Why I Prefer Dating Women Who Are Martial Artists

He's a psychologist that talks about studies in psychology that's he's performed, and how that may apply more widely in pop psychology books, he's sticking to his actual qualifications and field of expertise,

Then again I've only read one of his books completely, and half of the one I mentioned, perhaps that's in the later chapters....

Have you got any information about Haidt I should know about? Is he secretly the nemisis to Captain America?

 

Just google his name and Jordan Peterson, or Bill Maher, or Joe Rogan. Heck I think he made a list on what schools were getting tribal based on SJW agendas, where education in STEM fields were severely suffering.

 

Oh that's disappointing, I just had a quick look over the Joe Rogan transcript and it seems to be very JP type ground, his most recent book sounds on the way to that way too.

I'll have to finish the morality book, then read something current by him and see where his work has gone,

The Coddling of the American Mind - Wikipedia

Thanks for the heads up!

 

Last thing I read was that the people prayed for did worse.

Anyway...if the efficacy of prayer in alleviating suffering from ailments (or anything) actually existed then the most religious countries (praying to the right god of course! Gotta get that right!) would be the most healthy countries, out of proportion to their access to good healthcare.
So the poor but very religious people of the Yemen, Somalia, Brazil, Central America, India, Bangaladesh, etc would have better health than the more atheistic Scandinavian countries like Denmark and Sweden.
The more stoutly religious parts of the US would be more healthy than the more cosmopolitan/less religious areas.
A poor religious person would have better health outcomes than a rich atheist.
We wouldn't need hospitals in poor, but religious, areas as god would heal them through prayer.
Religious people would have a measurably better life expectancy than non-religious people.
Religious people would crash their cars less, have better jobs and earnings, win more sporting competitions, better grades and any number of things people pray for.

Needless to say....that's not what we see in the world...at all.

 

::rolls through thread in Rolls Royce with a golden AK47, and a bunch of llamas in the back::

Don't ask man. I prayed, it happened. I'm going with it. Deal with it.

 

Just goes to show you can't buy style!

 

Having done a little googling on the subject there is conflicting evidence in regards to intercessory prayer or "distant prayer".
The study I had read about was from the Eighties by Byrd, which although showed positive results has subsequently been called into question.
Which does seem customary. Further trials are inconclusive (some negative, some positive) - agreed. There was a study on intro-vino fertilisation which seemed very positive, again question marks seem to have arisen.

However though more subjective and open to the invocation of the 'placebo effect' the mental and physical benefits of other types of prayer are very much in line with meditation for example, which prayer is, as I understand it, a form. What doesn't seem to be in question is the powerful effects belief can have, despite any perceived realities that can be called into question. Whether believer, agnostic or atheist that can be enough. Whether it be affirmation, manifestation, gratitude etc. the supernatural can be left out if that is preferable.

Article on WebMD
Can Prayer Heal?

some highlights

• Hospitalized people who never attended church have an average stay of three times longer than people who attended regularly.
• Heart patients were 14 times more likely to die following surgery if they did not participate in a religion.
• Elderly people who never or rarely attended church had a stroke rate double that of people who attended regularly.
• In Israel, religious people had a 40% lower death rate from cardiovascular disease and cancer.

Also, says Koenig, "people who are more religious tend to become depressed less often. And when they do become depressed, they recover more quickly from depression. That has consequences for their physical health and the quality of their lives."

 

Words can be deceiving, particularly those that come in duel categories. I like how Eckhart Tolle describes them; as signposts. Yet we know how changeable our definitions and understanding of things can be historically. Take current ideas around Dark energy and Dark matter for example, Scientists posit that they exist, that they are 'out there', and yet we have no hard material observation or evidence of them - to the best of my knowledge

'The Observer' effects in experiments, or put another way, consciousness, has material effects in scientific experiments yet what is really material about it?
I'm not referring to thought, that can be put down to electrical impulse, for example, but the very source of thought itself. There seem to be two basic schools, the mainstream scientific thinking is it emerges from the brain, but there is also the other one that is really at the heart of what I mentioned earlier by way of 'the perennial philosophy'. Which I believe to be at the heart of all esoteric and religious systems of belief. Namely that form (material, physical form) emerges from consciousness.

I won't make any bones about it; I have come to lean that way if I'm honest. But I'll be damned if I really know anything !

 

Association is not causation,

People who are religious, have an inbuilt social circle, people who are religious, tend to be less rebellious, so probably have less issues with illicit drugs and alcohol.

Neither of which are reasons to believe in a god that doesn't exist, and also not evidence that prayer works.

It's just evidence that a healthy diet and a wide social circle are good for you, thats really what most of these "studies" are measuring.

Claiming dark matter and dark energy is proof of good is also problematic, dark energy is just the name given to what is thought to be driving the universe's expansion, if you want to claim that it's god, your going to need more evidence then just saying that.

Dark matter is matter that doesn't seem to interact with our normal baryonic matter, so saying god is something that can't interact with us, doesn't back up your postition like you think it does.

 

Re the observer effect:

Wiki says:

Observer effect (physics) - Wikipedia

"An especially unusual version of the observer effect occurs in quantum mechanics, as best demonstrated by the double-slit experiment. Physicists have found that observation of quantum phenomena can actually change the measured results of this experiment. Despite the "observer effect" in the double-slit experiment being caused by the presence of an electronic detector, the experiment's results have unfortunately been misinterpreted by some to suggest that a conscious mind can directly affect reality. The need for the "observer" to be conscious is not supported by scientific research, and has been pointed out as a misconception rooted in a poor understanding of the quantum wave function ψ and the quantum measurement process, apparently being the generation of information at its most basic level that produces the effect"

If I'm reading that right (which I may not be)
The act of observing, at that scale interferes with the experiment, but it's pretty clear it's not "magic Brain spirits' that's doing it.

