Whats so bad about satanism?

Discussion in 'Off Topic Area' started by Banpen Fugyo, Apr 5, 2005.

  1. wuxingtiger

    wuxingtiger New Member

    People, please!!! Enough with the debates about what is/isn't Satanism or who is/isn't the "real deal"...I just want to know where to sign up for the kick-ass orgies and virgin sacrficing they do...forget all the goat killing stuff though...goats smell bad anyway and they're always crapping out those friggin pellets....I just want to be in on the sex stuff (tee-hee-hee) :p
     
  2. TheSanSooStorm

    TheSanSooStorm Valued Member

    Though it seems that you are in good cheers about this, I will have to dissagree with a few of your points. I don`t want to elaberate on this forum, I`lll leave it to a Political Forum. Franklin D. Roosevelt set down some of the most valid fundamental concepts evident in todays "Modern American Liberals." And infact, one of the members of his own party (A Democrat.) Said "he is a socialist." A supporter of Roosevelt was also H.P. Lovecraft, a very established (yet under estimated) writter, who is infact a well known socialist. Modern American Liberalism is the closest thing to Nation Socialism this country has ever seen in a widely populare political party, and Franklin D. Roosevelt, though he had many successes, water stations in Washington and California, which saved the crops, and World War II to mention a few, he was, and teachings are, socialist.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2005
  3. TheSanSooStorm

    TheSanSooStorm Valued Member

    I am goign to have to dissagree with you, in the idea that you are falsely presenting what I said. You`ll notice that I said the "occult" has a wide range of beliefes, and indeed were organized, not all pagan believes were based on "do as though wilt" as you said, but there were those who infact were. Mabye you should bring up some exact examples of these different occultic religions your speaking of, I could most defiantly reply more efficently if I got to see 1) what you were specifically refering to. and 2) Were your getting your sources.




    Um no again. Many in South America (I dont know if you were also refering to them as native americans) use Cocane to inreatch there meditation, as well as others throughout the world.



    Just because they use the same names and refere to bibical entities does not make them those very things for real. perhaps your not understanding my reasoning. If someone is manipulating you, then you can`t argue that in the same scope of understanding that is based on them well, manipulating you. Let me explain this a better way. If I say "Book 1" is a lie, it was written by a liar. And you say "No.....because in Book 1 it says it isn`t a lie." That doesn`t make a difference, there are many ranges of the occult, even VooDoo contains fragments of catholicism. And Vica Versa.



    Wow you`ve managed to make a judgement call based on postings I`ve made on the internet, and deemed me "un-experianced" in the occult simply because you dissagree with me. That statement is nothing but arrogance, and the attempt to cut another down in the (failed attempt) to sound intelligent, I suggest trying a different method of reasoning, outside of under estimating someones experiance, when you don`t even know that person. I have nothing even further to add on this. You can say, and believe what you want, I know for myself what I have and have not experianced, and if you believe I have not practiced the occult, that is your opinion. And as it is your opinion, you BaiKaiGuy are misguided. Good day.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2005
  4. Davey Bones

    Davey Bones New Member

    Well, someone's nerve was hit.

    You come one here sounding like a rabid Christian and get offended when someone calls you on it? Tsk, tsk, tsk.

    But, I'll answer anyway:

    1. Let's see, "good" and "evil": There wasn't a whole lot to misread. But, check out Roman, Greek, Egyptian, Celtic, Druidic, Romanian, Scandinavian, Meso-american and Italian occultism. Go do a google search. You'll find that both the ancient and modern reconstructionist versions are pretty structured, unlike Wicca.

    2. Ok, so that's one for you, which does not a point make. How about Russian Shamanists? Native Americans? European? Indonesian? African? You presume to know that all of them use drugs?

    3. Your point about pagans using angels is quite pointless. As you think they're all deluded and manipulated, not sure how to respond. But I'm fairly certain my ceremonial magic friends would laugh. And disagree with you as much as I do. Basically, your position is "You're being manipulated,so even f you're invoking the serapim, you're really not, you just don't know any better you silly demon-loving occultist". Riiiight.

