10-4 that neryo... Good discussion...I personally don't have any problem with people sharing their belief or faith...no matter what it is...That is just opens up doors for greater relationships, at least to me... I don't know how you could ever be enlightened unless someone enlightens you...ha ha Even if you don't agree with their "enlightenment" hee hee
ha ha ha ha i'm really happy that my instructor ''enlightened'' me in another way besides telling me about the deadly sins and the gospel ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha i certainly won't ''enlight'' my students that way. i have this strange feeling that they wouldn't like it.
I would hope that if faith is shared...it is shared without condemnation to those on the receiving end...and I think that's my final 2 cents...
"Exclusively Christian" That sounds pretty clear to me. Tae Kwon Do, and everything else this world has to offer should be for anyone. And althought people will argue that this group isnt stopping people from learning TKD elsewhere, they are promoting segregation in society, and thats the last thing any society needs.
I agree that the principles of TKD are valid for anyone - not just for exclusive groups of people. As I surfed to this website and read the form was "Christ Do Kwan Taekwondo" - the impression I have is that the school desires Christian tenets to be a fundamental aspect of what the group promotes. As a Christian, I understand this...since there is a large group of Christians that do not understand the martial arts or martial artists, in particular. Many Christians feel that indulgence in martial arts will lead to mandatory eastern meditation, which might be argued against on purely philosophical/theological reasons. My family and I profess Christianity, but have trained the last two years in a very secular TKD dojo. For us, it hasn't been an issue. As a former minister, I understand that the Martin family might have an evangelistic notion in mind. As an American, I have to give them the right to express their religious beliefs in the way(s) they feel they ought. Much as I would allow a buddhist to express his beliefs. To be true to my religion, however, if a buddhist were to ask me, "Am I going to Heaven?" - I would answer him honestly. Many of the posts in this thread seem to indicate the religious plurality should be extended to every group - where a quick survey of the times shows that many do not permit Christians this same luxury. I am thoroughly Christian, and, thoroughly American - I feel you should worship as you choose...but I would be less than honest if I blyted the tenets of the faith to which I ascribe. Random thoughts, Steven King, MBA
I'm not a member...ha ha... I've emailed them and asked them some questions. I think their website will explain everything in detail when they get it redone and online...bylaws/mission statement/etc. You know...I was just thinking about "belonging" last night... Let's throw this out and see where this thread goes... Bruce Lee is considered by the majority as the greatest martial artist to ever live...Yet, I don't ever recall anyone asking his affiliation or where he was certified from...in fact...I don't ever recall in any article, book or interview that he considered himself anything more than just a martial artist... I am a member of several martial arts organizations...Some are run by Christians and some are not...I have no problem with any of them...I don't get offended...I really don't... I smile when people ask me about my rank or who I'm certified through or by. I do acknowledge those who have given me rank, but, I don't take it too seriously... I got my black belt in 1991...and technically...I'm still a first degree black belt 12 years later...I have not tested for second dan with anyone...but, yet, I've been promoted by several people because of my abilities and being able to fulfill the requirements of their organizations or styles...Did I ask for it? No...Do I really care? No...Do I flaunt my certificates from every organization that I belong to...No... I can only be accepted as a member by an organization if they approve my membership...and once they do, I most often, don't really get much for being a member anyway... I hope you can see my point...What does belonging to a group or organization really mean? Nothing really... I often join an organization and as a member I support that group by prayer, some financially, but, more often than not...it's just being a good citizen and a good martial artist. I'm good at networking and can provide assistance there and I have offered professional voice overs for some video and audio projects. (That was my main job for 10 years-radio/production). I guess I'm not your "typical" Christian. I compeletly understand why many look at "us" and say things like... 1. Hypocrites 2. Judgemental I'm secure enough in my faith...so that I don't have to condemn those who don't subscribe to my beliefs...I never force anyone to listen to my beliefs...I enjoy people and creating new relationships...with whomever...People are fascinating! I would never tell someone they HAD to pray or be a Christian to work out with me...or be a member of my school...BUT, I do pray before class and I am a Christian...it's my class! ha ha...I have never intimidated someone in my class with "religion" or condemn them for their lifestyles or choices outside the school...I do require that when we all come together...we follow the rules that are established for my school...and I don't think that my rules are bad or harsh or exclusive or prejudice... 1. Do unto others as you would have done unto you... 2. If you don't like how someone is treating you, see rule number one. 3. If you feel that rules number 1 and 2 are not being followed by the instructor, please bring it to his attention...we all make mistakes... I will leave you all with this... "what an unbelieving world finds in many Christians is this... That they profess it with their mouth and then deny it with their life...and that is what an unbelieving world, simply finds, unbelievable" Aaron
this is written on their website: ''Our Mission The World Christian Taekwondo Federation will teach salvation through Christ and martial arts. We will promote ranks, offer seminars and have state, national and international tournaments. As a Christian Federation we are interested in promoting fellowship among believers and focusing on God's Word. We will be Christians united together as a team for Christ. We will worship, pray and learn together and support each other, while enjoying the blessings that God has given us through His Son, Jesus Christ, our Lord and Savior. '' what do u think about it?
ha ha ha, yes it does they all probably do one combination of techniques and then pray, do the second and then pray....
That statement went up recently as I was told they are working on the site and federation stuff...Master Martin seems like a very nice gentleman and I encouraged him to do what he feels he is being led to do. He is expressing his faith and I'm fine with it. I don't have any problems with the vision they have. It will not be for everyone, that's for sure. The good news for me is...through investigation and some inquiry...I made a new friend in the martial arts...ALASKA! Best wishes to them, regardless of my personal opinions...
The Christian thing is by definition exclusive, the gay and lesbian thing has nothing to do with excluding anyone. It is to give gay and lesbian practicioners a chance to train in a non hostile setting. All sports tend to make life a bit difficult for glbt participants, but if you are straight you can be sure that you would not be turned away from their classes and you wouldn't be "hipmotized" or asked to convert. Back in the 70's there was a group that used to come to Atlanta for tournaments. "Karate for Christ" was painted all over their van.
karatedo: the ~Empty Hand Way taekwondo: the Hand-Foot Way jeet kune do: Way of the Intercepting Fist judo: the Gentle Way do: Way of Life Jesus: the Way, the Truth, and the Life
I don't care what you say you are or profess to be... I love ya just the way you are...except neryo...JUST KIDDING... Mucho love to everybody...JUST ENJOY YOUR TRAINING! Aaron
:love: ... can't you just feel it?? Did you know that the National Women's Martial Arts Federation is exclusively for women?? My opinion? I have no problem with organized "martial art groups" as long as they promote the unity of ALL martial artists regardless of race, gender, religion, location, in order to increase "co-operation" and development. These "federations" should maintain high standards, respect traditions, foster the true spirit of martial arts and to encourage the progressive development of the martial arts.
I think I'm going to start the World Christian Atheist Buddhist Taoist Shinto Muslim Islamic Jewish Agnostic Lesbian Gay Straight African American Native American Asian American Latin American Caucasion Blue Green Brown Hazel Green Grey Black Grey Eyed Martial Arts Combat Defense Ultimate Fighting Grappling Kicking Punching Joint Manipulation Weapon System Federation Association Alliance Commission Network for Republican Democrat Independent Green Party People (R) 2003... And I'm the 12 degree founder/Head of family/Soke/Grand Master/President... If I left anyone else out...you are just out of luck...go start your own.... Aaron
