Cross Training

Contact agreed, stance is always going to be a problem, same with the guard.

 

Perhaps.

Is that a bad thing? :evil:

 

To the original question, yes and no. Training kickboxing and BJJ in one of my old clubs was the done thing, and they were effectively done in the same class ([]btechnically[/b] they were two separate classes, but the two classes shared conditioning times, a warmup, and the cost was the same to do one class as two, so no-one really paid any attention to the distinction).

In my most recent club, they practiced a wider variety of arts - Boxing, kickboxing, BJJ and Judo all had separate classes, as well as MMA classes where they would combine striking with takedowns and throws, or train grappling with striking. These could be paid for separately, but it was cost-effective to train all at once, at about $20 extra a month.

However, (mostly for financial reasons), I've not trained at two separate clubs at once - apart from a brief time spent training Parkour alongside MMA.

 

As long as it doesn't get in the way. Usually it does. The better you get the standard improves and soon you realise while specialising can be so important.
If you're just training for the fun of it the two arts really help with the sparring but once you start to compete the chances are mistakes will happen

 

Fair point.

I supose I'm showing my own bias. I think Thai is superior to TKD and see a TKD player transitioning into Muay Thai as a change for the better.

 

The problem comes in the thai boxing. Adjusting to a stance that's just so forign to TKD. Everything is different and it's just making life too hard for the practitioner. Like I've already said it won't become really apparent until you get under pressure. Going from one to the other is bad enough, training both is really going to interfere, again more with the MT

 

I actually have no problem transitioning from TKD stances to MT stances. Then again in sparring with friends outside of school who do multiple styles, I do switch between stances from different martial arts freely and easily depending on the person. People have noted though when seeing me throw each technique that they can see the TKD in me.

My master actually makes us train pretty hard in class always trying to get us to get all the power we can give from each technique. Outside of class I kick hard thing just like MT practitioners do, only difference is I use my TKD. I have many videos of MT which I study mainly so that I'm familiar which the techniques so that when or if I ever go against a Thai fighter I know what to expect.

I actually hated TKD before I joined my school. I heard all the stereo types about TKD fighters being weak and just flashy. Then a friend of mine took me to the school to watch a class and I feel in love with the way my Master was teaching the art. It's a WTF school, but he doesn't only teach us the WTF sparing rules. We mainly only use them for belt test.
My master constantly stresses the importance of keeping our guard up when doing any type of kick, and we actually get yelled at for not punching enough. What we learn is TKD but he teaches it as more than just a sport.
No style is more superior than another. The problem people see when a TKD fighter goes against a Thai fighter is that most of those TKD fighters are scared to take a hit.

Back to Judo, I spoke with the master of the Judo school in my area and I was told to come in and check it out, and it wouldn't be expensive to join the school and to continue my TKD training. So I am going to check it out and make my decision afterwards.

 

What hard things do you kick? I'm 99% certain that kicking solid objects is a no no. As far as I know, Thais kick the heavy bag for conditioning. If you are kicking anything harder than a bag or a banana tree you might want to stop doing this before you cause yourself damage...

This is a falsehood. There are superior ways of doing things, and there are superior styles.

Generally it's more to do with the Thai fighters outclassing their opponents in every way.

If you like the coach and enjoy the training, I would have to concur that Judo would be an awesome compliment to your TKD. Hope you enjoy!
Don't forget about a previous posters suggestion of boxing also...that could give you a real edge

 

Everyone does this...

It's annoying.




As for the discussion. Always go and try out different schools in any style you are interested in. See how they train and keep an open mind to your development.

As for what you decide to train in long term, I think someone earlier posted that you can loose a competitive edge under sparring rules which are similar but have some differences.

It wont occur if your having tasters of other classes.

 

I should have been more descriptive, I kick small trees usually, and wooden poles and things like them. When I kick them I don't kick hard enough to cause myself injury, just hard enough so that I fill the kick and can get the effects of Wolff's law. Also if you don't kick solid objects what do you kick?

Their would be only one way that would be the case. Kung fu would be the superior martial art if that's the case. Certain styles work better for different body types. Examples of this are Crane style Kung fu being developed for people with longer legs and arms to keep opponents at a distance where they have the advantage and Bear style Kung fu which enabled shorter stockier people to fight against people who taller. Unless MT makes you something more than human it is in no way superior to any other martial art.

No just the TKD fighter being more afraid to take a hit.

I haven't forgotten about boxing. I just don't take formal classes on it. Since I like kickboxing so I entered an amateur match. I go to the local kickboxing gym and watch the boxer and kick boxers and imitate them. So what they might be paying 50 or 60 dollars to have a trainer teach then, I learn by watching them and only pay the five dollars it cost to work out at the gym.

 

1. I recommend you look in the conditioning section, there's a whole thread dedicated to the biology of WHY kicking things like wooden posts will not help you.

2. So smushing my face in choclate cake is a "good" MA in the same way Muay Thai is? Sorry, your analogy doesn't hold water, some MA's have better body mechanics and more realistic theories than others.

3. AND, Muay Thai practitioners capable of using more of their body, with greater effect and generally being better conditioned and fitter than their TKD counter-parts.

