You are cross training if you have karateka,judoka,mauy thai., kendoka all visiting your club or you visiting their clubs. Tohei's "ki aikido" was proven to be utterly ineffective as a martial art hence the change to ki society. I saw numerous demonstrations of ki aikido when it existed and it was of no martial arts value at all.
Thats great Thats all fine and dandy, however, I seriously doubt that once you leave the dojo and should you happen to be attacked, that your attacker is going to be a well trained uke able to take break falls. Injury would be unaviodable in this instance as that person would more than likely fall on a elbow, knee, head...and then how pretty would aikido look? It looks pretty when both people know what they are doing.
If by that you mean well aimed and applied soft overcomes reckless and thoughtless strong, then yes. Like the old adage: Tactics beat firepower. But when tactics by both are well thought out, and well executed; firepower prevails (all other factors being equal). What is more effective, striking into the path of least resistance weakly giving uke time to react, or with power and commitment? I know which one I'd put my money on. (Forgive me all if I misused the term uke, not a JMArtist so not used to the term ).
Even better The less people that do it the better. You see, aikido is not about gathering the largest mass of students in the world and making money at it because that mass of students pays you, or the school, or orginization at the top. That's what other martial arts orginizations do. People hate aikido because it is a discipline that takes a long time to learn, and most folks want to be masters, open up their own school, and make money in just a few short years. Once they realize that their ideas, and assumptions that they came into the dojo with will in all probability not MATERIALIZE they are easily defeated, and may quit martial arts altogether, or go back to or find something that is easier to learn.
Why in heaven's name should we attempt to look pretty. If you are seriously attacked then the attacker shall be seriously injured. Or if you are intent on looking pretty you are in deep trouble.
Anyways... How easy it is to miss the real point of the OPs question and topic! I see that out of the five pages of posts, only 3 or 4 of the posters actually attempted to answer this individuals question. The rest of us degraded and reduced ourselves to a bit of squabbling. Probably par for the course on these forums?:hat:
If you misenterpretted the looking pretty for not being able to do aikid, that was my fault. My intention was that when the other person who isn't a trained uke falls on their head and blood is pouring onto the street, THEN it does not look as pretty as it does in the dojo. Now, you standing there after throwing this poor sould who's mistake it was to attack you, will indeed look quite pretty, especially compared to him/her/they... In anycase, the responsibility of not injuring that person pretty much flies out the window because they are not trained to fall, trained to know what is happening next (and at times what happens next is at light blinding speed) nor are they trained to "resist." All in all, they will invaribly become injured.
I think you may have misread this. It is not the difference between attack and resist as you define them. It is the difference between compliant and non-compliant. The difference between you know what his attack will be and he will work with you (a drill) and you have no clue what his is going to do and he is going to do his best (within the parameters of the contest/training) to win.
oh dear oh dear lmao So how often do you dislocate the shoulder of your uke or break his arm? You must have a high turn over of training partners. Please come on I'd be interested in discussing your training methodology and how you get by the inherent flaws in the various drills and methods of dojo training.
I think more aikidoka don't get involved in MMA because the sort of arrogance, condescension, and baseless assertions of moral superiority that we've seen in this thread are, unfortunately, pretty common in the Aikido community from what I've seen. Unfortunately, aikidoka like Koyo who advocate hard training against resisting opponents, as well as plenty of cross-training, seem to be the exception, not the rule. Actually, wrist locks are totally legal. People don't use them more because they don't seem to work very well. "Small joint manipulation" is illegal, but that's fingers and toes, not wrists. Are finger-locks so essential to what you do that you couldn't fight/compete without them?
If you have to face someone in the street he shall have absoltely NO INTENTION of doing ukemi. His idea of resistance shall be to tighten up his arm head butt,punch with his free arm,kick or knee..not at all like someone who has been trained (brainwashed) into doing ukemi. Hi Mitlov. I can tell you that those who hide ineffective techniques behind "spiritualy superior philosophy" are held in just as much contempt by true aikidoka as they are by other martial artists.
Don't do it for me... do it for yourself mate. Or you could smugly carry on being the sort of deluded, martial fantasist, idiot who advocates pulling a knife out in a brawl?
I always love the mythical street encounter many harp on. Unless you're a total tool and douche, you aren't getting into fights on a regular enough basis to justify spending countless hours and money training in a complex traditional martial art designed to develop oneself (ie "do" vs "jutsu" though that distinction isn't as clear in modern MA). There isn't much of a need as ninja and bullies don't commonly attack me at random. Granted I have done two aikido techniques outside the dojo when assailed in the 10 years I've trained...and even that is an exception. Which goes back to my original point, my training is based on an assumption that it will improve myself. And my belief...being a traditionalist...is that self development can only be achieved through good hard, robust, training....but not negligent. We train how to take ukemi for each basic technique. In fact, if one doesn't know how to do ukemi properly on some movements, they may in fact become injured. This is why ukemi is taught as its own technique/s. Most important, for my training, is control. I know some aikidoka think they are above such an offensive word...but for my training its a word to live by. If aikido is controlling others, one must first know how to control themselves. Hence many hundreds of hours spent training tandoku and sotai kihon dosa to "fit into" specific movements determined by someone else before attempting to actually enact control on others. In order for this control its imperative one must have control of themselves. Some of my favorite aikido examples are when uke's f-up, lose themselves, and the technique looks quite ugly but nage is a well balanced, calm center of the ugly flailing uke collapsing oddly around him. This training is transphysical, effecting all aspects of the student...not just the technique. At least, that's why I train. I find it extremely useful in the wars I've been involved in, let alone dealing with day to day stresses. Transmitting physical control, of oneself and partner, to emotive control...emotional responsibility as my teacher calls it. But if you pretend and just speak about these things...you become an academic. For my training, to reach a real substantive level in my personal and professional life, I need to train in a tactile, robust, and real way. Shugyo, overcome stress and difficulties, get banged up a little...and get back up again. Hyaku shaku kanto ho ippo sumeo, jiki shin kore dojo, joe hikan shin sui shogo, ken o fumo...these ideas, implemented into my training have helped greatly in a real way in the real world. As for three people in my organization, that real way is having fun competing in the MMA world...for me, it helps me get through the four deployments I've been involved in. And I don't mean doing ikkyo to Bas Rutten or Osama bin Laden.
