What is MMA?

I thought you started this thread about insanity, and I haven’t seen that linked to MMA?

Anyway see fuzzy’s very good post on the subject, in really simple terms it a combat sports competition format which allows striking, throws and submissions. The rules can vary from organisation to organisation as can the styles used but to be considered a MMA competition it must allow standing strikes, throws and ground work (with or without strikes)
It is not a martial art persay just as K1 is not a martial art but a rule set for arts to compete in, but people are starting training specifically for the rule set so who knows where it is heading

 

I wasn't putting MMA down, just citing differences as I've observed them so take a breath my friend, take a breath, lol. No need to defend your sport that strongly, I wasn't attacking it.

However, I wholeheartedly disagree with your statement about TMA's being just as aggressive because, as I said, we're taught over and over to avoid fighting. You yourself said, thats not the case in MMA, its kill or be killed with no chance to avoid conflict. Thats exactly the reason why I feel MMA is more aggressive. Now I DO agree about the destructive part. I can hurt someone every bit as much as you can.

Dont be mistaken and assume every TMA is like sport TKD. Hapkido has no rules, AT ALL. It's survival through control - whatever that translates into. If that means I have to break your arm and dislocate your shoulder, then so be it. You can't tap out of real life my friend. Comparing an MMA match to a real life self defense situation isn't really apples to apples, now, is it? Chances are ridiculously high that in a real life defense scenario your opponent wont be a skilled martial artist of any sort, TMA or MMA. So that will mean footwork, technique, strategy, and many other aspects will all have to adapt.

I love how you call MMA matches "real fights" with referees and rings and the awareness of your opponents skill sit, your shorts, gloves and spectators. REAL Fights dont happen in rings, they dont have gloves, they dont come with an insight as to your opponents abilities or his win/lose ratio. Real fights dont always end up in a clinch either. In fact, most of the fights I've seen, broken up, or been part of didnt have any clinching in them at all. MMA fights may be more realistic than say TKD bouts but they aren't real. MMA bouts aren't about self defense either. They're about a sporting event. Now, dont get me wrong, I'm not saying the techniques you employ aren't effective or that they couldn't be used on the street. But I am saying thats not the sole focus of your training. It is for mine.

 

Sorry could you point out where I said MMA was real fighting? I never even mentioned the phrase real fights other than talking about the clinch, I mainly said what you see is what works in a pressure situation under very limited rules. As for clinch not happening on the street that much our experience differs there fair enough I see guys grabbing clothes, grabbing heads holding and hitting each other all the time.
Never thought you were putting anything down simply stating why you don’t see some things and why you see other things that’s all. you mentioned why you don’t see certain boxing attributes so I simply tried to explain why you didn’t see them, it’s the same thing if you asked why thai boxing looked different to normal boxing, rules dictate how someone looks in a fight
Nope I cant tap out in real life, but having people try to break my limbs in competition and also tapping out said people on occasion means I know know what to do when someone trys to break my arm for real, and also means I know how to apply said locks when someone is really trying to hurt me, that’s what competition gives to you, the ability to use your skills in an environment where an opponent really resisting you and hurt you under the rule set you are competing in, will it set up up for a fight on the street, I happen to think better than guys who don’t train this way but hey don’t really care I just enjoy training :Angel:
IF self defence is the sole reason you train id suggest buying a gun its quicker and easier and probably more effective, you should train because you enjoy it, but again that’s a personal opinion

As for the whole avoid fighting thing, that might be your experience in TMA, mine was different, two of the arts I have been taught were trained by the Chinese military and police units, another is well known for producing fuill contact fighters in sanda and was used in rebellions and by bandits, maybe the mindset of these people were different and maybe my teachers mind set were different I was never encouraged to go out and beat people up but neither was i encouraged to meekly turn the other cheek but peoples mileage varies

 

Sorry man, I took that to mean MMA = real fights. My bad.

I didnt ask why, I think that may have been Bruce. I get why its different. Though I do appreciate all the typing you did. It was very well done

Ah, a gun is a cop out. See, I dont WANT to hurt someone. I just dont want THEM to hurt ME, lol. Besides, if I bring a gun with me, I may very well, unintentionally end up arming my assailant. I'd much rather get the guy into an arm bar, sit on his head and explain to him the error of his ways *insert evil grin*

I DO enjoy it though. Very much. I couldn't have kept going if I didnt. So I agree with you on that quite strongly.

 

I had a non-MA friend that did P90x and Insanity. He came to a boxing class with me, and remarked that it was on par with P90x. I then took him to a Muay Thai class and he said it was harder than Insanity.

I didn't have the heart to tell him that Jujitsu class is even worse...

 

We still haven't heard back from Bruce. Was that the sort of information you were looking for? Is there anything else you'd like to know?

 

Sorry about being late back to the party.....

Exactly, Call-sign; that is exactly the sort of information I was referencing. Its one thing to toss the letters "MMA" around like theres no tomorrow and its quite another to speak on a subject within a given context. I think it would be a real help----speaking as an outsider, now---- for folks who represent some MMA view or position to be able to provide context after the fashion of what you did here. Of course, it wouldn't have to be so comprehensive ALL of the time. Just now and again to help educate those of us who don't train in this particular discipline, right? Thanks.

