A number of people in my bjj club do yoga for some of the above similiar reasons. In BJJ one needs to be strong, flexible and relaxed. For me power yoga fits the bill.
As for opening up the spritual aspects of yoga, or speeding the results up, is or does many forget of just experience the moment and not the preconceaved notions of what the end game is? How are you suppose to understand and experience something if you keep looking ahead of what you think your results should be, instead of just becoming and learning what is happening in the moment. kudalini, chi kung and kuji-kiri etc.... many practice these disciplines in there belief they will gain quick advantages without really understanding the principles of practice of the exercise! This in a simpler term is the same as a weight lifter not learning to grow from exercises, practice or experience and instead takes steriods for results. I believe it's the the moment that maters, the art of self discovery to learn from your own experiences. the quick resuts could just lead you to a dead end if you don't know where you came from in the first place!
The 'body balance' classes that are run by many gyms are essentialy yoga, but taught by someone who qualified on a weekend course, they can be ok, but really a good yoga or pilates teacher from a qualified school is so much better, much like budo really! I've heard much about Bikram Yoga teacher training that read like pyramid selling, I personally would stay away if I had other more ethical teachers available.
But the problem is, I think a lot of Yoga teachers are not really that qualified either. To have a good mastery of all the aspects necessary for safe and complete Yoga or Qigong training (which would also require knowing what to do when people have problems) is a very big time investment that should involve a few years of rigorous practice at the absolute minimum. I think many Yoga teachers think they've gotten a pretty good idea with their 100-hour certification courses, not realizing they've only scratched the surface. Not having mastered the energy aspect, you're not likely to get into to it practicing under them... however, if you accidentally trigger something, they won't be able to help you either. I personally only do Qigong, as I consider it gentler and somewhat more "natural " than Yoga. However, like I said, I've heard very good things about Iyengar Yoga, as Iyengar himself trained for years under an authentic Yogi in India and his organization apparently has very high requirements for its certified instructors. It also teaches all aspects, from the postures, to movements, to the breathing, abdominal churning, meditation and so on. I just feel like, if you're going to do Yoga or Qigong than do Yoga or Qigong for real with someone trained in what they're all about. If you just want stretching and balance, go to the dynamic balance aerobics class or whatever. Besides the potential risks I mentioned earlier (which I admit are pretty low), I also just don't like the trend of Yoga-as-aerobics for the same reason I don't like Taiji-for-old-people. It erodes the quality and public understanding of Yoga and Taiji for them to be turned into calisthenics for old people when they're actually so much more (a real martial art and a system of energy cultivation for mind-body health and/or spiritual enlightenment, respectively). I mean, I know it's a good thing if it gets people moving and whatnot... but I'd still rather discourage the trend in the hopes people will eventually start thinking of Yoga and Taiji as what they are, rather than what community centers have turned them into. As to whether Qigong and Yoga can be beneficial to Ninjutsu, BJJ or any martial art, the answer is definitely yes... but to get to the more serious benefits requires you delve into the whole energy thing, which you should do under careful guidance. If all you want is increased relaxation and flexibility than I again recommend the balancing aerobics class or even Pilates.
What constitutes "the serious benefits" is the eye of the beholder and end user. I do BJJ for conditioning and hobby primarily. Others do it for competition or self defense. All of these are benefits I do yoga for strength and flexibilty. You do yoga etc for "energy" and that is fine. Yoga has been demonstrated to be safe and effective for improving the strength and flexibility of joints especially the spine. With an aging population (including myself ), maintaining optimimal health and quality of life are important goals. I believe we should use what works as it is done carefully and properly. Being a purist in any field can often get in the way of progress IMO.
