Xing-yi-quan foot problems?

Discussion in 'Internal Martial Arts' started by Kibbles, Jan 5, 2011.

  1. Kibbles

    Kibbles The Iron Bucket

    I've heard from some kung-fu practitioners (none of whom practice xingyiquan) that a lot of xingyi practitioners eventually get "foot problems" from the the style's stepping motions. Supposedly xingyiquan is "hard on the feet" causing a lot of strain and impact shock.

    Of course, this could all be nonsense propagated by ignorance so I was wondering if any xingyi students and masters here could explain if training related foot injuries are in any way common, if they've ever seen or had any, and what, if anything makes xingyiquan footwork unique.
  2. Ular Sawa

    Ular Sawa Valued Member

    Never heard this one. Granted there are different styles of xingyi out there but I never experienced any problems in my practice.
  3. El Medico

    El Medico Valued Member

    Could this be related to stamping?

    Improperly done over time it can damage knees,I would suppose feet too.
  4. Fish Of Doom

    Fish Of Doom Will : Mind : Motion Supporter

    it might be due to improper stamping, or due to stamping on an inappropriate surface. can't imagine, say, a concrete floor being very good in the long run.
  5. Constant Flux

    Constant Flux Valued Member

    When i was studying Hsing I in California i dont recall there being alot of stamping, if anything the footwork felt more rooted and graceful. Foot problems were never an issue.

    When i was learning Southern Long Fist in Miami though, there was quite a bit of stamping and i do recall some of us getting this serious pain in the shins at the beginning but eventually the pain went away and we were good as new.
  6. El Medico

    El Medico Valued Member

    Depends on what/whose HI you're doing.

    Southern Long Fist? Is that modern Wu Shu?
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2011
  7. Constant Flux

    Constant Flux Valued Member

    No. Developed during the Sung Dynasty. The proper name is Cheung Kune Pai.
  8. xingyiren

    xingyiren New Member

    There are stories of Guo yunshun having bad knees inhis old age. The problem was thought to be due to training. Nothing about bad feet though. My feet are fine after many years of line drills.
  9. Kibbles

    Kibbles The Iron Bucket

    I guess the whole thing about bad feet thing was nonsense then or maybe due to a handful of people "doing it wrong" somewhere.

    Just to ask though. What's with the stamping? and what happened to Guo Yunshen's knees?
  10. El Medico

    El Medico Valued Member

    Stamping is utilized in some CMAs for (besides the obvious "stomp on the dude's foot" ) certain methods of power generation.Check out a vid of a good Chen T'ai Chi form and you'll see it.

    Guo's knees? Truth is,many practitioners have bad knees as they age,and not just Judo guys. Air kicking,improper stretching,injuries of course,practicing on improper surfaces such as stone or concrete,exhaustive training sessions-these things can add up over time on one's knees,and sometimes just one error can lead to complications the rest of your life.Maybe xingyiren has some more specific info on Guo.

    We know a lot more now on proper training methods and what things to avoid in training than people did 100 years ago-and even today just because someone is excellent in their Karate or Silat or T'ai Chi or whatever doesn't always mean they know enough about these things. I've seen/known of high level well known/well respected practitioners who do some awful things which may not bother them,but I question how their students will feel after some years.I've known more than one quite proficient kicking specialist who's had joint replacement simply because of the result of years of air kicking and yet we still see many schools having their students air kick at more than half speed/power.Can't remember if it was here or somewhere else it was mentioned a known Pa Kua practitioner a generation or two back was crippled in later life due to overtwisting his lower vertebrae in his training when a younger man.

    Heck,I don't know if it's still true,but as recent as 30 years ago the Japanese baseball pitchers were expected to go out most days and practice throwing a few hundred pitches-repetitions like that may be ok for sword practice but had been known to be a pretty stupid thing to do as regards pitching arms for a long time in the US.And modern day Japan isn't exactly a backwater uneducated place.

    Oh,did I mention eyestrain from reading longwinded posts that ramble far beyond answering someone's question?
  11. Northwind

    Northwind Valued Member

    Yep, the "stamping" is something that with proper structure, etc. happens naturally and unintentionally. Newbies will often see it and "try" to replicate it early and this is usually the mistake.
  12. Kibbles

    Kibbles The Iron Bucket

    Okay. Last question. Can anyone tell me the theory of how stamping relates to power? I've seen it done in several styles of Chinese martial arts (and I might eventually be learning a style with a lot of stamping) and it makes me curious about how it works.
  13. Fish Of Doom

    Fish Of Doom Will : Mind : Motion Supporter

    technically speaking, it's afaik basically the same as pushing off the back leg (or pulling with the lead such as in a lunging movement) but done explosively and around the same time the arm movement hits the target (i seem to remember reading something on KFM forums about the correct xingyi way being stamping AFTER the fist, which would make it kinda like a one-inch punch in terms of focus).
  14. El Medico

    El Medico Valued Member

    I've never heard that before,nor seen anyone just naturally and unintentionally do it w/out being instructed in it,or as you say,imitating.

    Or were you referring to its just happening w/out conscious thought in combat?

    As an aside -WOW! You play MJ!

    Hmmmmm-did we do that before?The MJ thing,that is.Or am I thinking of another Mapper?
  15. xingyiren

    xingyiren New Member

    Guo's knees and Stamping

    Unfortunately I never got to meet Guo so I can only speculate. :eek:

    Guo specialized in Beng quan (crushing fist) particularly half-step beng. My guess is that his left knee got damaged from the torque of thousands of half-step bengs. My sifu (Li Tai liang) stresses thorough warmup of the knees and lots of flexibility in the kua (pelvic girdle/groin area). All this is to avoid twisting the knees.

    Guo's half-step beng is executed by shuffling forward in left lead and executing right beng quan while the right leg brings up the rear. Power is thru diagonal twist of the torso. Dan tien also compresses to generate closing power. Similar to a reverse punch in a very, very short stance. Fist impact is sync'd with planting of the rear foot.

    The motion of the rear foot is commonly described as a stomp. This is incorrect. The step looks like a stomp but is actually the recoil from the right fist striking the target. If you observe an trained XYQ fighter, there is no audible impact on the back foot unless they are punching something.
  16. Kibbles

    Kibbles The Iron Bucket

    Poor Guo.

    Cool. I'll take a closer look at that when next I get the chance.
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2011
  17. Kibbles

    Kibbles The Iron Bucket

    Oh, and thanks everyone for all the help.

Share This Page