    4. If you get so quickly offended when someone calls you on blatant misstatements and generalizations, you better learn to grow up. Sorry, welcome to the internet. Been there, done that, bought the Tshirt.

    Edit: I suggest you post your experiences if you want anyone to take you seriously. Right now you're coming off like a Born-Again with a bad vendetta agianst all things pagan. It's not pretty in the least.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2005
  5. Kinjiro Tsukasa

    Kinjiro Tsukasa I'm hungry; got troll? Supporter

    Time to chill, you guys -- you're getting pretty close to personal attacks here. Stop. Now. Please. And stay on topic.

    Thank you. :)
     
  6. Infrazael

    Infrazael Banned Banned

    SanSooStorm. . . . you make judgements about my belief based on YOUR interpretation of the workings of this reality, and those are OBJECTIFIED beliefs.

    I also have Objectified beliefs. Are you so blatantly prideful so say that YOUR OWN, PERSONAL OBJECTIFIED BELIEFS, which happen to be based off of a book PHYSICALLY WRITTEN, BOUND, AND PRINTED BY MEN AND MACHINES, is somehow a GREATER SOURCE OF TRUTH than MY PERSONAL, OBJECTIFIED BELIEFS???
     
  7. Drunken Miss Ho

    Drunken Miss Ho New Member

    I'm confused a little by your reply. I'm saying FDR was the prototypical liberal, and much of Liberalism does owe a lot to socialism in regards to its social programs. I'm not disputing the relationship between Liberalism and Socialism, I'm merely saying Bush is not liberal, because he has no concern for social programs. I'm using Teddy Roosevelt as my example of the prototypical conservative, who Bush also has little in common with. IMO people like Jesse Ventura and Pat Buchannan are much closer to true political conservatism than the Bushes. OK enough of this, back to Satanism, I'll meet you over in politics, San Soo. :)
     
  8. Kinjiro Tsukasa

    Kinjiro Tsukasa I'm hungry; got troll? Supporter

    And Infrazael, please stop shouting.
     
  9. myki

    myki New Member

    I think we've about debated this topic into dust!
    I wonder if, after 22 pages, Siphus got a good answer?

    Cheers!
     
  10. Infrazael

    Infrazael Banned Banned

    Wasn't shouting, just highlighting the main words I wanted to get out.

    Honestly, I was just too lazy to Bold all those words. :D

    Peace
     
  11. Banpen Fugyo

    Banpen Fugyo 10000 Changes No Surprise

    Yeah, I got a good answer.

    Nothing and everything is wrong with satanism.
     
  12. myki

    myki New Member

    Exactly!
     
  13. bcullen

    bcullen They are all perfect.

    Yes! That's it and its a huge step in understanding the riddle we call life.
     
  14. Infrazael

    Infrazael Banned Banned

    Siphus, why did you all of a sudden sound like the Archetypal Chaos Magickian??? Been reading Liber Null & Psychonaut??? :D

    of course. . . .

    NOTHING IS TRUE, EVERYTHING IS PERMITTED, EVERYTHING IS TRUE, AND NOTHING IS PERMITTED.

    Peace.
     
  15. TheSanSooStorm

    TheSanSooStorm Valued Member

    Okay so let me get this strait. I come on here sounding like a rabid christian (rabid christian=your name you gave to me that I "sound like") and when I get offended by what they call me on it (say that I`m a "rabid christian" the words you used, which therefore would be agreeing with you.) that makes them right? So your saying that when someone agree`s with you, that makes them right, and you are tsk`ing me because I supposedly "got offended"?

