Women's self defence - falsehoods

Discussion in 'Women's Self Defence' started by mmafiter, Jun 23, 2002.

  1. KickChick

    KickChick Valued Member

    I agree that more SD classes should be taught by women (that is why I do).

    Our self defenses classes were run by our school owner and master instructor who is male and his wife and myself. Plus we encouraged all of the black belt women at the school to attend to help out each of the women or to be their partner.

    What the male instructor was actually good for was being our punching bag and our "agressor"! He would instigate the women trying to evoke anger while holding target shield. When they would hear..."Aw c'mon is that the best you got??? (among other choice remarks!)
    You need to be able to have a male in the class in order to work your body mechanics against the opposite sex... to throw him off of you.

    By end of class when he was in full targeted armor the women went wild!! What a sight to behold!
  2. teacher

    teacher Valued Member

    Tere was a really good book on this called I think Punchbag by Robert llywellyn ( suspect spelling ) he's the guy that was in Red Dwarf someone help me out. A bouncer ends up as a human punchbag for a womens self defence group. A lot of good stuff in in and funny too.
  3. Rob_InDaUk

    Rob_InDaUk Grandmaster Sandwich

    Most teachers can spell...:p

  4. teacher

    teacher Valued Member

    I'm more a numbers kinda guy and its a Welsh name. Do you know the guys name he also presents Scrapheap Challenge the UK version.
  5. teacher

    teacher Valued Member

    Ha I found it Robert Llewellyn was the author. A damn good book raises a lot of issues on Womens Self Defence and male female power struggles.
  6. KickChick

    KickChick Valued Member

    Thanks for the recommendation teach! .... I plan on checking it out

    here is a synopsis and more info on the book by Robert Llewellyn, Punchbag

    I like that quotation .... "As they say in women’s self defence, the way out is through."
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2003
  7. teacher

    teacher Valued Member

    Kickchick I just ordered myself a new copy. Like all the best books it disappeared to friends.
  8. ladyhawk

    ladyhawk Valued Member

    Hello Ushy,

    Reflex, you make a good point.

    If what you perceived as an opportunity arose,
    would you act upon it or remain passive because
    that same reflex might cause the gunman to shoot
    someone else.

    I guess like everything else. it takes an evaluation
    of the situation and your environment and then you
    make your judgement call.
  9. RJ_Bushido

    RJ_Bushido New Member

    mmafiter i do agree woman are the weaker sex, i mean there are strong women out there, don't get me wrong.

    I am just speaking about ME. I am trying so hard to sparr and things, and of course the men come along and i haven't got a chance, the self defense we learn personally i can't see me using it if i got attacked in the street, the first thing i would do which i am not supposed to do is panic. i Sleep with my Samurai swords under my bed, but if someone were actually to break in, i think i would be weak

    Just my opinion
  10. Disciple

    Disciple New Member

    I am a seventeen year old who has been practicing Martial Arts for 10 years now... Off all the reading and seeing I have done... I have told people, my friends mainly, one major bit of self-defense, go for the eyes. I mean, that is the best thing I think anyone can do, if you blind your opponent, or pres hard ehough for temporary blinding, you cmay very well be able to run....

    Ok, moving on, I can think of a number of things that women can do with frontal assualts that are practical and easy that they could do physically. number one: Run..scream...gouge the eyes (2 lbs of pressure to pop one[the smae amount to cruch one testical ball]) Rip off the ear (7 lbs of pressure), Rip off the lip (9 lbs or presure). Scratch like no tomorrow, think of one or two things to do if they are one hand choked, if in somehting like the gaurd position, bite, kick, shin scrapping with the edge of a shoe, stomping the instep and big toe....

    Now, (I am honestly asking here) what can women do if they are assaulted by a larger man with extended reach? If she is being held at the throat with one or two hands... what can she do?

    Here is the big one: If she is attacked from behind... I can only see one thing, if she can stomp down and scrap the instep.... but it is only temp and really may not affect all people... what about those completely terrible situations? like subway rapes....so, what CAN a woman do when attacked from behind and also what if thier arms are secured behind them during this? Is this one of those situations where they can't do anything(I have hard times believing where one is that completely helpless, I just figure there is SOMETHING they can try, I don't know everything, so I figure someone else may have the solution I seek, so this is why I am seeking informatoin.)
  11. shuyun3

    shuyun3 Shugyosha

    i teach my girl not to try to overpower me because it won't work (though i'm beginning to doubt that her right hook is improving hehe) i tell her to work with me until i lose my guardedness (she does that well too).

