What does everone think of CNG's SKK...

Discussion in 'Kenpo' started by Joe V., Feb 4, 2006.

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  1. KenpoDavid

    KenpoDavid Working Title

    So where do you train at then? Why do you think you would be able to tell a good school from a bad one?
  2. Joe V.

    Joe V. Valued Member

    Nice one! I will use that one!
  3. KempoJer

    KempoJer Valued Member

    No belt testing fees

    Last edited: Feb 19, 2006
  4. Joe V.

    Joe V. Valued Member

  5. kenpoist

    kenpoist New Member

    I don’t know this instructor (how he teaches/ moves/ etc..), but from an outside perspective looking in at him and his website, I will render my OPINION.

    Autobiography: The first think that comes to mind is EGO and self-absorption. He does not appear to be very humble. He is obviously very pleased with himself and could learn a little humility.

    He seems to have a flair for marketing and commercialism of his studio. Is that a bad thing? Not necessarily. We each have to make a living, but I would have to see what kind of product he offers. Is he providing a QUALITY product/service or QUANTITY? The consumer (student) will be the ultimate judge.
  6. Joe V.

    Joe V. Valued Member

    I think that a little evaluation by Seniors, helps determine the QUALITY of the product being sold as well. If you have Instructors who are proud to have you in their lineage. If you are true to the ethics of the dojo. If you are interested in teaching students to perpetuate the Arts and what they represent, there by, helping to improve our society...
    These are also indicators...

    Sometimes it takes the "students" a while longer to catch on. BUT the judgements of the Seniors and Masters in Kempo/Kenpo are never fooled for long by any one.
  7. KempoJer

    KempoJer Valued Member

    I have viewed the couple video clips that he has on his web site, as well as the still photos of him doing the DM's frame by frame. He should stick to the still photos! If he was wearing street cloths in those clips I would guess he was a orange or purple belt, maybe......but who am I to question somebody who has "earned" three 6th degree black belts, in three different styles in only ten years (and I always thought it was quality not quantity). A good friend of mine is 33 and has been training since he was 13, but he is just a 4th degree in SK. I have to light a fire under that guy. LOL
    I also clicked on the locations tab, I really like the picture of his Throne/office.
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2006
  8. Joe V.

    Joe V. Valued Member

    You have a good eye for the Martial Arts. I suggest you look into the "Submitting Videos for peer review" thread (the locked one). There is a pretty close comparison of 3 combination perfomed by Mr. Geary and a 1st Kyu from Prof. Chamberlain's Dojo. I think the videos speak for themselves.
  9. KempoJer

    KempoJer Valued Member

    Last edited: Feb 20, 2006
  10. KempoJer

    KempoJer Valued Member

  11. Joe V.

    Joe V. Valued Member

    I have been taught the variation Mr. Geary performs. I think the difference in rank level is dramatic. The difference in execution is even more dramatic. This is a novice technique in most of the of the East Coast Kenpo systems which originated from the Grand Master Gascon, Grand Master Pesare, Professor Cerio, Grand Master Villari lineage.
    Dr. Chamberlain's First Kyu shows excellent flow and focus through every strike... You can see that every move is ingrained into his muscle memory. This comes from much practice and excellent instruction. Dr. Chamberlain must be proud to have such students in his Dojo.
  12. DAnjo

    DAnjo Valued Member

    How Geary moves is found in his demonstration of #3 Combination/DM. To me, it looks weak. He parries the punch and delivers a very weak looking right hand strike to the ribs. Then, without moving his feet, reaches behind the guy's collar and pulls him down using mucular strength rather than leverage.

    How the tech is suposed to look is this: The left hand is supposed to cover, but the body of the defender is moved out of the way of the punch by stepping out to the left. This is combined with a simultaneous front punch to the groin, not ribs. Then one grabs the right shulder with the left hand, pulls the uke into a right back fist to the face.Then, with the uke already off balance, maintaining the left grip on the right shoulder, one rises up, and grabs the uke behind the left shoulder with the right hand and the defender brings his feet together at the same time. Then The defender steps out with his right foot, while using leverage to bring the uke to the ground. This if followed by a knealing punch (not squat punch) to the face. There are other variations, but they all look much stronger than Geary's version.

    It's a very powerful technique. However, the way Geary shows it, it's very weak. Granted it takes less time to learn Geary's version, and it's easier to perfect Geary's version, but it's much weaker also. I think this has do do with the fact that he went right from Green-brown stripe to black belt and that he went from a white belt to a black belt with only 10 actual months of training.

