Aikido attacks

LOL at the tortoise pic:

Guy's saying: "Go on! Grab my wrist!" Tortoise just defuses the situation...

As for Dave's koan, I'm just going to have to beat myself with a shinai in a waterfall before I get the answer.

But before I go, Dave's post No11 sums up the thread-starter's question nicely. I love Dave's being able to train aiki purely for budo. I like it for that and also for SD. When I train it nowadays (not enough unfortunately but just got a new job so that'll hopefully change) I always try to get a good balance of traditional and 'modern' attacks in, so I do in fact go for boxing combos and whatever too. I don't think I'm mixing the arts because the response (proactive or not) is aiki anyway. I also don't see anything wrong with pulling/throwing nage over if their finishing position (they shouldn't even finish but that's another story! ) after they've thrown you is bad either. Doesn't have to be competitive, just randori.

 

I'm lost, Mr Punch. 'Randori' is used in Aikido to describe competitive Tomiki-style (Judo influenced) stuff with points scored etc etc. so I don't understand your point.
We in Shudokan (Yoshinkan) use 'freestyle' for occasions when we perform a fast and hard session with a succession of random attacking and defensive techniques. I'm also a bit confused by your reference to a shinai - we use a bokken or a live bladed katana - what style do you study?

Aikido, in addition to a formal curriculum, has offered me an insight into Self Defence AND Spirituality. Take whatever you need from Aikido......but please put back even more.

 

Randori is also used in aikikai and various other styles to mean jiyugeikou or freestyle practice. No points, nothing competitive, just free practice... that was my point.

Yep, that's what I meant. What was your point?

That was a joke. Don't tax yourself!

I started with a style similar to slightly hardcore aikikai, which then mellowed to sub-ki-aikido (so I left... but coincidentally because I left the country) then I trained at Tada Shihan's dojo in Gessoji in Kichijouji, and then under a guy with some rather nice daito-ryu based stuff...

Style shouldn't matter. If you agree (or don't) with what I'm saying fair enough...

And by all means comment on the main body of my post (the serious bit!).

So you do agree with me then? Except: 'in addition to a formal curriculum' means what in this case? Are you saying your formal curriculum does not include Self Defence and Spirituality?

 

I think I've grasped what you meant but I'm still a bit confused - probably a combination of treating a vicious cold with vicious alcohol!

Shudokan had a very tightly defined traditional martial arts syllabus, largely Yoshinkan derived, which comprised grading techniques and was very closely controlled and structured throughout. Our 'freestyle' grading elements incorporated these formal attack and defence techniques but for higher grades, expected to deal with random and fast attacks, other attacks and defences were thrown in.

I've never heard of 'randori' in the context you describe, only in competitve arts like Tomiki or Judo, so thanks for the info, although I'm not 100% convinced that it is not being used a trifle loosely , as my understanding of freestyle work was 'Jiyuwaza' in Japanese - can you clarify more, especially as you are in Tokyo!?

You could argue the Shudokan syllabus included elements of 'spirituality' and elements that may be useful for 'self defence'. I guess most Aikido organisations would say the same, as IMHO it is often essentially a strong motivational factor in our choice of the art - if 'aiki' is in our hearts it then becomes a toss up how we percieve the rest ('do' or 'jutsu', 'art' or fighting skills').

However, other than the formal syllabus, in our dojo we trained in some additional meditation techniques (our dojo was renovated internally by us and had a room upstairs used for Zen etc.).

Blessed with students and teachers from a wide variety of backgrounds from Shotokan Karate, Judo, Iaido, BaGua (forgive spelling), we added a diverse range of self defence techniques which only a few would perceive as Aikido forms but some may understand as being performed with the same 'attitude' learned through hard training in Aikido.

Self Defence , in addition to a range of unarmed techniques, included such things as using a kubotan in attack and defence. We also practised defence against the baseball bat, bottle, chain etc etc , which certainly would not be part of our formal syllabus (as opposed to tanto, jo and bokken).

We were visited by Okabayashi Sensei (wonderful Daito Ryu instructor) and others from such arts as Shorinji Kempo and gladly took anything which worked for use in the dojo and out on the street.

I speak in the past tense because I no longer train in Shudokan, which has become a large and successful commercial organisation and acts as an umbrella for everything from very traditional japanese MA to modern firearms and survival skills.

We should all train in Aikido for our own reasons. There are 3 paths IMHO:
Treat Aikido like Daito Ryu and strictly adhere to a fixed set of traditional forms and preserve the art intact over the decades.
or
Take the art and seek to improve it and 'modernise' it to suit the 21st century.
or
Get utterly fed up with our 'masters' and take our Aikido, add what we personally want to teach, and set up as an independant organisation without the 'Aikido' label.

Personally, I've only one rule - learn from someone with a proven lineage and a sound reputation (whether it's Aikido, Iaido or Tibetan Buddhism) and use it to improve my life. IMHO this must include passing on what I know and 'giving back' to the community what has generously been given to me.

Finally, I would say that all I have learned from involvement in Aikido is not compartmentalised into Spirituality or Self Defence etc but may be expressed simply as: 'Self Improvement'.

 

A teacher that travels to various dojo's teached us once that aikido has a way to attack. Not with a flat fist like in karate, but you punch in the way you are holding a tanto or something. So you don't punch with your knuckels.

 

Aikido is based on sword and spear principles so the strikes tend to be open handed "cuts" and closed "thrusts".Delivered on the move to vital or weak points on the opponent. This includes weak points of balance.

Strong wrists and forearms coupled with the trinity of intent technique and body alignment are the basis for aikido atemi.

regards koyo