Defense against Muay Thai Grapple

ROLFLMAO

This is the funniest sentence I have read on MAP for ages.

As an IMA practitioner, maybe it's time I played in the EMA forums and hijacked a few of those.

Keep it up boys, it is very entertaining. :love:

 

So, a guy asks for ehlp dealing with specific techniques and people who practice those techniques pop on to thread and give their $.02 and there's a problem with that? Hell, I'd love to see more "external" and "sport" guys taking part in the IMA discussions. I really dislike the idea of sgregating the IMAs off from the rest of the arts. They're still martial arts.

I guess I'd have an easier time believing this if I had not've seen video of Silva and othe MMA guys pounding the crap out of their opponents while both of them are wearing those fingerless MMA gloves. If you've ever worn them, you'll know that there's zero loss of flexibility in your hands... just a *very* small amount of padding around the knuckles to protect the puncher's hand. Now, some of the defenses you mention, biting, small joint attacks aren't allowed, that's a given, but it seems that in gloveless scenarios, people still get the crap beat out of them when they get clinched.

I know I'm going to play around with this more this week and see what I come to.

 

another way to deal with the MT clinch, or any clinch for that matter, is to always keep one hand on the inside (don't let him have both his hands on the inside). when he tried to knee, he transfers all his weight to the remaining foot, making it easier to unbalance him (this only works if you have a good grip on him, ergo one hand on the inside). jerk his neck towards the direction of his incoming knee.

ex. if he knees with his right foot, jerk his neck downwards and towards the kneeing leg. since all his weight is on one foot, he can't balance himself and will start falling towards the direction of your jerk. this, and the fact that his body structure has been broken, will stop the knee before it reaches you. it's all physics.

and before anyone asks, yes i have tried this out numerous times. i used to compete in sanda on the national level and frequently went to MT gyms to duke it out. it requires a bit of sensitivity and a good grip on his neck, but it's very feasible.

and tim cartmell is very well known in the martial arts circles. as previously stated he has won asian full contact tournaments, bjj tournaments, and trains all his fighters in internal martial arts and bjj, they do very well in MMA format fights. tim believes that bjj is internal ground fighting, because the principles of bjj are the same as those of the internal arts, just applied on the ground instead of stand up. there are videos on his site for those who want to see IMA in action.

 

I knew it! Down with pants!!!

 

I agree with you here zac, mixing things up is ok to me. After all I subscribe to 'no fixed technique' as far as taijiquan goes - as expounded by chen pan ling. (I know you like to quote the masters)

I think you're being a bit overly critical here on TB. I think he was definately refering to MT/boxing type gloves not MMA ones..

 

Exactly. It's good to know about how others think and like to work.

I really didn't intend to be that way. I'm simply saying that in situations where gloves shouldn't be an issue, the clinch still works to devastating effect on people who fight for a living. So, TB's strategies might work, without trying them out (which i intend to do) there's no way to know.



BTW - Your earlier point about my tone is well taken, I'm often quite direct and without body language, intonation it's hard to tell that I'm actually looking for discussion not argument. I'll try in the future to make my intentions more clear.

 

if by "hijack" you mean post on a thread specifically addressed toward your system, then I would say yes...yes, you should. That would sure show "us", eh?

 

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BWAHAHAHAHA!!!

Possibly the most ridiculous post I have ever read!!



If you even had a clue...

And as to the rest of the thread... Well, what can I say, other than

KEEP PROVING TB'S POINT!!!

 

I didnt see this particular bit of nonsense before actually. clinching is one drill that we often do without gloves. of course if you actually had any idea what you were talking about, you would know this. and uh, who said the guy inside DIDNT have the advantage, gloves or not?

