Vegetarian vs. Vegan vs. Carnivore

so if it is useless as a useless will exercise, doesn't that make it perfect for a useless will exercise?

 

No, you need something useful to use as a useless will exercise.

And well you know it! :woo:

Rgds,
David

 

I didn't mean the smoking, I meant pretty much everything done afterwards...

 

Veganism

I am a meat eater! And so was my boyfriend until a few weeks ago when he decided to go Vegan. He came home with this pamphlet about harming animals. It's gonna take a lot more than a stupid pamphlet or hearing Vegan hype to stop me from being a carnivore. I am in touch with my primal instinks and I embrace them. I am just another animal eating aniamls. Yes we are intelligent. Yes I do get upset when I hear of certain (NOT ALL) farms and plantations who let the animals suffer. However unfortunate that is, nothing I do is going to stop that. If I want to change something I usually write my congress. It is very unlikey that you will convice the entire population to eat Bio enginneered food for their Lifes entirety. Being a vegan is also not healthy because most vegans do not know how to supplement. If you do, then you have to make quite a bit of money to keep up with the cost of all your boxed foods and vitamins. Boxed vegan food is no healthier than eating reg boxed food. If you wanna go through all of that to save the world of animals so be it! Knock yourself out. No really, knock yourself out after hugging a few trees. Thanks.

 

what about all of those stupid Pamphlets the vegans print their propaganda on? They are killing lots of trees to print on that nice paper!

 

i don't really know what's with the propoganda pamphlets but i think it'd be great if we just let all the animals loose then made it legal to hunt for food purposes only with ancient weapons i mean make it a little more fair.i think that'd pretty much end the lack of food problem. Cows could eat wild crops we could eat the grown crops and then some pure 100% one cow beef once and a while.

 

Hey David, good job with sticking with your beliefs. The life style you have chosen takes a lot of will power, and I commend you.

Couple of questions, how do you go with protein sources? Do you have trouble gaining muscle mass, or is this not something you desire?

Thanks mate.

By the way, parasite?? All perspective I guess, some would say predator, top of the food chain

 

If we weren't suppose to eat animals then why the hell are they made of meat?!

 

Note that red meat rots away in your colon. In most red-meat-eating humans, there is meat that is festering away from over 3 months ago. There is a possibility that is linked to colon cancer (the 2nd largest killer after lung cancer in the western world).

One of my teachers experimented with giving up red meat for a few years. He found he was less tempermental and calmer (blood wasn't as hot), however, the power and strength of his punches was no longer optimal. He's decided, as a MA, he would rather have the power and has re-commenced eating red meat.

I like eating red meat. However, I rarely eat red meat because I believe you can get the virtually the same protein and nutrients from other sources (such as chicken, fish, seeds, supplements, etc) without much of the harmful after effects.

 

Vegan wars

I just would like to announce that my boyfriend was a vegan for about two and a half weeks before realizing how hard it was and how expensive it was to get all the nutriants he needs to lose fat and gain lean muscle as well as maintain good health. Even while taking all of the needed supplements and eating well he still had dark rings under his eyes. Now he will be adopting my good eating habits of lots of fish, chicken, green leafy vegetables and low carbs. I tried to incorporate some vegetarian meals into my diet but I am carb sensetive and I need to eat more than beans and chickpeas or eggplant with vegetables for dinner. I must have a fish or poultry. I allow myself to eat a good steak once in a while but not very much.

As for the Colon, having colonics every so often gets rid of all of that discusting waste in your intestines and or colon. It's a good thing to do even though it's not really a pleasant experience. Also fasting one day a week also can cleanse your body of toxins.

 

My wife went vegetarian a little over a year ago. I did not, and do not plan to. As I generally explain when someone asks me, I am just not that good a person-- I LIKE meat. Also, meat contains certain vitamins and nutrients that actually stimulate you to feel satisfied after you've eaten. Those same nutrients are harder to find in veggies.

In terms of health, it is entirely possible to eat a healthy vegetarian diet-- I'm not so sure about vegan, but ove-lacto vegetarians do quite well. Just ask my wife.

I guess I would have to say that I am aware of most of the issues surrounding the whole vegetarian vs. omnivore debate, I just don't care. I eat vegetarian at home and meat when I go out. I don't try to sell either diet to anybody. I assume that everyone is reasonably grown up and can make their own moral and health decisions.

 

Go veggies!

That's great. I love vegetables and I feel the same way about meat. It is harder to be vegan and people choose veganism because of strong beliefs about the treatment of animals where as vegetarians normally have other reasons such as health, preference, allergies, or stomach problems. I try to eat healthy and I am kind of glad that my boyfriend decided against being vegan because he was doing it for the wrong reasons.

