Discussion in 'Tai chi' started by tccstudent, Apr 12, 2006.
Ok we could take the reasonable route but lets try another.
Are you able you use empty force?
I will answer when you tell me what it is?
I was hoping we could meet up and make a video for the forum based on you using empty force on me. This would silence your critics. I will personally vouch for authenticity and give my word of honour that all events are shown as they happened. We would agree the conditions beforehand and publish them on the forum.
What do you think?
You mean you like sparring?
No , I don't think that would be a good demonstration. I think we could come up with a few training scenarios that would not put anyone at risk.
Infact could get members of the forum to suggest a suitable test.
From what I've gathered, the energy work (misnamed empty force) is about trying to read the energy of the situation. The clips are as a result of this single aspect. The teacher and students are fully compliant and are trying to read and follow the energy. The aim is to help the person to be able to apply their taiji better. It is not an end in itself.
The only way to test would be to get two sets of people.
Set one train without this type of training
Set two train with this type of training.
Both sets still study the other aspects of the art.
The test is simple. Get the two sets to 'test' each other.
Problem is it seems that you'll have a long wait on your hands for the two groups to attain a 'decent' level of competency. Otherwise the results are meaningless as you will have no control group. How would we be able to tell that the two people were evenly matched? All in all a pointless exercise.
Do I do energy work? No.
Do I have concerns about the clips? some, as they are misleading without any explanation as to what they are about.
First I require a definition of what you wish to be demonstrated. Civility requires you to be precise and specific, or you get no conversation.
If you are refering to the clips and me doing the same things to you. Hell I can't even do the *same* things to my students, *everyone* behaves differently. We are having the usual pointless discussion as you don't even know what it is that you are refering to. You are reacting from pre-concieved ideas and prejudice. You are welcome to come to train in class when ever you wish and you will be given things when you are ready. There were two people in the clips, their reaction are specifically different. There is a third one I did at the same time, but his reactions are so hilarious, even to us, I thought it would be prudent not to put it up. When and if you ever understand the energetic what I say might make sense, but you are metaphorically looking up the **** when it requires looking down the throat
What people want to know is can empty force have any effect on a non-compliant subject?
A negative result is just as important as a positive. So Richard could bring some students to demonstrate a positive effect.
I am open to richard suggesting any method of demonstrating empty force with me?
If he would feel more comfortable, he can request an independent third party to join us.
What is empty force and why do you presume I do it?
Now you are evading. Can you produce effects like those shown in the video at the start of this thread on a non-compliant subject?
Hasn't this been answered elsewhere? I think the answer was and is no.
Let's hear from Richard thanks.
Yes in most cases - would you *see* it as in the clips - no. The main problem is you do not understand what you are refering to. This is all like going back to December when I joined the group and starting it all over again. How many times do I have to answer the same questions, it is like being stuck in a loop as I refered to with Liokault. By the way Blood Sucker is almost spot on.
The only answer I have for you in order to preserve my time is link on my name and read my posts.
This will now be the standard answer.
When you ordain to answer my questions, I might reply to you.
Ok. So, the compliant subject would most likely not notice anything, and not move like in the vid clips and the only person that would see the effect would be you?
Hey... I can do this as well.. right now I am manipulating the bloke sitting across from me, of course only I am aware of this, he is not and there are no physical manifestations to show this.
What makes you so sure you are not deluding yourself?
Also, what is the purpose of having these clips on your site? It’s like saying hey look what I can do, and when proof is asked you say na, you don’t understand how it works..
You can, GREAT!
let's recreate the action in the video. It's ok if people don't *see* how's its achieve as long as the result is the same. i.e. me being easily repelled by you.
Nah mate, you see you don’t understand how it works, you have to come train at my school first.
Though, right at this instance I am manipulating you at your exact location, of course it is not noticeable to you, and only I am aware of this. If we tried to recreate this "phenomena" on video, with my students you would see a noticeable physical manifestation, whereas if it were you, you would most probably not see anything, of course unless you trained at my school for a while.. makes sense doesn’t it.. :Angel:
Ridiculous and pointless!
If you are happy with your understanding why do you get so wound up about things you don't understand. Do you see the blood coursing through your veins unless you cut yourself. Do you see your liver function, no! because they are internal. If you wish to demonstrate you have to make it external and like *all* forms of demonstration if the subject doesn't want to play there is no demonstration.
First clip can be done with hidden megnets
Second clip can be done with gravity control as you see the plates are not fully at a 90 degrees angle or you can done it with body swet or anti-oxygen by anti-oxygen I mean if you press a bowl on you're belly and when you squeeze the oxygen out it will stay there for a period of time
Third clip can be gone with a charged hand as you can see the ball is made out of plastic material that conducts electricity fair well, so if you have a swetty hand and charged on fur or what ever that consists negative charges it will make the plastic ball move. Recall the law of attraction and repulsion, negative charge repell another negative charge.
Finally the first clip is telling you can attract object by using "chi" but the last clip tell you can push away object by using "chi"
Wow. You sure make many assumptions. How do you know what sort of stuff I train, maybe its more “energetic” than your method. How do you know I don’t “understand”? What makes you think I’m getting wound up? Assumption is the mother of all …. If you can really do what you think you can, then you should really know better than to make so many assumptions.
I’m quite comfortably sitting in my chair, breathing calmly and enjoying myself. But I guess if I was so easily swayed by my emotions, then I would be getting wound up because in my experience people who claim to be able to do certain things, can and are willing to demonstrate.
Whereas you claim, and are not willing to demonstrate. Which reeks of either delusion or a con. Quite simple.
If you want people to listen, you have to be able to show. Otherwise your words are empty.
Actually the clip is not really telling anything, it is your mind making assumptions, well unless you speak Russian, then it might be telling you something. Who is to say that “chi” cannot both pull and push, and that the two clips showing such are just two different manifestations of the same thing.
Regardless, we can assume all we want on how and why these things rare happening in the vids, but in reality the only way to know is to experience. Hence vids showing bizarre phenomena are in themselves empty, without the subject in the vids being able to demonstrate such phenomena in reality, and for others to experience. Richard can tell you a bit about this. :Angel:
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