I think that Onyomi's concern is that even if you think that you are only doing yoga for strength and flexibility, you *ARE* participating in an activity *INTENDED* to tap energy, whether you like it or not. This can pose danger to people who may not be ready for it.... Becoming "self aware in the moment" (as kiai stated) is a noble goal. But what would you do if you ended up at "full consciousness"--not being able to sleep (because you are always energized), hearing voices, having permanent ringing in your ears or daily headaches, hallucinating, and so forth? Most people are not ready for that, let alone, think that such things are even possible. I believe this is Onyomi's concern. Correct me if I am wrong.... REFERENCE 1 "Lim & Lin (1996:369ff) describe a 57-year-old Chinese-American man who presented with a three-week history of auditory and visual hallucinations. The patient had begun qi-gong practices as therapy for chronic problems with kidney stones. After several days of intensive qi-gong, he began hearing voices telling him how to practice qi-gong, and to believe that he had contacted beings from another dimension. He sought help from the qi-gong masters, but to no avail. His wife brought him to see a psychiatrist, who diagnosed him with schizophreniform disorder and treated him with anti-psychotic medications. Additional information on qi-gong psychotic reaction has not been readily available. The majority of information on qi-gong itself is to be found in journals of acupuncture and homeopathic medicine." Lim, Russell F., and Lin Keh-Ming. (1996) "Cultural formulation of psychiatric diagnosis: Case No. 03: Psychosis following qi-gong in a Chinese immigrant." Culture, Medicine, and Psychiatry 20:369-378. Source: http://kundalini.se/eng/stories.html REFERENCE 2 There are many Kundalini casualties similar to mine. Kundalini energy literally crippled me mentally in terms of what academic achievements and future accomplishments I may have had. Some people it has destroyed. My best friend who was initiated into the same tradition as mine wound up in a psychiatric ward with a full blown nervous breakdown from which he never fully recovered. In the view of most wide-eyed believers that could not have happened: the Guru or God would not have let it. Here is a hard lesson I have learned in my lifetime: Not all spiritual stuff is safe, even if you believe "God only gives you what you can handle." Pray to God, but tie down your camel. Source: http://members.aol.com/ckress/support.html REFERENCE 3 - Kundalini arousal especially occurs as an unintentional side effect of yoga, meditation, healing or body-and psychotherapy. Some of the other releasing factors can be: Births, unrequited love, celibacy, intense studies, physical traumas, deep sorrow, high fever and drug intake. But Kundalini arousal can also occur suddenly without apparent course. - When the process of Kundalini had lasted in me for about ten years, I was too tired out to be able to earn a living on my own. I went to a doctor and said: "It is completely crazy, my Kundalini has been aroused. What shall I do?" And then I told him about my state. - "You are deeply psychotic", he said. "I will send you to a good psychiatrist. The energy you are talking about does not exist. You have serious misconceptions". - I got sick pay and later disability pension, diagnosed as paranoid schizophrenic, without first having been taken in for a mental examination. No doctor that I spoke to concerning my pension believed my talk about Kundalini. - But in the yoga literature I got a reasonable explanation of what had happened to me. Yes, I understood that the secret purpose of yoga and meditation actually is to release the kundalini force. When Kundalini reaches the brain, it is said to be stimulating the brain cells that are normally not used, so that a higher state of consciousness is reached. Else Johansen continues and says that the doctors' ignorance of Kundalini has led to diagnoses like hypochondria, escapism, inflammation of the brain, and calcification of the brain. Source: http://kundalini.se/eng/natverk.html Hope that helps! -ben
I appreciate your note. However psychotic symptoms can occur without Kundalini work. There is approximately a 1% incidence of schizophrenia in the general population with some genetic predisposition noted. There are of course other causes of psychotic symptoms such as drugs, toxins, infections, tumors, mother-in-laws! etc. What would need to be seen is either observational studies comparing rates of psychotic symptoms btw appropriately match groups of "normal" individuals and people doing energy work. Untill then given the relatively high prevelance of psychotic symptosm it is only supposition. Even the issue of causation would still need to be addressed. On the other hand perhaps you remember the adage: The difference btw the madman and the mystic is that the mystic knows not to tell everyone of their symptoms!
I agree. With the recent increase in yoga in the States, it would be interesting to see if towns in which yoga centers open experience an uptick in mental disorders. Now, if I just had $30m to do the study.... -ben
Ive just learnt Tai Chi- Qigong {18 movements} and am going to learn the next stage of Tai Chi {24 movements} I learnt from a traditional Chinese Acupuncturest whom I was sent to for a wrist problem that was also fixed. I love it,it does make you fell energizied and doe,s wonders for your Ninjitsu,I would recommend it to higher grade MAists only though,it is strong stuff. Ive also done Yoga in the past,that was really good too,but different feeling to Tai Chi. Go hard or go home.