4. Except when they make a mistake a teacher goes over an corrects them, you however get no such service.

You are relying on the idea that the students are perfect examples of technique and that you by yourself can understand that technique AND be able to perfectly re-create it.

Do you think you could learn all the intricacies of Judo in a similar manner?

Becuase when you think about it, it's just rolling around and tripping up the other guy up.

 

I am going to come out of left field and suggest combining TKD with boxing, as you have the different strengths kicks (TKD) and hands (boxing) covered. Then as the others say, Judo or Jujitsu is another way to diversify. But I like the idea of getting a black belt in one system first, so you will have a deeper understanding of it, before adding anything else.

 

1. I was unable to find the thread using the search button, but my understanding of the way physics work when hitting objects with the body is that you should never hit anything that doesn't have any push back to it, also I don't kick these things for power, just for technique and connection. If I want to kick things for power I use the banana bag we have in class, or the heavy bags at the kickboxing gym.

2. I'm sorry but your argument is completely flawed from the fact that you have a bias for MT. If that was the case everyone would be doing that one style of martial art. Especially in this day and age where science would be able to prove it.

3. First we use are fist, knees, and elbows also, we just don't use them in the sport aspect of the martial art. Also better conditioned for what? Most MT practitioners compete more than TKD practitioners. In the cases of those that do compete, are styles of competing are different, which leads to different need for conditioning.

4. When those teachers come over to correct the student I don't ignore them. Masters in martial arts are not perfect, so how are the students they train perfect. Also I don't just watch the technique once, I study everything they do. From the positioning of their hands and feet, to the torquing of each section of their body as they perform each punch. Down to the impact and follow through of it. Once i study the technique I break it down in my practicing it step by step mentally before practicing it physically.

between reading Judo text and watching a master teach their students, I'd have to say no. I'd be able to learn a great deal on my own but never to the extent where some one who is in the class would be able to, because they practice the techniques on each other and drill them into their bodies. Whereas I would only get to experience the movement of what it should look like, they would have the benefit of not only preforming it on someone, but also of having the technique done to them.

The route of all martial arts is imitation.

 

1, Wait, are you kicking the posts to strengthen your feet and shins?

2. Bias doesn't make an argument flawed and I DON'T practise Muay Thai, do you think it's any coincidence that good stricking in a free enviroment often looks the same and applies the same mechanics?

3. Muay Thai practitioners understand and practise their knees and elbows on un-willing participants. Also Muay Thai guys hit harder, can fight for longer, and take more of a beating.

4, Apply second part of your answer to your first.

 

Picture me laughing at your idiocy while simultaniously wiping my hands of you

 

Don't think he's listening but the thread is about what to train TKD with not instead of. I know what I'd do and I know what you'd do but each to their own. Think Matrix, some people just aren't ready to leave it and in fairness if he's having fun then it's all good

 

1. To slowly build up the density of the shin bone. I don't kick them hard enough to cause myself pain or to make me stonger.

2. Yes, you're right bias doesn't necessarily make an argument flawed. No it all based on what works. Now the striking in TKD works, just the majority of people who practice TKD don't practice to go fight the same way MT practitioners do.

3. First what do you mean by "un-willing?" Also TKD fighters understand how knees and elbows work also, just the sport aspect doesn't all it to be used, so most don't train it as much. MT practitioners only appear that way because the way the rule set they fight under. If you take TKD and modify the rules to be similar to MT but still using all the same TKD techniques then you'd see the TKD fighters last just as long if not longer and take just as much of a beating. Just because the average TKD fighter conditions them selves only to the needs of the rule set, that doesn't make the martial art worse than another.

4. The only time a master has ever had to touch me to make a correction to a punch is in poomse. Boxing and Judo are completely different principles. Judo having the technique done to you lets you understand how each grab and throw should be performed and how they effect an actual person the technique is being done to. Boxing you have a bag to practice your technique on. In boxing if you cant learn the punch by having someone shows you it, then you're in the wrong sport. Now if you mean apply what I said to the sparring aspect of boxing then I can somewhat understand what you mean. But boxing and Judo are two different disciplines, I could understand if I was saying I could just watch a BJJ class and become good at it by practicing on the air.(which I in no way think is possible, unless the individual is some type of prodigy.)

No martial art is superior to another. The conditioning in each may be better in one, but that's not the art its self, but when you're ready to take the pill and come into reality I'll be waiting to great you.

 

I have to disagree on 2 of your points Zero.

Even though TKD might sometimes use elbows and knees it is nowhere near the same as MT. I have done both TKD and MT and its hard to even compare the 2 on how knees and elbows are used by each system.

I also disagree you can learn by just watching. There are so many things involved in every movement that watching is only part of the actual learning.

 

After reading through countless other threads about TKD I have begun to think that my school is one of those 'exceptions'. My master would rather us be able to use the techniques in a real situation than to look pretty doing them in point sparring.

I can agree with your right to disagree, but I know people who have never had a coach and just watch other people and imitate and are able to get in a ring and look like they have had the best coach imaginable(or at least a good one). Of course people like this are the exception, but there will always people someone who is the exception.

Edit: Although not to say that we use knees and elbows to the same extent as MT practitioners, but we do use them enough(at least in my school anyway)