Why is Taekwondo looked down on?

Discussion in 'Tae Kwon Do' started by shotokantiger9, Feb 1, 2008.

  1. divine spiral

    divine spiral shiiiiiiiiiiiiii-zack!!

    ^thats not just tkd,thats not martial arts
    obviously they were students of a mc dojang
  2. RagingDelirium

    RagingDelirium Valued Member

    wow he must have really disliked you. :rolleyes:

    this video posted in the Tae Kwon Do Resources
    "How long does it really take to get a black belt?" thread by Svart really explains why TKD is mocked badly by many, as long as schools & instructors like this exist, the mocking will continue

    if the file refuses to play, just click the title hyperlink to play, makes this file makes me sob every time, to think of the grief i would have recieved at yellow belt for performing a bent side kick like that....
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2009
  3. Morra

    Morra Valued Member

    I've been in Korea now for almost 2 weeks now. I went on a tour, just me, a guide, and a driver, and we started chatting about martial arts as we passed the Blue House (Presidential house).

    One of the guards knew the driver and waved to him. My guide said all the guards were highly trained in jui-jitsu, brazilian jiu-jitsu, and judo.

    I asked why no TKD, it is Korea after all.

    He told me his father was a 5th Dan, and that he himself was a blackbelt, but didn't pursue it. He said TKD was a great sport and good exercise, but not good for fighting, and that military people (every male must serve in the military) understood this and focussed on jui-jitsu.

    I was pretty surprised, especially since his father was some well known TKD teacher.
  4. RagingDelirium

    RagingDelirium Valued Member

    Judo & JJ makes sense
    weird about the BJJ, as most real world encounters are more than likely multi opponent vs 1, and if you end up on the ground your gonna end up very messed up
    I would have thought a good open palm tech or knife hand would be far more valuable.
  5. Morra

    Morra Valued Member

    We didn't go into it - he was just a tour guide, who knows if he is right about anything.

    Yeah, BJJ is useless for real world encounters... you never end up on the ground in a real fight, you never trip or are surprised, or get taken down. :rolleyes:
  6. RagingDelirium

    RagingDelirium Valued Member

    just saying BJJ is sound sport, or effective if its a 1 on 1
    but most times in aint gonna be 1 on 1 is it.

    EDIT: But since your in Korea, ask around, as what the Koreans perspective of why TKD has a poor reputation or its usefulness as SD
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2009
  7. Endless

    Endless Valued Member

    Typically guards, esp bodyguards are only dealing with single assailant.
    Also if it's more than one on one it's probably best to just run the hell away.
    I think TKDs only looked down on because it's spread so much further than every martial art and with that spread has come a lot of splits and watered down versions of the art. Also everyone and their mothers has seen most of the stuff that TKD has to offer. Yes we've all seen you do a flying side kick and break a board, yes you can do one step sparring with an interesting take down, and you can do all the patterns, but it's not see as that adventurous.
    They don't see what TKD can really be like :D
  8. aaron_mag

    aaron_mag New Member Supporter

    I've been to Korea three times now and I think many would be surprised about the attitude of TKD there. It is almost like little league here. Everyone did it at one point or another and many were glad to drop it. Often, if they show you some of their kicks, their technique is quite terrible.

    In a way it is like baseball, wrestling, soccer in the U.S. Many people dabble in these things but few are good at them.

    When I was wandering around Seoul one day I saw someone walking by with a BJJ Gi thrown over his shoulder. Can't mistake that Brazilian Flag. It must have been somewhere near Itaewon. Do you train there?
  9. Kraen

    Kraen Valued Member

    Post # 316. Joke.

    I know she mentioned "Pressure Points" a few times. Will remember to ask next time I talk to her. If it is 'poomse' I won't bother 'updating.'

  10. StuartA

    StuartA Guardian of real TKD :-)

    Nope.. still dont get it, all i know about "Stone Cold" is his saying... "cos stone cold says so"... is that what you meant?