That stuff is exactly what concerns me. Like I said, I don't personally know anyone who's had such severely bad experiences, but I think that's cuz using my teacher's qigong methods it will take you a few years of diligent practice at the very least to reach that level of affecting your brain. Like I also said, I've been through some of this transformation myself, and while the final results have been great, the process was a little scary at times... and this was with very gradual, gentle methods. With forceful, rushed methods or if the changes start occurring without your intending it, I imagine it could be a lot scarier and more painful... maybe so much so that it would cause permanent mental scarring... as it seems to have in all these personal accounts you can read on the internet. This is why I say, if you want to do Qigong or Yoga, do it with a highly-qualified teacher who knows what to do if something goes wrong and who understands the energy aspect. Even if your goals are relatively modest, like you're getting up in years and just want a little more mobility, strength and balance, it's still safer to do it with a highly qualified teacher just in case. Also, always keep in mind what the ultimate goals of Qigong and Yoga are: to affect your brain and your mind-body relationship. The way to make the transformation safe is to use gradual, relaxed methods. This is why I'm trying to steer people away from Yang and Chia, besides the fact that learning it on your own isn't a good idea in the first place. Yand and Chia recommend techniques like sucking in the anus, which my school would consider a forceful, "last-resort" method. The way to make it safe is for it be natural... if you can make the energy flow up the spine with a very natural, relaxed breath and using only minor, gentle bodily adjustments, then when it does start flowing your body will be more ready for it. Same with sinking to the dantian... if you're already familiar with the motion and breathing, then when energy starts flowing to your head you'll be more prepared to sink it... same with the whole "Kundalini" thing... if the meridians to your head, arms and legs are open before it happens and you have a high degree of control, then you won't be suddenly struck by uncontrollable hallucinations. You can go through a gradual process of entering the meditation "environment" which then undergoes a gradual progression from colors to actual visions, through wind, clouds, water, fire, and so on. This way, you "open" the parts of your brain Yoga and Qigong are designed to stimulate, but only after your nerves and body are physically prepared for it. Even then, it's pretty scary and crazy at times... and the more you use methods like contracting the anus, the greater your chances of jumping to a higher level than you're prepared for. This is why I'm especially against so-called Kundalini Yoga...they use all kinds of forceful "locks" and "holds," in addition to sometimes using high-pitched music or other such unusual methods in an attempt to skip over the gradual physical progression and right into full-blown, mind-altering experiences. This may work out great for some people, but I think the casualty rate will also be much higher than with a more gentle, complete system like Iyengar Yoga or traditional Qigong (I especially like "Buddhist School" Qigong, which I consider more natural and relaxed than "Daoist School"). This is why I'm recommending people either do something like Pilates or else do Yoga/Qigong with a very serious mindset and under a qualified teacher. Most people will be fine... but you don't want to run the risk of having something happen to you like those Bencole quoted. Admittedly, some of those people may have already been prone to delusions and mental problems... but speaking from personal experience, if you underestimate the effects Yoga/Qigong can have on your brain, you may live to regret it.
Yes, it really does depend on if you want to deliberateley explore higher energy. And yes, it is best done with a suitably qualified instructor who has been through it and knows what can go wrong, and how to fix any issues. (as with anything). There are plenty of "fluffy" yoga and "fluffy" tai chi teachers out there who will do zero for most people's voltage. The "good stuff" remains the good stuff though, and I rather feel there is a lack of information available to many neophyte students who are not told what they are actually learning or where it can lead. That, i think, is a more major issue. Consumer awareness and teachers being prepared to tell students what they are really teaching. And taking responsibility for mentoring and guiding their students through the "wierd bits". Not everyone wants to ride on the space shuttle, for example. Especially not when they think they are getting the no. 42 bus! Some do however, different courses for different horses. Jen.