 

I didn't mention dark energy or matter as any kind of "proof of god", I was discussing and trying to make a point about materialism dude!
You're reading into it something that's not actually there (written); non material - ironic isn't it ?

I take your point about causation, I can understand that - but without much more to go on, personal habits related to health may be mere conjecture.
Poor diet, smoking, drinking and genetics as they relate to health seem on the surface at least to apply to both groups fairly equally ? Not at all sure without any data points.

There may be data available - but it would have to be fairly skewed to produce those stats?
As it's already fairly accepted there are physical and mental health benefits arising - maybe those are the outcomes.

There may well be generally more reluctance to not have self control on these things.
But that outcome (more self control) may also directly come from the very practices and beliefs we are discussing - I'm fairly sure I came across that in my recent reading up on the subject anyway.

So an indirect cause you could say, but a cause, a domino effect if you will. First the mental discipline, then the physical health benefits follow from that.

 

Did I say anything about magic brain spirits lol - I spoke about consciousness. Plain and simple.
You really need to ease up with this bad habit of putting words in peoples mouths to suit your agenda.
It does you no favours at all. Maybe it's time to read up on your own list of fallacies link, otherwise keeping it just makes you come off as a huge hypocrite.

You want people to debate fairly, yet you play by your own rules. Quote me happy and I'll concede where I said what you actually accuse me of saying. Even words to that effect will do..

 

There is absolutely no consensus that the few edible, choice milk cap mushrooms are better than any of the choice boletes like the King Bolete or even the stand alone fungus Chanterelles for that matter. All that latex is yucky and stains everything too.

Other than that my finger nail demons don't care about what the toe nail deviants think. If the photons can't reach them through the dark matter then what they are cooking up in the crevices of the toes really wont affect anyone.

So just leave it be.


@Dead_pool I think a few Sam Harris podcasts where he's discussing consciousness and thinking might help you out in the discussion @cloudz is trying to have with you. He's an atheist. If his political leanings aren't to your liking because of how alienated you are tribally/politically, there are a few other podcasters that discuss the same kinds of things.

 

The point was that consciousness doesn't change the material world, there is no evidence of that anywhere. Hence why I used the phrase magic Brain spirits, if consciousness could change the material world in a way science couldn't explain that would be a type of magic.

And of course Magic isnt real.

It's bizarre this is even a topic of discussion to be honest.

Comparing religious Vs non religious people means there's some selection bias in the type of people you are comparing. So it's an inaccurate comparison, their are a few ways to devise a double blind study that compares like with like, but it's still quite an ethically dubious idea, which would only receive funding from the types of groups that would also misrepresent the results.

Sam Harris is a grifter unfortunately, (like most podcasters) I don't need somebody to tell me their opinion, but if there's any actual research out there, I'd be more then willing to read some studies.

 

Sorry I misread your intentions. I thought you were making the point that dark matter and dark energy point to a flaw in materialism, therefore idealism must be true, and therefore by default potentially god's may also exist.

Dark matter and dark matter are both names for things that we think exist, from our current observations of the material world, so materialism is very much exactly what they are, and the names are placeholders which will possibly change when we have a better idea about what they are.

 

I lean towards the evidence being more related to the community and attitude of those that are part of a religion.

My view on religion is jaded by my past, growing up Catholic, being physically punished by nuns in school and later finding out that the really friendly priest who was always nice to us is in jail for sexual assaults on children.

I believe the idea of community is the best part of this and religion can guide it, but many other environments/organisations (martial arts) can also guide it.

 

That's a very good point, perhaps that's also why the young males who flock to MMA gyms, are also prime candidates for the alt right YouTube/podcasting crowd, they lack a community and are looking for a replacement.

 

You made an assumption and went off the rails without knowing what the conversation was about and now you're trying to back peddle. Your comments weren't relevant, were reactionary, and based on assumptions. None of this is relevant to what I was pointing out.

Please go on.

Explain to everyone what consciousness is, if you will.

 

Why are you even here?

Sod off with your grand generalizations please. You don't get to lambast people about lacking scientific evidence and then spout garbage like this without at least three references to independent studies showing the same thing.

 

Originally I was here to find out why a creepy guy who invested in a pyramid scam prefers martial artists to date.

Also the key is the word "perhaps" I was asking a question, not making a statement.
(It should of also had a question mark at the end to be fair.)

Its my own experience that people going MMA gyms stay due to the social circle it provides, pretty much noone that trains as an adult longer then ten years is doing it for self defence or sporting reasons.

(But that's only one person's opinion)

It's also true that absolutely loads of the MMA and BJJ world are Into the alt right, just look at all the high profile MMA fighters and coaches backing Qanon conspiracy theories.

Tinfoil Fighters: A comprehensive list of MMA athletes spreading unfounded conspiracy theories

Tinfoil gloves: why has MMA become a breeding ground for QAnon?

Operation Underground Railroad: The QAnon-adjacent charity boosted on a UFC broadcast

Cutman regrets wearing QAnon patches at UFC on ESPN 11, UFC promises investigation



I'm proposing that both things may have their basis in the same phenomena, that young males are often trying to find their place in the world, and develop their own social circle.

I may be wrong, but it certainly seems to ring true in my own limited experience.

However a quick Google shows this:
The Demography of the Alt-Right

That suggests the religious belief isn't a good indicator of who is attracted to alt right beliefs, which isn't exactly what I proposed, but does mean the situation is more complex then what I originally posted.