Tung in relation to Bruce?Do you know if Tung taught Yin Fu's or Cheng,Ting-hua's PK? P.S.-cleaning cow stanchions is also a viable road to the Tao.No ch'i-gung,tho'!
Hey everyone, thankyou for your welcome On you-tube select "channel" at the top, Then type "moontagu" or "EnergyArts" and you have many vids to choose from for any details of their histories. Watch a good amount of them and you realise that whoever taught them is almost irrelavent. They both have the "keys" to the lock to which we all strive to release ourselves from at some stage. To me they represent a kind of yin/yang symbol from which both teachings bring us closer to that which we seek, Combine their teachings and you have physical/nonphysical.... well...everything. Human beings in their current "condition" require all kinds of this and that'n'whatever, Basically blinding themselves to that which they already have... A great teacher attempts to "remind you" or "enlighten you". Becouse we are all a drop in a vast ocean and are connected. There is no fantastical place called the Dao, you, me the air, space you name it is all connected as one, this is the Dao. When you can release from your programing you no longer seek satisfaction in facts and figures just the energies, we physically see around 75 or so light spectrums which create sight, these are vibrations/energies. Add a few more light spectrums and.... so facts are just diagrams on paper you see, in time they CHANGE also. Bagua people should be seeking a different level of sight itself when walking the circle. There are chemicals that occur naturally in our brain, through certain ways, not just bagua as was stated but for me bagua, we can entice these chemicals to flow more freely, thats the incredibal stillness. Most people arnt satisfied and continue on for something they have built up to be magical, missing nothingness and never being able to explore what they have tapped into, after all everthing is nothing and nothing is everything, YOU must be left behind in the physical form or the poison of the human condition will forever mutate and deform spiritual growth or an ever closer understanding of the Dao. These are my opinions not my facts for the very same reason Peace
El Medico i was refering to Dong Hai Chuan, I have learnt the 8 animal forms via Erle Montaigue and recommend his dvd series for anyone not living near a Bagua master or major city for that matter. Hey good point though, you would have a better grasp on the timeline of all these great masters.. I am eager to promote this great art of Bagua, to me it's just got everything in it, I am also eager to learn more and thank everyone for their input Now I am learning double palm change, Bagua is great. Peace
Frantzis and Montaigue were not trained by the same instructors, and neither of them trained under Dong (or Tung) Hai Chuan who died long before either was born. Dong/Tung however is regarded as the historical founder of martial Ba Gua Zhang though its circle walking practices existed in Taoist monasteries for centuries before he popularized Ba Gua as a martial art.
I am put off from learning erle's stuff due to discrepencies in lineage and that his bagua is so different i.e. hip shake while walking. He states his lineage comes from ho ho choy who learnt from Chiang Jung-chiao but ho ho choy learnt Gao style bagua from Gao Yisheng. Can anyone explain this discrepency???
I can. I discussed with Erle about it once. Ho Ho Choy main teacher was Jian Rong Qiao, Gao Yisheng was one of his teacher. If you look at Erle bagwa that is clean JRQ style.
