Both "sport" and "non-sport" TKD (such as the style my school teaches Chung do Kwan) have their place in martial arts. The fact that the WTF has brought TKD into the Olympics as a sport has had an advantage that the visibility of TKD is much greater.... TKD being second only to Judo in becoming a MA sport. Of course there is the disadvantage is this has placed an enormous bridge between WTF and ITF TKD practitioners and it becomes bigger when atitudes such as yours arise.
Thanks Thomas, you really do pat my back far more than is called for I'm sure... You're right in what you say Twimyo:- However we can't all very well practice self-defence with 100% realism in the do-jang. We all get as close as we can, but there's never really the pressure of your life actually being in danger. Sparring is as much a part of Tae Kwon Do as any of the other forms of self defence drills, because it gives you that little bit of pressure that you don't get from practising choreographed drills, it forces you to think on the fly a bit more. WTF is maybe weighted a little more towards being a sport than ITF sparring, but a WTF Tae Kwon Do definately has the capacity to be a form of self defence. I won't go into whether it's more or less than ITF style - because you really can't say - it's down to the instructor and the practitioner.
basiclly they are 2 different styles of tkd. which one is better i can't say cause i never tried ITF before. but i would probably say it depends on the person. why check out both and see which one you prefer.
well yeah there are differneces but personally for me I prefere ITF its the for most original created by General Choi in the beginning.
Artikon, thanks for posting those. The first pair of videos appear to be of an ITF group, as they are wearing the standard ITF uniform and I recognized the Choong Moo kata. In the second set they appear to be wearing WTF uniforms and I didn't recognize any of the katas. Are they a WTF group?
I remember seeing the first videos as part of the North Korean Taekwon-Do delegation visiting South Korea and doing a demonstration. Is the second video set is the South Korea Taekwondo Association .... or is it obvious?? Thanks for posting those! More here also.... http://www.taekwondo-web.com./eng/Index.htm
Yes the first group is ITF from North Korea doing a demonstration in South Korea for the government, dignartaries, and whoever was interested.The second group is WTF, don't think they are the Tiger Team, which is unfortunate since they're demos are simply amazing, not to say there's wasn't good either though. I had to "steal" both of these demos I like them so much
Most people from each organisation want to say that theirs is better. However I think that you can't compare them. "Taekwondo is Taekwondo." Leave the differences alone and just go practise "Taekwondo." And go with your own opinion, not the ones of otheres 'cause you can only decide which you want. (there's an interesting thread on WTF and ITF as well. I think it's called question for TKD practitioners or something like that)
This thread should be required reading for the people who like to blindly promote one chain of TKD schools over the others... TKD really is taught differently based on where it is being taught and by whom it is being taught. The simply three letter name (ITF, WTF, ATA, etc.) doesn't mean as much as the actual practice going on...
100% agree with you on that Thomas. Doesn't matter the orginzation, what matters is the actual instruction. All the different "factions" have their good qualities and bad, meaning good schools and bad schools. TKD is TKD, the only thing that seperates these groups is politics.
It's funny, but the pathetic over-generalizations (and the spouting of "pure" this and that) always rile me to no end. What's even more funny is that many of the "brain washed" hangers-on of one side or the other often has never even worked with a member of the "enemy" federation. How horrible it is when the political inclinations of two separated countries not only brainwash their citizens against the other, but even include it in their martial arts exports! Lately, in our summer class, I have had the pleasure of running class with a few of my regular students (WTF TKD and ICHF Hapkido) but also with an assistant instructor from the ATA and a brown belt from an ITF school. It's fun because we do some things differently but most things are pretty similar. In sparring we rotate rules and honestly, no one really has had an exceptional advantage from the rules (even when opened completely up). My advice to everyone is to get other people in to train with you, whether they are from different federations, or styles altogether!
I think its good that there is a diversity to TKD. Diversity and evolution are what helps things survive and by being open to change it allows you to improve yourself. I train at an ITF club but its TKD that I study , but I would also enjoy trying WTF. The Korean Tigers are awesome and the WTF fight's look good too. In order to improve you should be willing to look at techniques on there own merits removed from where it came from. If I 'steal' a technique from WTF or even another art and it works that doesn't make my TKD any weaker it makes it stronger.