    No.. please do.. often its a case of peoples exposure to TKD that effects their feelings on it.. so in actual fact, what people do or do in their schools is quite important in the grand scheme of things. If one only does Olympic sparring and Poomse, then their view of TKD as a whole is quite limited and therefore not the best view of TKd when discussig SD.


  11. StuartA

    StuartA Guardian of real TKD :-)

    I've heard similar, possibly the reasoning being is that they are forced into it as part of high school!

    Regarding the body guard thing.. the grappling arts may be held in high regard as restraints are more warrented for that profession perhaps.. kinda like a police officer needs 'nicer' techniques than knocking someones hed off their shoulds with a kick!

  12. aaron_mag

    aaron_mag New Member Supporter

    That is EXACTLY the reason. Telling them you do TKD is like saying you did swim lessons. No bit of information could be more boring to them. And, as I mentioned in another post, they often view it as a 'kids activity'. Not only TKD but pretty much any martial art. You force the kids to do it to give them 'character' then they move on to 'serious business' when they get older. I had a tour guide at a university and her exact words were, "In Korea people your age no longer play Taekwon-do." This was said very sweetly and innocently and not intended as an insult. She was just reporting the facts.

    EDIT: I should also add that if I told them I did Sambo/Judo they would have been equally bored. It isn't so much a TKD thing as a martial art thing. If you think about it the reaction isn't too different from 'normal' (IE people not in martial arts) in our own countries. The fact that you flail around in pajamas as an ADULT just makes you strange and odd. Great for kids, but haven't you outgrown that yet? For a grappling style it is like, "Okay...so you wrap your legs around...men...on a regular basis? And you do this for fun?" At this point they give your wife the knowing look and a shake of their head. Then polite conversation moves on to Tiger Woods last tournament and what a exciting and respectable sport golf is. Face it. We're the misfits. But we revel in it.

    I should also mention that, as a young woman in her 20s, my Korean tour guide was shocked when I said we should take the stairs to the 4th floor rather than the get in the very long line for the elevator. Not an ounce of fat on her, but she almost died walking up those stairs. I couldn't help but say, "Well...maybe playing TKD at my age isn't such a bad thing." :)

    On the BJJ and the army guard thing. Modern day soldiers focus most of their training on the weapons and equipment they use. I guarantee you that the self-defense they learn is a couple of moves in basic training (probably culled from BJJ because that is the flavor of martial arts these days). But that is probably the extent of their SD training and the rest of the focus is on stuff like shooting the gun, operating the tank, etc, etc, etc.
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2009
  13. TKDstudent

    TKDstudent Valued Member

    Yes I have heard this as well by many who have went there. It is considered a sport & they do call those that participate in it players. It is very much a kids activity there.
    Now please also keep in mind that in north Korea they do original TKD exclusivley & do it quite well. They view it as a MA for SD & are very proud of the accomplishments on the world stage & that it is a KMA.
  14. aaron_mag

    aaron_mag New Member Supporter

    I should add that the S. Koreans are very proud that Korean martial arts have spread over the world as well. But they have many things to be proud of. Their country has become an economic powerhouse. It really is a nice country and the people there are very friendly.

    The only issue is we bring our own stereotypes with us. We assume they will be all into martial arts and such and so are surprised when they say, "Yes, yes TKD is good. But have you seen the latest Batman movie? Wow! Heath Ledger played a GREAT Joker. That was really good, wasn't it?"
  15. Theforgotten

    Theforgotten Drifting Aimlessly

    Many factors, I would guess:

    - Large number of schools that offer laughable instruction and race people through the belts for money.
    - I may be wrong, but it seems that the amount of poor practictioners far outnumer the amount of skilled practitioners, thus the majority are poor practitioners and the general public bases their judgment on the visible majority as opposed to the really good minority.
    - Since the sporting org is the largest org representing the style, then the sport is what most people see, as opposed to the actual martial art itself.