    No this is what happend. I saw the prejudice hatred towards christianity, intolerance of it, and desided to stick up for someone who was simply submitting there opinion like everyone else. You seem to have a "Supreme Reasoning." Which is, if someone calls me a name (which If I recall, they actually diden`,t no one other then yourself that I`m aware of, "called me on it" so I dont even know what your talking about.) and you agree with them, it makes the name right. However I`m betting if someone called another a "Rabid Paganist" you`d be screaming about it like a "rabid" ACLU lawyer.


    Well thank you for honoring me with your answer, I am not worthy. How on earth did you get me saying that they weren`t? If you actually read what I typed, you``d see I said the following:

    "I don`t know exactly what you meant by "bizarre reason when organized religion in the highest esteem." seeing as thats a strange wording. But I`m going to for now assume you meant that it has become "duscusting" because organized religion and/or followers made it to be. If this is what you meant, this is how I would reply. All of the oldest Occultic beliefes have there roots historically back to Sumeria. Sumeria was very much based upon the paganstic believes inside it. Infact they had massive and numerious temples, as well as Shamans, the eldest and most widely associated side of the occult, is and was a organized religion." So thank you for basically re-making my point.

    No I do not presume. Yet another misguided accusation. I think you`ll find the words "most" not all. To incinuate that all Shamans used drugs would be completely and entirely ignorant. And seeing as this whole attempt seems to be made to insault my intelligence, It would only make sense that you`d want to word it like that. No Bai, not all Shamans use drugs.

    Wait a minute, I think they are all deluded and manipulated? Now lets say I believe they are "all" deluded and manipulated as you said. if I did, that would be completely opinion. And if you believed they weren`t? Weither it be even from experiance, it is still your opinion. Nice God Complex there. Next I`d have to say I`d feel absolutely entertaned if your friends or yourself laughed at me, because to bring the joy of laughter to someone I would deem as a good deed. :)

    I never said all occultists agree with me (look at this entire conversation we are having.) But many practioners will vent and dissagree with one another. SO if you think I`ll be the only one laughed at in the occultic community, trust me there are others. I do say, have a nice laugh, its good for you. ANd I will have a few chuckles of my own.

    "Basically, your position is "You're being manipulated,so even f you're invoking the serapim, you're really not, you just don't know any better you silly demon-loving occultist". I`d have to humbly ask that you don`t put what I never said in quotation marks. I never said that, don`t you think your being alittle to rough on occultists? I mean to call them silly is alittle harsh my friend. Actually many occultists that I have associated with are very bright people, and wouldn`t call them demon lovers. Just confused at times. But seeing as you have a reccord in the past posts as taking what I say in the most negative way possible, I somewhat expect this type of negativety from you. And thank you for saying that I`m right. The emphasis on the "i" really made it more passionate.

    On with the superficial assumption that I am offended. Disturbed perhaps, offended, slightly, easily offended? No. I`m sorry if standing up for someone upsets you. And it would seem that in your God Complex that those who do not agree with you are incapabale of growing up untill they agree with you. I`d rather not grow up if it means my brains fall out. (not to say that yours have.) But I must say, thank you for the suggestion.....or was that a command? What this is the internet? And you have got to get me one of those T-shirts, they sound cool.

    Experiances? My past is somewhat of a tender subject. Infact I`m suprised at myself for coming this out in the open over it already. In the occult I have discovered that the many names for ceramonies, and varies things such as Astral Projection, communication with entitles, weither they be supposedly dead spirits, or even demons for that matter, all share a universal common ground. For instance, placing up astral barriers to say stop a Psychic preditore using an elemental ceramony, (take the sertin idems, walking the perimeter of the room.) insense for air I believe it is, can be changed, and still have an effective outcome compared to the orthadox method. I`ve found specific spells and what not are more like examples, guidelines if you will, rather then rules.

