WJJF query for new student (18)

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussion' started by Bsonen, May 15, 2022.

  1. Bsonen

    Bsonen New Member

    Hi im new to the forum and kind of new to martial arts so sorry if this kind of a dumb question…
    I’ve only some basic Japanese jiu jitsu and some goju ryu previously, i found a uk club that said it was part of wjjf Australia but based in the uk. The first lesson i went to was pretty good with some nice people, the second one…
    1.they got VERY annoyed when i did anything not completely aligned with a set technique such as using the prayer lock (only term i know for it) instead of some terrible looking armbar, they got annoyed even though they hadnt explained what they wanted and were varying what they were doing themselves (these were blackbelts btw)
    2. They started talking about me in the 3rd person and wouldn’t explain what i was doing wrong.
    3. They told me i would struggle with jiujitsu because of my size (i do rugby)

    Overall it felt like some weird hazing thing where i was being punished for knowing something a bit different to them. They also got really angry if i grabbed a gi for a throw???

    Is wjjf legit overall and i just found a weird club? They were ok the first lesson but total arseholes for the second one. They told me my breakfalls were rubbish even though they were still better than theirs and they wouldnt suggest improvements.

    If wjjf is overall reputable and i just had weird people then no problem but some of their complaints just made no sense, they rolled their eyes when i said i used to do karate, i wasnt claiming to be amazing or anything.

    Anyone else train with wjjf or has done? Cheers

    Ps. Sorry if posting this in the wrong forum, new here
  2. aaradia

    aaradia Choy Li Fut and Yang Tai Chi Chuan Student Moderator Supporter

    Welcome to MAP!

    We do this for fun. If you don't like the atmosphere, just find another place to train. It doesn't matter if they are "legit" or not. It isn't an experience or atmosphere you were comfortable in. Personally, if I was in your position, I would leave some honest yelp (and similar) reviews so that others can know things like this making their decisions about where to train.

    Mod Note: Please take a moment to click on the "terms and rules" button on the bottom right hand corner of every page. (You agreed to follow our terms of service when you signed up.) Please note we are a family friendly site, so we ask you to make your point without profanity. Thanks. :)
    Last edited: May 15, 2022
  3. Dan Bian

    Dan Bian Neither Dan, nor Brian

    I've heard mixed things about WJJF - from claims that it has no historical Jujutsu foundation, but is infact a mishmash of karate and judo techniques repackaged, to some clubs that train in a positive and realistic manner.
    As with many things, it depends which pick of the litter you get.

    Was it the head instructor you were dealing with, or a couple of senior students?
    Bsonen and Dunc like this.
  4. Smitfire

    Smitfire Cactus Schlong

    Honestly it annoys the hell out of me when I teach and see people doing something different to what I've planned. I do detailed lesson plans where the warm-up relates to the techniques we'll be practicing later which then relate to the drills and the sparring.
    The techniques build from simple beginnings to more complex and involved and I have certain concepts I want to touch on and I have skills in mind as the desired outcome for that lesson. Someone going off on a tangent of their own breaks that.
    If I want people to be creative, problem solve or insert their own techniques then I build that into the lesson plan.

    There's also the safety aspect. You could be with someone who is not ready for their partner to go "off script" and that can lead to injury. That could be one reason why blackbelts might be relatively free to do it (expected of them even) but they got annoyed when a guy they only just met and have no idea about did it. Your partner expects you to "zig"...you "zag" instead and so something unexpected happens.

    In my experience people do their "own thing" for a few reasons.
    One reason is boredom. They don't want to drill something as much as I expect them to, think they have it down after a few reps and so start adding their own stuff.
    Another reason is showing off. They want to show what they can already do rather than what they've been asked to do.
    Another is they get frustrated with not being able to do the technique or drill that well and so try to fall back onto something they can do.
    None of those are good reasons imho.

