The realism of this debate is of course that it is unrealistic. It is highly unlikely that we're ever going to see or hear of a situation where aikido is pitted against karate in an environment where there are few rules. Training is just that.. training. we're conditioning ourselves (body and mind) to scenario which, god for bid something like that happened for real, our instinctive reaction would be advantageous and not disadvantageous. The actual technique is entirely unimportant. The kicks demonstrated in the video were clearly based on need. A need to be able to clearly illustrate the dynamics of aikido technique against karate technique, they were also timed and paced to accommodate the need for ukemi which, as I've already explained, is only present in a dojo environment "safety" restricts the level at which we can train. If we had no regard for our partner's well being, ukemi would not exist and we'd be searching for new students on a fairly regular basis. Regards
What you describe effectively sets the reason why the kicks in the video were paced and timed at the speed they were. Of course anyone with a modicum of common sense understands that a foot used in a very technical and skilled way can generate a huge amount of power. Speed and effectiveness is mainly relative to skill and attempting to apply kansetsu waza joint locking techniques on a person who has the skill to very effectively kick is.. very difficult and as you identified.. very risky however, we should train to deal with these circumstances never the less. To do that we need to be training with people who can deliver that form of attack but, do so by building up understanding of what to do and when to do it. Regards
There is much truth in that statement, and also without regard for our partner's well being Aikido would not exist either.
Oh, I meant to reply to this long ago. armanox, take care of yourself. Obey the doctor's orders and let things heal until you are well enough to get range of motion and build strength back in the area. My thoughts are that something isn't completely healed until the strength is back (this may require lifting weights and physical therapy to do so). Anyway, sorry to hear about your injury. Get well soon with a full recovery.
Thank you for your concern. Actually the hip is healing quite nicely, is usable for short periods of time (meaning I can participate in my classes, but I wouldn't be able to join a TKD or Capoera class, nor repeatidly throw kicks), and the range of motion is back to where it was a year ago. The strength of the area does not seem to have suffered significantly, but, as you said, it needs to finish healing. Hence the fact that I no longer do my morning running nor weekend 2mi biking expiditions
This thread caught my eye... Here is my background: I've got 20 plus years in ITF style Taekwon-do (basically the same as Shotokan karate). I'm also taking Jujutsu/Sambo (lots of throws and groundwork). In the past, when I was a younger man, I did full contact kickboxing. First lets talk about the spinning back kick. If anyone wants to see it used effectively I recommend you watch some old videos of Benny the Jet. It certainly isn't 'just for show'. I've even had a student, a teenage girl, break the ribs of a would be assailant using a spinning side kick. She kicked him, felt something crunch, ran like heck, looked back and saw still him squirming on the sidewalk. Like a smart girl she kept running anyway. Next let me say I have a lot of respect for the martial art of Aikido. From being a martial arts teacher my paths have crossed with Aikido teachers. For the most part I've found them to be great people that I got along with. There is the rare exception when you meet the arrogant jerk who thinks his art is the 'end all be all' of everything. Can't blame that on aikido, every art has those guys. Many of the teachers, from what I have found, have a background in Karate but now focus on aikido because they simply like it better. I can respect that. Lets talk about those techniques in the video. Could they work? Could they work against an experienced kicker like myself? You bet they could. It only takes a moment of surprise to gain the upper hand. In my time I've been surprised by plenty of people in a variety of arts during friendly sparring sessions. Will they work 100 percent of the time? Of course not. Heck most plays in American Football are designed to score a touchdown, yet everyone calls it a success if you get 5+ yards out of it. I think one of the problems with martial arts is that people expect too much out of them. Sometimes they work when it comes down to the self-defense situation and sometimes they fail. From my experience they work more often then they fail and often, when they fail the person, bad luck was the cause. Heck even UFC veterans like Genki Sudo and Lee Murray got stabbed when faced with a knife (in Genki's case the poor guy was just in the wrong place at the wrong time). And as much as I love Sambo/Jujutsu I'm pretty sure the wrong self-defense option for my teenage female student would have been to try and grapple with a larger middle aged man in the middle of the night.
Watch Benny the jet to learn spinning back kick???? Change that to watch Benny the jet to learn anything to do with fighting. Koyo
Im new to this whole website and i have enjoyed reading this thread. In responce to the comments on Aikido being ineffective against karate etc...... Im trained in kungfu and have done aikido for only 2 years, and find it helps me a lot in my sparring. I have sparred with many kungfu ppl, a few karate ppl Not to mention a MMA friend. Im not in any way trying to brag anything here. Just simply saying that aikido can be used v effectively against other martial artists. I found that i could attack with kungfu and when i found an oppertunity i could use an aikido throw and/or lock to finish things. Iv only got 2 years of aiki under my belt so im not expecting miracles, but im certainly convinced of how it can help me. If i was a PURE aikidoka with no previous training in kungfu, i dont believe that 2 years training in aiki alone would be enough to fight an equivilant in any other MA. As the learning curve is huge. But like another MA "Taichi" , 10 years down the line you will be a force to be reckoned with. (considering you spar regularly) AIKIDO against kicks : This is the main thread title so i may aswell give an opinion. I have found there to be v little training against kicks in Aikido, although moves can be adapted to suit. 1 effective technique that is actually in the aikido vs kickboxing video, from a previous post. This is a turning kick to the waiste from the karate guy a forarm block and lock from the aikidoka. In the vid its setup slowly and looks unlikely to pulloff. But with conditioned arms it will work. Thanks for reading, would be great to hear about any of your experiences using aikido Hope u r all training hard and keeping well
Hi Patrino welcome to MAP check out martial arts of aikido training thread your input would be of interest. koyo