    I don't tell her to strike the groin I tell her to grab and squeeze and shake it like hell. i gave her a fountain pen as a concealed weapon and most of all i taught her to bite.

    i tell her that it's al fair game in a street fight and that grab or improvise a weapon when ever possible. she needs more work but we held out our own together through a mugging. now hows that for bonding.
  12. ladyhawk

    ladyhawk Valued Member

    Hello Disciple,

    Going for the eyes is a common technique but nowadays people frequently wear glasses and sunglasses so fingers in the throat
    works as an alternative.

    A good hard pinch is often effective in getting someone to release you but be ready to follow thru with another technique.
  13. andycartland

    andycartland New Member

    I'm not sure theres an awfull lot of point to womens self defense classes. People who attend tend to be looking for a quick fix. When they don't get it they soon move on. I really think that to make any fighting art worth while you have to be committed. I think that often the people who attend these are those who don't have time or wont commit to a particular style of martial art. To get good at anything takes commitment. I can see arguements for and against teaching limited techniques. I suppose if people want to learn though- they have every right.
  14. Kwajman

    Kwajman Penguin in paradise....

    We teach to go for the eyes, nose, ears, throat, groin. If you try to kick the groin and back off, the attacker is p***ed off. If you try to grab it and hold on, it WILL get his attention and free his hands to try to go after yours. There is the opportunity. For some reason, guys get a little touchy when someones trying to rip off their nads....
  15. MsDwee

    MsDwee New Member

    That's not a bad thing in itself, for pure self-defence. If a woman wants to learn a few techniques to make herself feel safer and more confident, that's great. She shouldn't have to commit to a long series of classes - most women will realise that to be fully protected against any situation would take a long time, but a few classes on how to avoid dangerous situations or how to reduce your chances of being attacked won't hurt.

    Besides, surely the chances of needing to use the techniques taught are small - men are more at risk of being attacked, at least in the street, than women are.

    Uh, not quite sure what my point was. Think it was along the lines of some training is better than none.
  16. KickChick

    KickChick Valued Member

    Thats absolutely true!

    It is estimated that 3 out of 4 people who receive proper SD training will successfully deter crime. So why wouldn't "anyone" put the odds in their favor.
    A good womens SD course will give them confidence, accuracy and a first-hand glimpse of their own (often surprising) physical power. More importantly, it is the best way to break through the mental barriers that limit us and separate us from our inner agressiveness.
  17. andycartland

    andycartland New Member

    Yeah those are fair points.
  18. WingChun Lawyer

    WingChun Lawyer Modesty forbids more.

    I disagree. If you can´t hit a target as big as his face with a weapon as big as your hand, there is no way you can hit a target as small as his eyes with a weapon as small as your fingers: also, even if you hit the rapist is probably not down, just furious - and close enough to ground and pound you to death, even with a scratch in his eyes.

    Hitting the eyes is never a precise technique, and it is unreliable as hell.

    Although I agree that groundfighting is essential in a rape situation (of course), I am a firm believer in the benefits of striking training. If I wanted to rape someone, my first move would be to throw a couple of punches at the victim´s face to stun her, and then I would throw her to the ground.

  19. KickChick

    KickChick Valued Member

    Yes, I too am not keen on using eye attacks unless you are good at gouging.... "any one want to practice with me??" See??

    The most common reaction of the attacker is to simply duck their head and turn away. There is also the common reaction of the where he easily reaches up and captures your wrists. The high failure rate is probably due to the fact the most of the eye attacks taught in most SD classes are direct and frontal in nature. Most attackers would be able to recognize and avoid them.
    The only time an eye gouge is successful is when the attacker doesn't see it coming as when you are bringing your hands from outside his field of vision.
  20. Matt_Bernius

    Matt_Bernius a student and a teacher

    Yeah I think the eye gouge is another slef defense myth in the context of executing it outside of a grappling scenario. Also, on a finger jab like that you risk breaking fingers in the eye socket or on the face/forehead (especially becuase most people don't train/understand finger striking). A facial rake can be just as effective. Plus if you're in range to rake, you can also convert it into an elbow and get two strikes for the price of one. It's pretty easy to scratch someone's cornea and that can be just as debilhitating as an eye gouge (plus it has less long term effects which help from a court of law point of view).

    Groundfighting yes. Grappling, not so much. One needs to udnerstand that. However it's far more important to train striking in the context of a ground fight rather than a more BJJ approach. And it should be taught that the function of striking on the ground is to facilitate getting up as quickly as possible. Note that in this type of scenario, eye gouges become more of an option. Frst ofa ll becuase as a victem you are in a much more procarious position. Two is that it's much easier to feel around the face and execute the gouge when it's not in a striking context.

    - Matt

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