 

my body just doesn't seem to like meat, i eat it just because i feel my body needs it but i try to stick to mostly a vegetarian diet. i just have such a large vessel to maintain so and can't afford all these supplements so i pretty much force feed myself meat

 

I'm a very happy omnivore. I enjoy both delicious meat and tasty veggies. I have no problem with vegetarians, I have several friends who are and don't mind cooking for them occasionally. I do, however, have a big problem with bad information and there are a lot of statements being thrown around here that are misleading or just plain untrue.

Based on what? Land use percentage? Energy inputs? You're going to have to back up a claim like this with some sort of reference, preferably one that comes from a relatively unbiased source like a UN agency report. Just because you say it's true (several times) doesn't make it so.

In a strict sense that's true. You also have to take into account the fact that there are huge swaths of land that are unsuitable for any agricultural production except that of meat. Think sheep in the Scottish highlands.

Neither is anything else. Humans have evolved to become omnivores, so our digestive system isn't optimized for either an all meat or all plant diet. As an example, proportionately speaking our intestines are dead center in terms of length. Carnivores have a shorter tract than we do, and herbivores have a longer one. There are tradeoffs no matter which way you go.

I can't argue with that. I think that corporate factory farms are an abomination. I just wish that I was wealthy enough to eat only locally produced family owned cruelty free meat.

Ah, good old misdirection. You're right, they're far from waif like. There's a reason for that though, they are explicit herbivores. They have evolved a number of features that allow them to be this way, specifically multiple stomachs to process tough plant matter, a caecum which holds bacteria that allow them to gain nutrients from cellulose, and the ability to produce vitamins like B12. Humans have actually evolved away from being strict herbivores, our caecum became usless and is now called the appendix, and we lost our ability to produce some nutrients like B12 since we have had them in our diet for so long.

These statements are just plain wrong. We actually produce plenty of calories to feed the whole world. The reason that people starve is the faulty distribution system. It's politics, not meat eating that are killing people.

LOL You've never studied enzymatic function at a molecular level then, have you? Every single species is staggeringly complex, and there are millions of individual species.

I know that was meant as a joke, but no it's not. Here's what dictionary.com has to say about the word parasite: "An organism that grows, feeds, and is sheltered on or in a different organism while contributing nothing to the survival of its host." Note that there are far more species of parasites than species of nonparasites. As a class they are pretty much the most successful group on the planet.

You just undermined your own arguement above. Which is it, politics or meat eating that causes starvation?

Note that this is blatantly false. Red meat does not rot in your colon more than anything else does. All food consumed, even plant matter is subjected to the same bacterial action. And where are you getting this 3 months figure? A meal takes on average 10-24 hours until it's excreted, and dietary fiber essentially scours the walls of the digestive tract.

 

MuayThaiGuy

RIGHT ON man!!!! You are correct. It's about time someone called these people out for making such rediculous statements. A vegan told me recently that there is blood and puss in cheese and so humans should not eat it. When I asked where they learned that rubbish they replied, "from a vegan website". I find this to be utterly funny. Anyway, I loved reading your comments!! Thanks!

 

Please read my statement carefully. You'll find I never stated that red meat rots more than anything else.

Nor did I state that other matter may not be present in the colon.

Kindly note that during colonic irrigation, many items, such as marbles, coins, crayons etc. that were swallowed many years ago (occasionally as a young child) are extracted. And automatically with this much partially-digested (rotten) matter is also removed. Naturally some of which is likely to be animal matter.

 

zun - Ok, you just said something that was at best misleading then. By neglecting to mention the other half of your statement, that ingested plant matter rots equally as much, you implied that it is only meat which "rots away in your colon." It would be like if I were to post in a striking vs grappling arts thread that "grappling matches are totally boring to watch." This would be a much different statement indeed than "both striking and grappling matches are totally boring to watch." The first one implies that I'm slagging on grappling, the second one implies that I'm just plain weird.

Also, I still want to know where you get the meat in your digestive tract for 3 months thing from.

Finally, isn't "partially-digested (rotten) matter" just a euphanism for normal feces? Are you implying that this builds up for long periods of time in a normal colon?

 

Ligganistan - Thanks. That claim of pus and blood in dairy is pretty misleading. I could just as truthfully say that you shouldn't eat grain because it contains pus, blood, and feces! It's true in the strictest sense because countless millions of animals are killed each year in the process of harvesting grain, and some of the aformentioned substances get on the grain.

 

As for me, I'm a vegitarian, working to become completly vegen....or is it vegan.....anyway. I like the life style, wouldn't change it for the world. Well, that's all I'll say on the subject for now

 

Facts

90% number came from a 1980's animal rights pamphlet with no scientific proof. Buying farm direct is cheaper than a person thinks. You can save a lot of money and get food from people you can actually speak with and see how they operate their farms. Yes, I am a farmer.

Mountainsage