    I also watched the video of his top black belt performing kata (Pinan 1 & 2) they were very average looking, i.e., what I usually see from a person at purple belt level. Given that he was demonstrating for GM Gascon, I'm sure he was doing his best stuff. It all goes to time in the art. Geary's actual time training before striking out on his own is very minimal. I bet if he keeps at it, ten years from now he'll look a lot better. Especially if he goes elsewhere for further training and has the patience to learn from others.

    For a good example, take a look at the Footage of Hanshi Lou Angel on Geary's site. Now, THAT is what someone looks like that can really move! Compare the two and you'll see what I mean.

    Many others have struck out on their own with minimal training and have done very well. The key is to keep pushing yourself and to keep seeking out more instruction and incorporating it into your curriculum and skill-set.

    If he's sincere, Geary will be a long time developing the actual skill to match his rank.
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2006
  13. fightingninja2

    fightingninja2 New Member

    Good one danjo!
  14. kenpoist

    kenpoist New Member

    I can't speak of proper technique in this system because I study the Parker Kenpo system and I have not seen the video to give my two cents worth.

    Though the Bullshido website is not the be all end all, they have a similiar post and have had some people do some research into this FRAUD. Apparently, this has been going on for 6 or more years. There are notion's of outstanding warrants, buying his belt from Hanshi Lou Angel in Karazenpo Go Shinjtusu, duping Nick Cerio into promoting him through video training etc...

    I guess there is not much that can be done to the man at this point. He has managed to CON everyone that has come into contact with him including the Mayor of Omaha, Nebraska. This give's the martial arts community a large a black eye.

    Maybe the local media in Nebraska needs to take on the story and find out the "real" deal thus exposing him to the masses!

    I don't make a habit of bashing other people's instructor's, but I have a hard time accepting situations where people are being scammed.
  15. Joe V.

    Joe V. Valued Member

    I have learned that combination with three different variations over the years. I agree it is a very strong technique if performed properly.
    I don't think Mr. Gearys abilities will improve much because of his ego, no matter how many years he practices. Maybe Hanshi Angel will get him to come around... For the sake of his students!
    Last edited: Feb 20, 2006
  16. KempoJer

    KempoJer Valued Member

    The internet has helped many martial artists in networking, research, etc.
    But I think the most important thing is that it helps to flush out all of the frauds that have been hiding in the shadows. All you have to do is "Google" them! When 98 people out of 100 tell you one thing, can you believe the other 2?
  17. razorblade

    razorblade New Member


    ONLY if those 98 people are known. :cool:
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2006
  18. KenpoDavid

    KenpoDavid Working Title


    The difference between a "test fee" and the "promtion fee" (I guess you could call it) is: you pay a testing fee just to test, pass or fail. The $25 we charge is only paid when you pass. It's a minimal fee, I can't believe it generated multiple posts of criticism LOL

    Danjo - "how it is supposed to look" - every Shaolin Kempo variation does some techniques differently. You describe how you learned it, but that's not necessarily the "one true way". But, I have to agree, that video on our site is not very good LOL. I know it's not really representative of Prof. Geary's ability, having seen it first-hand. Is he the best Martial Artist ever? No. Is he better then that video shows? Yes.

    Also, what makes the pinan demonstrations "purple" level? got any video to demonstrate what it should look like??
  19. KenpoDavid

    KenpoDavid Working Title

    The thing is, the Mayor doesn't care about how long anyone has been training or with whom. He looks at positive effects the schools have on the kids who go there, the charity work, the support for city programs... there's no scamming that. Sure some of his promotions are questionable, and he's got some mistakes in his past that continue to haunt him. But he does good thigns for the people in his schools and for the community at large and so, to the outside world, the one that doesn't care about lineage arguments and stylistic variations, the Real World, Christopher Geary is far from a "black eye".

    A local TV station did cover the Florida incident, gave it about 15 seconds, and that was it. Did some people leave the school because of it? Probably. When a local TKD instructor was busted for setting up a hotel date in a chat room witha 13 yr old, and the FBI was waiting, even that didn't make news for more than a day or two. How slow must the news day be before "Local Martial Arts Instructor may not be ranked as high as he claims" Makes the news? If it does get that slow, there's a self-promoted TKD & Karate 9th degree here in town who doesn't let his students even touch each other, the reporters would probably start with him.
  20. dbmasters

    dbmasters Valued Member

    Well, that begs the question, what does one consider a "fraud". I am guessing some people would define that differently.

    Is it somebody who just doesn't know MA but says they do?
    Is it somebody that knows MA but doesn't have some internationally known affiliation?
    Is it somebody that teaches a style you don't think is worthy?

    Just curious, as I have been following this thread with some interest I am curious where some stand on this threshold.
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