    That said...it does sound like you happened on a weird situation. You're probably already a big capable guy and that maybe threw them off or put them on the defensive.
    I'd deem Rugby a better base for real fighting than most traditional martial arts so you're probably already quite a handful! :)
    I know some Rugby lads and wouldn't want to fight any of them!
    If someone like that walked into a class I was teaching I'd be monitoring them pretty closely until I knew I could trust them with the piece of training equipment they are being trusted with (the other student's bodies!).

    When I do a new class I do exactly what I'm asked to do (within reason...not gonna do something I know to be dangerous to me), put aside my previous experience to learn what is being taught, keep my head down and try to fit into the ethos of the club.

    I'm not saying you didn't do that of course but just using your example to talk about being in a new class in general.
    Mitch, Dunc and Bsonen like this.
  5. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    The general standard of wjjf skill is poor, as is the coaching methodology. However you going off plan and doing you own thing wasn't ideal, I imagine, it may be their poor coaching methodology that let this to be more of an issue then it needed to be.

    It's ok to be wrong, and it's ok to be corrected by people worse then you, it's all relative to what the class rules are. And often Martial Arts people have terrible interpersonal skills. (This includes myself).

    It does suggest the teaching format won't be a fit for you long term though.

    Would something like judo, BJJ, or even MMA be more suitable for your aims?
    Bsonen likes this.
  6. Bsonen

    Bsonen New Member

    Yeah I definitely didn't intend to try my own techniques, they just gave contradictory instructions and would also get annoyed if I didn't correctly perform something they hadn't even demonstrated. Plus I did apologise for my errors but they just had a snotty dismissive attitude so I don't think I'll use that club again. They didn't seem to want to indicate what was wrong exactly just that it was wrong.
    Can't seem to find out much about what wjjf is about and if it's good for technique, it certainly looked good but the students don't seem to want me there hahaha thought I'd seen the last of bullies at school.
    Might just be the club though and not wjjf
  7. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Wjjf is just a grab bag of bad judo bad aikido and bad karate, the founder pretended he trained in Japan (he hadn't), there's the occasional good gym, but really your much better off going to a judo dojo instead.
    Bsonen and Dunc like this.
  8. Bsonen

    Bsonen New Member

    Cheers yeah I saw the high grades just using a basic ogoshi as their "hip throw" and I asked if I could use a harai goshi as I have more luck with that. They had no idea what I meant and just said "we don't use Japanese terms" like I'm hitting them with super advanced knowledge there hahaha, they also had a shoulder look move that looked like it'd take a lot of luck to apply, only a snapshot but I wasn't exactly I'm awe of what the high grades could do. Nasty attitude ultimately which seemed unprovoked but if they're intimidated by an 18 year old with basic prior experience...they probably aren't up to much
    Dead_pool likes this.
  9. Bsonen

    Bsonen New Member

    Thank, yeah the confusion was that they wanted a very very specific order of techniques done but then did something different themselves and then wouldn't actually explain what they wanted but at the same time got annoyed. One was a black belt too, it was like they didn't have the ability to describe what they wanted but had to give this air of "ughhh it's so obvious" to compensate.
    The talking about me in the 3rd person thing was just unpleasant so think I'll leave them to their LARP setup and tiny membership base, kind if suspect they don't get many that stick around.
    They also went at great lengths to explain how wjjf Australia DEFINITELY isn't the same as wjjf, that's something I really cared about and had been losing sleep over
  10. Bsonen

    Bsonen New Member

    I didn't hate the techniques but I left thinking it was cult like, and overly keen to get bank details after lesson one, I know lots of clubs are like that but this doesn't look like it's worth the cost in fuel to get there, seems like there is some forum info on wjjf and it's not all rosy
  11. Dan Bian

    Dan Bian Neither Dan, nor Brian

    Fair enough if the place isn't for you, but comments like this I don't think are necessary.
    If the people there are happy with what they're doing, just leave them to it and find some where you get on with. Trash talking just makes one look petty.
    Dylan9d likes this.

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