    It is really sad because TKD trained in its original form and trained the way that the general put forth in his encyclopedia is quite devastating, as evidenced by the hand to hand skills of the ROK marines during the Vietnam war.
  16. TKDstudent

    TKDstudent Valued Member

    Correct & something that is starting to become more common knowledge via the power of the net, books like the Killing Art & the fact that even SK & TKD leaders there are starting to admit the laughable fallacy of the fantasy that TKD is some 2,000 years old.
  17. Theforgotten

    Theforgotten Drifting Aimlessly

    Yes, it is great to know that TKD is moving in the right direction despite all of the negative practices currently occuring within it as a whole. It is nice to see that practictioners are realizing that an art doesn't have to be thousands of years old for it to have merit, too. One thing that I would personally like to see is the martial side become as prominent as the sporting side or even more prominent. As long as the sport aspect dominates, then our style will be looked at as nothing more than a sport. There is nothing wrong with sports, but our style is a martial art first and foremost and it would be nice if this interpretation of the style was restored across the board. I will definitely have to pick up a copy of "A Killing Art", and I am really looking forward to reading Anslow's book on applications. A colleague of mine has highly recommended it, so it is on its way to my library, as we speak.
  18. Mitch

    Mitch Lord Mitch of MAP Admin

    StaurtA, we're all friends here :)

  19. Matt F

    Matt F Valued Member

    Fair enough

    It was not obviouse to me at the time what you meant.

    This is about TKD.If anyone said the same thing about any other I would say a similar thing.
  20. Matt F

    Matt F Valued Member

    Which post was incorrect please?
    My posts are not incorrect for me.I have found better ways,for me, to train certain elements and fundamental ideas of TKD and have put these in my training.

    I mean tone is difficult to get and can only be guessed by the wording and use of apostrophes etc etc. Yours was a way that was not good to my eyes. Plus the use of put down words that were not realy needed for points to be made IMO.

    Good points in themselves.
    Though someone saying ''no offence but'.... has nothng to do with it and I say that because I genuinly felt the responce tone was not appropriate for what I put.It was not to make you look bad or anything.Words used were only going to rub somone,anyone,up the wrong way IMO.So I was attempting to apeal to your good nature to keep it away from that kind of thing and just talk about TKD and state why I say what I do.I wonder what other responces were available?If I ignore it you then have a free run to carry on.If I come back by offending you then it escalate further.If it was real and I took that route I would of said screw you.Now I would get banned if I got like that haha.So I tried to bring it back to a discussion by saying my tone is friendly.

    The ''no offence but.. '' can actualy be said and meant.

    Fair enough if its the way are all the time,though im still sceptical of that sorry I just am, yet expect others to be the way they are too.Im not sure if if Ill ignore or say screw you haha,

    I am surprised they are such a big part yes.I was told by high grade there was a fair amout on things to do if your captured or with your hands tied yet have seen non of this.I am sceptical of any weapons work and would not like to comment as I have never been in a weapons fights.Most is rather bad in martial arts.
    The one I have seen that I rate from what I do know is Karl Tanswells STAB.That came about after he actual got stabbed and from his work as a bouncer.Its individual and not a from a stystem as such yet uses from Greco -Roman Wrestling.I would go for an individuals view over a style anyday as the individual is free from comforming to a set system .Of course it has to be drilled and proven to me,us, face to face.So even if I read the book and got 'moves' I would be sceptical.

    As above plus I know nothing of guns.Would not even go there haha.Or trust anyone on the subject.I dont see its place into days Dojos.Sorry.Its all about luck and the situation not 'moves',IMO.

    I can not see where, sorry.

    You said it was a modern twist yourself.I thought we agreed there.Fair enough.My modern twist just involves different areas.Yours might be SD mine a drill to train sweeping.For example.Or just modern sports training methods.

    I was trying to say just that.Take whatever method is the most efficient and pop it in.Then it becomes part of TKD,hopefully.
    I dont many BB in judo doing TKD.From what Iv seen theres not many.

    He has no students as such.He does sessions twice and month and some seminars every few months.I go as often as possible.I am not in the core group or consider myself a 'student'

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