Does anyone else get tired of reading about this "my style is better than yours" topic?heehee I think a person needs to find what works for them, and then further adapt it within that style to it becomes a personal thing. No two people should do things exactly the same. Regardless of style or organization, each person is going to be stronger at some things and weaker at others. As a personal example, I take WTF. I have only been doing it for about 10 months. Starting at 40 years old, I was (and still am compared to most in it) stiff and unflexable. You would think in WTF that my kicks would have to be perfect! In fact they are far from it. I'll work on them to the day I die, but I'll never have the skill as someone starting out young. To compensate for this, when I spar I don't try to avoid the other persons shots. Instead I block them and throw my own. I use more hand blows than most WTF (although I don't get sparring points for them), and tend to like to get on the inside and "fight" more than fancy spar. All this drives my instructor crazy of course, but he is used to it now and tries to help me fight my way. So the moral of the story is take what you like, personalize it, and regardless of what federation or affiliation you are it will become your own style. I'm not looking to be a champion or anything, I take it for personal reasons.
There is a VERY BIG difference between WTF and ITF. WTF is martial sport, while ITF is martial art, they differ in katas (forms) and kicks also. Not to mention a little or no use of hands at all at WTF. I've seen ITF competition and there is a full contact (kick to groin is a negative score), so is WTF but with much more protection. Dolio (sp?) kick is very different, in ITF you turn your hip, but in WTF you just turn your leg, etc. In fact what WTF did tou ITF is a shame. I heard recently some Korean grandmaster was arrested for switching from ITF to WTF for some huge money (or something like this, ill have to check if you want to). The newspaper read: "Shame for Taekwondo". WTF is all about money and bringing it to the top over ITF. ITF remains a real traditional martial art and is usefull for street fight. WTF is ....not. This is true, not a speculation, so who doesnt believe, i don't care peace
Great, another WTF basher with eyes closed. One point of referance for you. Images borrowed from the kukkiwon website, who deal with the martial art aspect of the wtf. http://www.kukkiwon.or.kr/eng/tkskill/kibon_skill_cha_4.asp?div=3 Looke like the hip is turning to me. I would suggest not to overgeneralize a particular orginazation. Both have good sides and bad sides. The politics have good sides and bad sides. However when it all comes down to it. TKD is TKD. PS Welcome to the board
Yeah, The right way to throw a proper roundhouse but in TKD olympic sparring...you don't really need to have good technique but it's to throw the kick of faster.
Did you actually read this whole thread before you responded? If you did, you would see that many of the points you bring up have been discussed here already. (Here's the first page: http://www.martialartsplanet.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2677&page=1&pp=15) Take a look at these threads as well: Styles http://www.martialartsplanet.com/forums/showthread.php?t=11651 TKD self defence stuff (from WTF guy and others) http://www.martialartsplanet.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10787 WTF sparring punches http://www.martialartsplanet.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12061
ive seen some itf tourneys fight with the same rules as kickboxing kicks/knees to the thighs,chest stomach and head punches to the head were allowed too but im not sure how they scored that
aha, Interesting forum. I have been a practitioner of both. I actually began with ITF then tried also WTF. I found that WTF was very much reliant upon speed and having very good and flexible legs. If we compare the two fighting styles I owuld probably opt for ITF due to the fact that there is alot more exciting action with the use of hands alot more too and tactical fights often occur. Whereas WTF i find that altho fantastic to watch and appreciate, it is very much the same ie bounce bounce and fast attack wioth the legs which r predominantely turning kicks. I would recommend that you tried both to make a decision. As one person has already said ITF offer the Martial Art side also but there is also a massive market for the competitive side and the standard of this willl vary from country to country. check out a few of these sites www.itfengland.com www.itfeurope.org www.tomaz-barada.com (a legend in ITF TKD & WAKO kickbox)
My master is WTF ref, but he stopped doing that after he noticed that all fights were very similar. He teaches us to never wait for them to make a mistake, and to force them to make a mistake. It is hard to get used to, but it is effective. I really have no idea what this post said, other than not all WTF focus on sport.