Best Wishes,

Bruce

 

I don't train in Karate, I understand what it's about...

 

Wiki MMA
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mixed_martial_arts

Anyone from any discipline can enter MMA comps

With the advent of the Internet there's no excuse for ignorance.

 

Really? But no seriously really?

 

I guess I have two gut reactions to this question:

A lot of the confusion surrounding what MMA is, to my mind, isn't generated by those I'd consider actual MMA participants. There are two parties who are responsible. 1) The fans. A spectator (barring, of course, spectators who also participate) will always have a different--perhaps warped--sense of what it's all about. That said, the fans are, at least, a part of the bigger picture of MMA. Because competition is an inherent part of it, and that includes the fan base. 2) Non (to my mind) MMA participants who bandy around the term "mixed martial art" with regard to their own arts so as to ride the wave. They base this on the loosest interpretation, reasoning that if they can substantiate any mixing of styles whatsoever in their training, they're doing MMA. At this point, I feel like the term "MMA" needs to be reserved for those practices and personalities related to the competitive format and associated training practices.

Second gut reaction: If you want to START to know what MMA is, the real key is to do precisely what I did. Just start watching a lot of it. I started with the first UFC in '94. Haven't seen every event, and certainly don't spend much time reading about MMA. But I've got a certain amount of insight, I suppose. If I wanted more than that, it'd be time to participate.

 

If you have trained

- Karate (for punch),
- TKD (for kick),
- Aikido (for lock),
- Judo (for throw and ground skill),

you can call yourself a MMA guy. You don't have to train

- boxing,
- MT,
- BJJ,
- wrestling.

The term MMA is just a term that you know kick, punch, lock, throw, and ground game. It doesn't matter where you may get your training from.

 

if you are looking to compete in MMA i think it matters a great deal which arts you chose to get your skill from, and which teachers too

 

The MMA approach may be a good example that we can compare our TMA with it. We should ask ourselves questions such as:

- Is form training truly necessary? Can we use that time to train something more valuable?
- If my style doesn't have a certain tool such as "flying knee", should I try to find it from other systems, or should I try to be pure with my system and live without it?
- Do we have to define ourselves as "striker" or "grappler"? Can we do both at the same time?
- Should I only spar/wrestle against people from my style? Or should I go outside and test my skill against all MA styles on this planet?
- ...

 

Not sure if this was directed at me, but since I'm the one who specifically listed boxing, MT, BJJ and wrestling in my first paragraph, I'm going to pretend like it is.

Those systems, as I noted are the most commonly trained ones for MMA. I also noted, closer to the bottom, that given the open format, MMA practitioners came from a number of backgrounds- I listed several, including those with backgrounds in karate, Sumo, Taekwondo, and Capoeira. My personal background draws strongly on my karate, boxing, and "all in" (Catch-ish) wrestling experience, with elements of Judo, BJJ, Wing Chun, Silat, etc. slipping in to varying degrees.

It is my belief, however, that MMA is more than simply cross-training. It's about training in a format where one has the freedom to combine elements from various martial arts as needed. At this point, I think "MMA training" also denotes a certain level of contact that is absent from many martial arts formats. That's one of the reasons why boxing, MT, BJJ and wrestling are so popular.

 

It wasn't direct to you but you have responded to it nicely. IMO, MMA is an "open mind" attitude. I have heard that the modern Judo has abanded leg grabbing because too many wrestlers use single leg and double legs. That's "close mind" attitude.

Whether traditional MA guys should join in the MMA game, or stay away from it and remain "pure" can be interest discussion. If you join in the game, you may lose your identity. If you don't, you won't be considered as main stream.

There exist no "complete" MA style on this planet. If there is one, it's called MMA. If you want to be "complete", you don't have any other choice.

 

Would going into a MMA gym with previous and specific style not allow you to be individual and retain your identity? I remember somebody earlier in this thread mentioning all of the different styles of fighters, despite them often having them being trained in the same styles. Ie: GSP and Machida. Jones and Silvia.

 

Your identity will change along with your training. If you came from the longfist system, oneday you sparred against a TKD guy and found out that his roundhouse kick worked better than your roundhouse kick, you would modify your longfist roundhouse kick to have TKD flavor. Later on you sparred with a MT guy and found out that you like his roundhouse kick better, you will change your longfist/TKD roundhouse kick to have MT flavor. After all your tools have been integrated with different styles and flavors. your "tools" will no longer be "pure".

It's very easy to remain "pure" if you only spar/wrestle with people in your own style. The moment that you go beyond that boundary, you will find out that it's a big world out there.

 

It seem to me that the term MMA doesn't denote what you're training in but what you're training for.

If you're training to compete under the ruleset of a UFC-type competition, then you're training in MMA.

If you're learning boxing and wrestling but not with the aim of using them in the MMA ruleset, then you're training in several martial arts, but not mixed martial arts as the term is commonly used.