In the Uk the British Wheel of Yoga has been around since 1967 - and has over 3,000 qualified teachers, If 'accidental Kundalini awakening' this was a likely problem, I belive the authorities would be closing classes as a danger to public mental health. If anyone is concerned then they make want to try the western alternative pilates: http://pilates.about.com/od/historyofpilates/a/JPilates.htm '' Pilates was drawing on strong personal experience in fitness. He had been an unhealthy child, which led him to seek out and study many kinds of self-improvement systems. Pilates drew from studies in Eastern practices such as Yoga and Zen. He was also inspired by the ancient Greek ideal of man perfected in development of body, mind and spirit. Pilates studied anatomy and developed himself as a body builder, a wrestler, gymnast, boxer, skier and diver. After WWI, Pilates briefly returned to Germany where his reputation as a physical trainer/healer preceded him. He worked briefly training the Hamburg Military Police in self-defense and physical training. In 1925 he was asked to train the German army. Instead, he packed his bags and took a boat to New York City. On the boat to America Joseph met Clara, a nurse, who would become his wife. Pilates went on to establish a studio in New York and Clara worked with him as he evolved the Pilates method of exercise, invented the Pilates exercise equipment, and trained students. ''
The problem is that the "authorities" need to actually believe that accidentally tapping into "the energy of the universe" because one is standing on one leg is plausible. I doubt that is going to happen any time soon. -ben
Exactly. Denial is not a river in Egypt. Engage rant mode; When you look around, at least in the UK for help with accidental awakening, you get bafflment and, frankly, patronised. From yoga teachers and chi kung community alike in my experience. "No, no, symptoms can't be happening like you describe. WE don't do it that way...." The western medical community seem to have no idea what the symptoms mean; it's just not in their frame of reference. They don't "do" spiritual and energetic crises. Ergo, you're crazy. The Christian churches generally don't seem to have a clue, even though many K awake christians equate this to the Holy Spirit / shekeinah. Then of course so many fluffy new agers muddying the waters. TCM can often offer some help generally. It happens! It's natural! So many people seem to treat developing higher energy as dirty laundry though. So many people going through unnecessarily rough Process and illness because they have no clue what is happening to them. Disengage rant mode; I'm actually genuinely surprised and pleased we're having this conversation out in public. It's only going to happen that people know about this bioenergetic metamorphosis and spiritual awakening process, if the information is brought into the public domain. HUGS! Jen.
’The problem is that the "authorities" need to actually believe that accidentally tapping into "the energy of the universe" because one is standing on one leg is plausible. I doubt that is going to happen any time soon.’’ As you’ve already said, the authorities (the health protection agency in uk) wouldn’t need to belive in anything, they would see a cluster of people all with similar symptoms, and close the common denominator pending investigation into possible poisoning/infection from food/air-conditioning etc. See http://www.hpa.org.uk/ for more information. Its my own view that the majority of people suffering from Kundalini problems were mentally Ill before there practise and that through the moulding affects of this practice, there symptoms spontaneously arrive via a psychophysiology route.
Quote by Kusa, Its my own view that the majority of people suffering from Kundalini problems were mentally Ill before there practise and that through the moulding affects of this practice, there symptoms spontaneously arrive via a psychophysiology route.[/QUOTE] probably, but It could be also an individual could be more open or sensitive to those areas. take me for instance i can feel energy fields i always could, it never made me powerful or rich i never really tried to tap into it or had anyone teach me how to, but i can feel them ( belive me or not, it's the truth.) I also can sense emotion to a very strong degree, not much help in my life, in fact it can be rather annoying! these skills i seemed to inherent,but i can not denied it is not happening. I don't know me being a down to earth person what would happen if i did some energy style kinda yoga, if i would have different results or experiences because i already can sense these things naturally.
How? How does it manifest itself? Can you do it on the phone? via e-mail? Do you have to be in close physical proximity to someone?
It seems to manifest like how you feel when you get chills that sort of fealling not exactly but as close i can explain it to some one else. Phone conversation is slightly different, it more like thoughts, i could talk to some one and something doesn't seem right, its not words just thoughts, and the closer i am to a person the more intense it is, sometimes to a point where someone could be angry and i feel just as if i was angry but can't figure out what or why i feel this way,and they don't have to show anger either for me to sense them, in fact thats how i realise i could strongly sense things like this, i would confront people, most of the people i knew, i would ask them is there something wrong with them today, and nine out of ten they say yes or denie it but latter confessed that they had problems that day. thats kinda why it can be annoying it can get in the way of how your own feelings are. I know it sounds strange but for me i just accept them i remember these experiences since i was just a child.
If you google ''unconscious non verbal communication'' you may read another explaination to this phenonomon.
