Ridiculous slams, ridiculous dq's, ridiculous playing up of injurys soccer style, ridiculously celebrating dq victorys, vomiting, illeagal subs and bad sportsmanship these videos are all around cringe but occasionally funny and a good example of things not to do. http://youtu.be/yW0-FtqSFLs http://youtu.be/9-6HpFWJ-x8 http://youtu.be/pLYfwjX1to0 my personnal favourite is the guy making gangster threats because he can't break the other guys grip. A personnal queary on "slams", putting aside the fact that people should always read the rules for a second and looking at it from an entirly tactical/technique point of veiw I can kind of understand slamming somone who has a triangle or arm bar on you, it wouldnt be my first go to deffence but ok there is a chance you might knock them out (with the trade off that you might make the sub tighter), but slamming somone who has your back ? what is that all about where does that even come from ? one of the first things you learn his how to escape from back mount are these people just training at crap gyms so they have no idea what else to do ?
question(s) Never been to a BJJ comp but I am interested how common all this stuff is. Is it on the rise at all? I can't say that it makes the comps look very attractive if you have a 1-10 chance that someone will pull a stupid move to not lose. We rarely had DQ's in wrestling and to a degree I think that because there are local/provincial/national associations people who couldn't behave would not be welcomed back to comps. Is there any control over people who are nuts/dangerous? I saw one guy in a few vids pulling the same nonsense and laughing all the way up the competition ladder..... Do you think that this is all part of BJJ becoming a more popular/mainstream sport and that this will continue? Worsen? Thanks, LFD
Its not that common, generally its more from MMA clubs with only ''sub grappling'' who havnt bothered reading the rules, I heard about a kids comp recently in the UK where the one coach was telling the one kid to slam the other one. The Kid got disqualified virtually straight away, and the coach couldnt see why slams werent allowed.
only been to 7 competitions seen a few arguments but never anything like that with one exception one of my team mates was on the receiving end of a back mount slam that was at least on par with the worst one in that video, the guy that done it was emedatly disqualified and given a severe rollicking by the refree, the ref was a brown belt at the time now a black who organizes comps and refs regularly and he seemed quiet taken aback when it happend so it can't be common up here.
Wow..what gyms are these guys training in?! There was some incredibly dangerous stuff in there and IMO I didn't see anything funny. Watching that poor guy get slammed on his neck I was angry for him. I'm not excusing any of this behavior in the white belts but to to see it at the higher belts is inexcusable. And the last gentleman who was arguing with the refs about the knee bar should read and know the rules PRIOR to entering.
Darn. Yes I agree with it being inexcusable for more experienced guys. I did see at least one slam where it could have been argued was the other guys' fault, but the vast majority were pretty douche moves. It also makes you value good referees who aren't afraid to DQ or kick someone out of a comp all together.
I think there's more than a few in that video were it was either the other guys fualt or just a matter of somone being shrugged off and falling and just because slams are illeagal doesn't mean you should have to go out of your way to hold people in the air who try flying attacks or won't give up subs when they get picked up. There was also one or two were I felt the decision to DQ was ridiculous.
You know that in judo that if someone went into a position where they could be slammed and the person was lifted past horizontal then ippon used to be granted (as in they knew what a guard slam would do to someone) . They eliminated people trying to pull guard and the need to guard slam as the rules for competition changed over time. Maybe there should be points given for putting yourself in a position where you are at risk of being seriously hurt. Either that or let them slam people who do attacks that are clearly not going to have the intended effect. Maybe a bit harsh but it might possibly sort out both sides of the problem. LFD
Agreed, there were certain moments in those videos where I thinking: "Well what else was he suppose to do? Politely lower his opponent to the ground while preserving the triangle and apologising thoroughly for giving the other guy altitude sickness?" I'm not saying slam the other guy into the Matt but if you escape from a triangle while standing with the guy on your shoulders then... what goes up...
I've seen a lot of rulesets reset at standing and give takedown points to someone who holds the opponent off of the ground for so many seconds, either from a pickup on an armbar or from staying there after a guard jump. That seems to work fine.
But then there are plenty of rulesets where the goal is to dump people into the ground at force and often the perception is if you guard jump or hang onto something after being picked up then you're accepting the risk associated with that. Frankly I feel that if you hang onto an armbar or jump guard without knowing the risks, then your mental grasp of the situation is far too tenuous for you to step out of the protective cocoon of patient, experienced senior training partners at your school, much less compete. I realize it's illegal in BJJ but there comes a point where dudes are essentially slamming themselves.
Upon a quick look two comments: 1. The Refs didn't seem to know the rules and were confident to call DQ on the slams (that I saw at the start). That doesn't help matters. 2. I think slams should be OK, the idea that you should help support a guy that jumped guard is stupid, jumping into guard causes a lot of injuries and that your role is to help the guy stay up, or land safely encourages it too much. Either drop jumping into guard or allow/encourage slamming to discourage jumping IMO.
Also, are all those slams illegal? I know it says so in IBJJF Slam is not allowed, but what is the difference between a slam and a good single/double with airtime?
i think it was one white belt that got slammed a couple times after jumping into guard. it's like dude, don't jump into guard. i think that's something you probably don't want to do on concrete because you will just get slammed. but also, i do this guard pass where i lift up the person that's got me in guard (kind of like a squat), then gently shake them off. works very well and is very gentle actually. clearly, if i picked the guy up then slammed him, that should be illegal in competition.
Those are good points. I was particularly focused on the example at 4:40 in the first video where the one gentleman gets picked up and slammed on his head/neck.
yeah that ones pretty famous, was the final of the open weight and the guy is a pro mma fighter of a fair bit of renown I think, don't recall his name or what tournament it was but I read Marcelo saying he felt like his chest had caved in when he did that in an interview once.
Found it - Ricco Rodriguez ADCC 2005 [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1IpRha8E1kk"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1IpRha8E1kk[/ame] He gets his receipt at 5:29, although it was a grey area IMO as to the (il)legality of the slam From ADCC A case *might* be made for Rodriguez countering a back climb/choke position. Had he waited a few seconds longer the slam would have counted outright and he would have won
Some of those were outrageous. But some of 'em, I had to wonder about. A guy getting lifted two inches off the mat is grounds for a DQ? Not sure what to do to fix it. MMA distinguishes between "slamming", which is legal, and "spiking", which is not, the latter being essentially a pile-driver where you drop a guy straight down on his head and neck. I wonder how things would change if grappling/BJJ tourneys started making that distinction. I kind of like the idea of awarding a victory to the guy who can deadlift you if you don't let go. While I appreciate that certain sport-specific behaviors in BJJ allow you to "play the game" by holding standing guard, going for flying moves, etc, they're really a high-risk behavior that only gets riskier when you take away the mats. I know this is the sport aspect of the art, but my understanding was that the rules were originally created to reflect how you'd use BJJ for self-defense, hence the high award for mount and back control, regarding guard as "neutral" even though you've got a lot of subs from there, etc.
