Biting in Martial Arts

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussion' started by Simon, Dec 8, 2018.

  1. Simon

    Simon Moved on Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    This video has caused a few heated discussions between a few of my friends, so let's open it up to those here.

    This guy does ramble a little, so to get to the point skip to about the 5.20 mark.

    Would you, wouldn't you?

    Would the fear of bacterial transfer be a concern?

     
  2. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    I would if it were to save my life, I wouldn't unless I had to because the viral risk (hepatitis/Hiv etc, Edit although the new hepatitis treatments are amazing) and the legal ramifications, also generally biting isnt a fight ender, and if I'm already losing a fight, enraging my attacker more isn't a good plan....
     
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  3. Simon

    Simon Moved on Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    As well as the moral, legal, ethical and safety arguments was the question of how you came to be in such a situation that biting was necessary.

    It was argued that if you were in such a situation you should be asking questions as to why.

    In addition it was argued that martial skill is lacking if biting was required, so could your striking /grappling be used instead.

    I disagree with both these viewpoints.
     
  4. Dan Bian

    Dan Bian Neither Dan, nor Brian

    Getting an infection is better than being dead.

    Not getting an infection is better than getting an infection.

    Not being in such a situation in the first place is best of all.

    If I was in a serious enough situation, yes I would. I'd take the time to worry about the ramifications once I'm not dead/in danger.
     
  5. Simon

    Simon Moved on Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    Another thing for you to ponder is could you bite someone.

    I've seen plenty of those training in martial arts who struggle to actually make contact, so it's easily said, but another thing to execute.
     
  6. Morik

    Morik Well-Known Member Supporter MAP 2017 Gold Award

    I haven't given this a ton of thought, but my initial thought is that I probably would not be seeking out a bite in a self defense situation. If I got to a point where I was desperate, pinned to a wall/floor, and had something of my attacker's near enough to bite, and I was able to come up with the idea to bite at the time (through adrenaline, and not having trained it as a reflexive response), I think I'd go for it.
    If my attacker was for some reason shoving fingers into my mouth for some reason, I think I would probably bite without really thinking about it.
     
  7. Mitch

    Mitch Lord Mitch of MAP Admin

    It strikes me as an incredibly low % technique, and not one that benefits from a lot of training.

    The situations where you might be able to bite are by nature rare and desperate. You will surely have gone through all other options first, so it's right at the end of your training priorities.

    As for training it, there is little to refine, so again, little benefit in spending time training it.

    I can't help feeling that it falls into the same group of techniques as eye gouges etc; claimed by some to be fight enders and seen as a measure of how tough they are because, "there are no rules on the street, man!" The reality being that they're largely irrelevant.
     
  8. Alansmurf

    Alansmurf Aspire to Inspire before you Expire Supporter

    Some good examples of biting have been seen in the bare knuckle fights
    Ears and noses being the appendages ripped off
     
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  9. Pretty In Pink

    Pretty In Pink Moved on MAP 2017 Gold Award

    If someone tried to fish hook me I would definitely bite down on their finger.

    Other than that, I can't imagine a situation where I would be forced to bite another person from a defensive perspective. It seems so incredibly rare and hard to train that it would be had forme to do in a fight anyway.
     
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  10. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Actually there is a definite methodology to biting “correctly “ - a bite is not just a bite

    That said the threshold is lethal force/gbh for using a bite when its on the continuum; in other words when biting you had better be at risk of those or else someone else is
     
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  11. Dan93

    Dan93 Valued Member

    Opened up this thread expecting to see Paul Vunak still have one of his RAT DVD's showing him doing a Kina Mutai demo biting through a raw steak strapped to his student under a T Shirt in side control, it was timed (can't remember how long) but it was quick, he advocated lots of fast small bites rather than a bite and tear as being more effective from memory as I have not watched it in a while. Will have to dig it out later.

    Would I bite in a self defence scenario, I would only as a last resort as you would be ramping up the level of conflict and infections not withstanding would have to explain said actions legally.
     
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  12. axelb

    axelb Master of Office Chair Fu

    From the bacterial perspective, I would not have a problem, as you can still get blood spilled through other means.

    I've seen different biting methods, and the one I preferred the execution of is when you are not clasping your jaw around; instead you keep the opening small to shred with the teeth. I saw this in a video recently by Harinder Singh.

    I have in the past used the bite, with minimum peircing, and it was before I really focused on martial arts practise, so I had no technique to use. I would use it as a last resort for a distraction if I had to these days, if at all.

    Legally, I think it looks really bad! So that weighs in my thought for last resort/not at all.
     
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  13. Mitch

    Mitch Lord Mitch of MAP Admin

    Based on what?

    And I still think it's like training to take someone's eye out with a cucumber; it may be possible but it's so unlikely that you'll need it that training time is much better invested elsewhere.
     
  14. Alansmurf

    Alansmurf Aspire to Inspire before you Expire Supporter

    There's the nibble
    The chomp
    The grind
    The tear
    And the latch



    Just saying ...not that I have studied it ...

    Honest bejasus
     
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  15. Shmook

    Shmook Valued Member

    From the other side of the argument - having someone biting at you is a psychological deterrent, at least to me it was. I wanted to avoid it very strongly through fear of infection and also on some base instinct of having something feral snapping at you. It broke up my momentum and train of thought differently to the bread and butter attacks of being struck.

    They didn't get me, luckily, but I would rather take a punch or a kick any day.

    It's really not nice to have someone biting at you with intent.
     
  16. Mushroom

    Mushroom De-powered to come back better than before.

    Super low percentage. Altho I do remember a sexual assault case where the suspect got his cheek bitten and it was used as evidence. Again tho... very low percentage.

    However.... saying that, if the option was there and its a need to further my goal (of escape) then yeah I would.
     
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  17. Hannibal

    Hannibal Cry HAVOC and let slip the Dogs of War!!! Supporter

    Let me qualify: The way *I* was taught there is a method :)

    1) It is not "random", you target certain areas
    2) It is in the same UoF as deploying a weapon
    3) ANY bite has to be able to be uniterrupted - that is to say they cannot pull away or easily remove said bite
    4) There is a specific jaw alignment
    5) The bites are more like a series of circular tears
    6) It is a proximity option that is underpinned by a grappling or clinch foundation
    7) There are certain grips and holds designed to facilitate

    Look at an average BKB fight where someone bites for "real" examples of the psychological impact; as often as not the biter cannot be removed without other people intervening.

    I was at the point where I could remove a golfball sized lump of meat in around 4 seconds; once you "get it" the actual ability kinda stays with you. I havent trained Kina mutai in years, but can still demonstrate when asked quite easily.

    It is a low percentage occurrence option and one of the few things I have not done live; I have had my thumb in the eyes a few times having said that, and that is one of the support techniques to the bite so I have used the structure if nothing else

    It's not a panacea nor even particularly necessary to train in, but as with anything else it is simply another "tool" on the belt
     
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  18. Mitch

    Mitch Lord Mitch of MAP Admin

    You will make a very effective zombie one day :D
     
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  19. Alansmurf

    Alansmurf Aspire to Inspire before you Expire Supporter

    One day :)

    Mwahaaa
     
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  20. Alansmurf

    Alansmurf Aspire to Inspire before you Expire Supporter

    MASTER KEN IS WATCHING US
     

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