 

Thank you Zac. At least one of you is prepared to try something new - that makes everything else worth it for me (Do bear in mind that I am assuming IMA body-mechanics which seriously affect the outcome of what I've suggested - if you use 'outer' strength, rather than moving from the centre, it won't work)
As for the rest of you - thank you for your impressive demonstration of your amazing (seriously - I haven't laughed so much in ages! ) interpersonal skills and self-control. What a shining example of the character-building aspects of MA training you all are lol

Ad McG - thanks for your comments... two slight points: 1.) Axe to grind with me - because you failed to back up your comments about IMA and qigong and tried to twist it all round when I made the mistake of visiting H+F forum b4 2.) You have a mile-wide prejudice against IMA practices (and you have the nerve to say you have an open mind??? LOL@U Man you do make me laugh! ) Go back to your weights :bang:
BTW all - I haven't tried out a neck-break, biting an ear off or eye gouging on a real opponent either - does that mean I don't know how to do it?
Happy training
:Angel:

 

Taiji Butterfly, as far as I'm concerned I couldn't give a rat's ass about your silly "character-building" and its connection with MA.



And your welcome.

 

I just noticed this, somehow I read over it. Yeah, the idea of spirituality/philosphy in IMA does rub me wrong. In truth the idea of spirituality seems to me to be a very modern and contrived idea in the world of martial arts and for some reason the internal arts suffer from these things in the extreme.

I've read the classics of my art (xingyiquan) and I see NOTHING about spirituality. I see numerous references to qi, sure, but all in relation to body mechanics. What I don't see is where there is anyone advocating a certain philosophical path. The closest it comes is tactical concepts, not philosophies. Ideas for beating people in fights, not ideas for living your life.

Maybe taijiquan is different, I wouldn't know. All I know is that I'm bothered by the idea that a MARTIAL art needs spiritual concepts.


Now here's a caveat, I don't know all that much about my art and I honestly don't know anything about taijiquan.

 

You're either part of the solution or you're part of the problem. You're just an angry person in denial, Inf. Get over whatever it is that's making you that way and your training (in all areas) will progress much better.

Zac - you're right - xingyi is the one of "the three" Chinese IMA's that lacks a spiritual basis, however it is commonly practised by moslems who of course have that anyway I assume (ime). Taiji is strongly rooted in Taoism as is Bagua. It is not that you have to adhere to these systems to do the arts, but understanding Tao helps you master the IMA in different ways than not. (I was showing a student how to block and counter with an elbow to the sternum simultaneously by utilising yin and yang today - without that philosophy it is harder toi understand imo/e) Having some kind of ethical basis or code also prevents you from using your skills inappropriately or abusing your power imo - but hey, it's your karma guys lol
:Angel:

 

Taiji, you obviously have little understanding of the nature of Ego, Will and Kia and its relative nature to power. :Angel:

Oh yeah, and Karma is a silly little tool devised to keep people in check. More dogma.

You're right Taiji, this IS fun. I don't think I've talked to someone so bent on the Right Hand Path in such a long time!!!

You amuse me to no end Taiji. Yet you do so without even the bare understanding of the Right.

Well. . . . hehe it's your call. It's your life, and I'm not going to tell you what to do.

 

See, right here you just nailed my point. Practitioners of Henan Xinyi have a martial art and they have a religion and neither one is the other. I wouldn't go to a priest to learn how to fight and I wouldn't got to an MA teacher to learn right form wrong.


FYI - to the best of my knowledge xingyi isn't specifically practiced by muslims, it's anscestor Henan Xinyi is.

 

Taiji Butterfly is at a loss for words to respond because he got owned in his own forum.

It's terrible when your fantasy world collapses and albino apes and Jesus laugh at you.

Do you actually even internal martial arts or do you just think about them?
It wouldn't be so far off the mark actually as that's how you've attempted to deal with a MT clinch.

LOL!

 

LMAO... "It's terrible when your fantasy world collapses and albino apes and Jesus laugh at you. "

This is simply too funny.

 

I personally disagree with the fluffy cloud aspects of martial arts. I don't believe they are meant to be character building at all.
I am interested in the internal arts, particularly xing yi, but not if they involve this "better person" spiel.

 

Above I said this:

Don't let Butterly scare you off of the IMAs. I think he's just trolling.

 

Cheers zac. I don't have a problem with the concept of qi, I don't know whether it is real or not but it is a useful way of grasping certain aspects of martial arts.