    And I`ve also found that the occult deals with many uniqe individuals, who are typically far from shallow minded. However, in my experiance, after along time searching in the darkness, and light of the occult for the truth, growing in it, the epiphany for me is that its just simply evil. And weither I come off as a "rabid christian" or a "jerk" in the process is sad, but thats the way i guess you`ll percieve me. You don`t have to like me, its a shame if you don`t. But I`m not on MAP for acceptance, or for your approval for that matter. So if you`d like to laugh, criticise, or vent, thats your right to do so. Just keep a common good and thoughtful target in range. And don`t under estimate people, no matter how "rabid" they sound. If you`d like to ask questions and get more personal and detailed, email me. I`d like to disscuss this with you.
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2005
  16. soo han

    soo han New Member

    Ever since i met the "Magister" Ventrue at the mall in austin texas my natural neutral respect for the religion has died down, he was one of the most cruelest people i met and seemed a hedonist not to mention he attempeted to "Curse" me.... but im still living and now i feel like im going to reckon with anyone i see pulling red cards out of there pocket
     
  17. tekkengod

    tekkengod the MAP MP

    grow up all of you!!!!! stop trying to force feed each others ideas down the others throat, i learned that won't work a long time ago. and just so we are all clear on this. organized religion is a cult. accept it, know it, and still participate in it like the mindless brainwashed masses that came before you, and the pseudo spiritual zombies that will surely follow you.
     
  18. watto86

    watto86 Nah brah I'm not gone

    Oooo. Even though I agree with you, I still wouldn't say that. Purely because I don't think it'd be worth what the religious people on here say to me for it.
     
  19. Hobbitlauncher

    Hobbitlauncher Chronic Complaint Dept.

    i read the first two pages and skipped way down here to the 23rd so bear with me since im sure i probably missed something. I do have a couple of points to make (coherent or incoherent, we'll see how i manage to type em out)

    1. without satan there can be no god, and without god, there can be no satan
    -now since this MUST be true due to "gods infallibility" people need to get over their high and mighty selves and let each other think and act for themselves, it's all ineffable (Id recommend reading Good Omens to help cover this, its a humor novel, but has several points that strike home)
    2. Wicca is an unorganized religion?
    -yes and no, rather, the people who utilize it as an umbrella term (such as myself) make it seem unorganized. any follower of Gardnerian Wicca would be upset at this, as many are trying hard to get their churches recognized and priests ordained. Many (nearly all) of us are eclectic, where we like to blend a little bit of everything into a belief that balances out our ideals, needs, and wants (I can't really even touch on this, I'm no high priest, go out and buy LOTS of books and you wont even touch the tip of the iceberg)
    2.5 wiccan/occultism is generally considered satanism (or essentially the same) by hardline christians.
    -wiccan (and many of the religions under the umbrella) actually believe in the duality of god/dess, tehre is a male and a female, a selfless and a selfish, and through the balance of the two you bring yourself closer to that which you seek. the god in most modern wiccan belief is in fact waht most christians consider satan (in many cases, is even satyr-like with horns and goat hooves and whatnot). but they also embrace the female goddess, a creator if you will. there is a time and place for all things, obviously murder is bad, but what about in saving your own life? your own needs and the needs of others must have a balance, and, as in all religions is really just a set of ideals to sculpt ones morals.
    3. other beliefs share this duality.
    -look at hinduism, granted its been a long time since i did any research studies into them, so bear with me, but you could, in essence call shiva (or one of the hundreds of gods) a pseudo-satan, shiva destroys, but through it things rise anew, think of a raging wildfire, it destroys many many living things, and ravages the environment. and yet all of this burnt up "stuff" sinks into the earth and nourishes a new generation of stronger or hardier being, and this last point has made me lose what i was getting at, but hopefully you guys understood it.

    -essentially, the way i see it, there is no good, there is no evil, everything just has its own shade of grey.

    fyi: I'm a mongrel mix of taoist, wiccan, celtic druidism, norse shamanism, and many others that help fit me as a person, hell im sure there's even a little christian left inside of me somewhere

    -Justin
     
  20. WatchfulAbyss

    WatchfulAbyss Active Member


    Are you saying it is satan, or that it is what they see as satan? I think that your saying it is what they see as satan, but, I thought I would check.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2005

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