Hi Pax, Mabuti salamat po. I may have given the wrong impression but I was only speaking hyperthetically with regards to "Datu 8th Dan" etc. What I meant was that it's completely ridiculous but considering some titles that people are given or indeed give themselves, not outside the realms of possibility. Just when you think you've heard it all................. Regards Doug
Basically they mean, How are you (Kumusta) politely. replied by, Fine thanks (politely). These are basic Filipino greatings. Much the same as Mabuhay. Regards Pat
1. Shishir Inacallo - ??? Filipino now living in the states. 2. Kelly Worden - 1988 American 3. David Hoffman - ??? American 4. Dieter Knuttel - ??? German 5. Bong Jornales - ??? Filipino now living in the states. 6. Tim Hartman - 2000 American
i expressed my sentiments over at the fma staff thread already. no need to re-iterate them here. i will say this however, a rank of mastery is a rank of mastery, no matter what it is called. it deserves respect. even though the rank sounds like lord of tae kwon do or earl of karate or mayor of wrestling (hey that's how it sounds to me)...the datus have my respect, be it the datus of the southern philippines or the datus of fma.
Respect is not the issue here, I believe that rank or no rank everyone should be respected. The issue here is that It may be improper to use Datu as a commercialized Rank in our country and in FMA. Try using you examples of Tae Kwon Do in Korea, Or Earl of Karate in UK or Japan. Does it matter to me? Nah, Like I said, Titles don't mean a thing. Just sharing opinions when asked.
"Titles don't mean a thing. Just sharing opinions when asked." whilst I would like to agree with you on this, sadly I can't. The fact is that if you're trying to promote your style and there's much competition in your area, City etc, then titles do take on a relevance - as much as we'd like to think they wouldn't. If you're trying to get people through the door of your school and you have 5 other instructors within or close to your area teaching FMA but are advertising themselves as "Guru", "Pangulong Guru", "Master", "Datu" or whatever, who do you think is going to be last on the list of any perspective student wanting to visit an FMA school if you don't have a title? Regardless of skill level, why would they come to you when these other names sound so impressive. Don't forget, they may know absolutely nothing about the FMA so how good you are in comparrison to the guy down the road doesnt really count for much at the early stages. However it all depends on what you want from it all. If you're happy to train in the art and persue it for your own development and have no plans to teach openly then of course you're right. Ability speaks for itself. If on the other hand you decide to teach then titles do help.
LOL! I'm gonna start calling myself lord of tsinela boxing. Maybe "undefeated" lord of tsinela boxing
I disagree, all my stidents call me by my first name, I make them do it. I am quite ranked in several systems but refuse for personal reasons to use it. Nothing wrong with using one as a sign of respect. Like Guro (teacher) Mang (Mr.) Or Ka' (Short for Kapatid or brother) I do not relly on titles to use it to promote my art. I show my skills, Word travels and the kind of serious students you want will visit or do their home work. I always ask inquirers if they have visited other schools and even otyher styles. I am not bothered if they decide to go to another school. It was not meant to be. This helps weed out any wasted time on people who may not fit FMA or your training methods. Most stay because they like what they see and it fits them and that the kind i want to have . Many times I ask them to look around and see such people using such high titles and put them beside my guys , myself even my collegues who have the same feeling about ranks and let it speak fro itself. I have no interest teaching those coming in to think that a paper proves that you have any skill. That is why I make sure they do their research and compare. I have all the confidence in what we do becasue we have done our share of comparissons and training but your students have not so how can they appreciate what they have? After doing so you will feel that these titles don't mean anything when anyone can claim this and that Big Honcho grand Pubah and when do this art of mine little justice to the point of embarassment. As a n example, we had this seminar attended by several other ranking instructors, one particular instructor stunk in skill so bad that everyone partnered with him did not know what to do with him. When my onther collegue asked his begginer student to partner up with this ....(High Rank) I won't mention. He said "He's An Instructor?! If that's the case I don't want to be an instructor. We found humor at his honesty but that's what happens. If you like ranks and like using them , good for you. I will adress you accordingly as a sign of respect but if you depend or use a rank and think it' s what impresses me then you are mistaken. I continue to learn form manongs or people who have shacks for school or backyards and zero ranks. it's all about knowing that they have something that I do not have and need and want to learn it from them. To each his own. Cheers
I agree with much of what you say and my own approach is fairly similar to yours in that I have always encouraged my students to explore and compare with whats out there. I don't advertise and have no rank to speak of and like to think that they're with me because they feel I have something useful to offer. "I continue to learn form manongs or people who have shacks for school or backyards and zero ranks. it's all about knowing that they have something that I do not have and need and want to learn it from them." Well, you're a lucky man but this encapsulates it quite well. I believe there's a fundamental difference in the way the art is taught in the philippines and the way its taught in the west. I can only talk from experience here in the UK and the few guys I trained with there (in their backyards). There's more of an oportunity to make money from the art here and it's become something of a "niche" market. The amount of instructors who are teaching the art because they love it and expect nothing in return (by that I mean them not looking at making a profit) are minimal. I could count them on the fingers of one hand and still have spare fingers.
That's the reason why there are a lot of poor escrimadors with 1st class skills but with no titles in the Philippines. The way they were brought up and the way they were trained cannot make them make too much money from training others to fight. "Mahiya ka naman (Be ashamed)"--this is the phrase that encapsulates the attitude. Don't title yourself too highly, because you never know when someone with better skill bests you and you are humiliated. Of course, the side-effect is that few people ever attain 1st class skills, because no less than full committment is required, and full committment usually means poverty. And the art tends to die out. If only the Philippine Government can afford to make arnisadores/escrimadores "National Artists" so that they can keep the art alive. Aside: When the Philippine President makes a person a Datu (Order of Sikatuna), does the Datu get a stipend from the Government, or just a one-time cash prize?
Gryphon Hall wrote: "If only the Philippine Government can afford to make arnisadores/escrimadores "National Artists" so that they can keep the art alive." Now that's a great idea worth pursuing. Sad to say when many of the great FMA masters pass away, they are most remembered elsewhere and are just a sad silent footnote in our country. When you hear one of them pass away , you may read about them in numerous forums and the great accomplishments they leave behind but none but a whisper in their homeland where they are often laid to rest.
That sucks. Not about the honor, mind you. It would have been nice if it was just like the Magsasay Award, or something. I've just watched Ong Bak. I am green with envy. I wish our movie industry could make a really good martial arts movie featuring FMA, instead of those tiring tear-jerkers or those ST-films.
Well then let's take a look at that, what are the qualifications for a natitional artist? And if we were to look at the many masters and GM's alive today, who would quailify? Would it be all GM's? Specific ones? What about the GM's of the last centurey who have already past away? Also what are the benifits of being a natitional artist? Do you recieve a stipend? Who determines who gets to be one?
