Discussion in 'Kenpo' started by flyingleopard, Aug 14, 2005.

  1. Satori81

    Satori81 Never Forget...


    Can I ask you one question, though...

    How much are you paying for classes, and are you under any sort of contract?
  2. ShaolinKempoKa

    ShaolinKempoKa New Member

    I am actually not sure on that. I believe that the longer you sign up for, The less money it costs monthly. And if you can no longer come in or choose not to they stop billing for the months that you don't come in, I believe. Pretty sure, though. :)
  3. FightingMonk2k3

    FightingMonk2k3 Valued Member

    there's Red Belts in USSD? i wasnt aware that there were Red Belts there. I was aware they had the following: White, Yellow, Orange, Blue, Green, Brown, and Black. and then also had Blue w/ a Green stripe; Green w/ a Brown stripe, and then 3 levels of Brown.
  4. Satori81

    Satori81 Never Forget...

    Red Belt is "Assistant Instructor" in USSD.

    Anyone that is either in the Instructor's College or teaching without a Black Belt is allowed to wear a Red Belt instead of their earned rank.
  5. buda warrior

    buda warrior New Member

    They put red belts on assistant instructors to hide their rank.
  6. buda warrior

    buda warrior New Member

    Grandmaster fred villari is where you masters came from.
    Ask master moscitalli about him. He will tell you that they broke away from him 18 years ago.
    As for ussd as a whole I would stay away from them.

    You seem like a nice person so before you jump on ussd's instructors academy,you should ask your instructor how much he makes?

    Does ussd take taxes out (they dont)?

    How many hours a week do you have to work?50

    How much is a dojo? Last time I checked it was $140,000 and you get 66% of the profit if you work it yourself.

    Ask your instructor why you can't own a dojo 100% and he'll say because the company needs to grow or some crap like that.

    If your on the east coast you should check
    It's run by 9th degree Shihan Tom Ingargiola.
    He came from fred villaris like your masters. And he would let you own your dojo 100% for less money.

    Before you buy a car you do background check on it first right?
    Does it have a habit of breaking down after 30,000 miles? Crappy gas mileage?
    Does it handle well?

    Why should martial arts schools be any different?
  7. Almost A Ghost

    Almost A Ghost Valued Member

    That statement is somewhat untrue. Red belts have run studios before, while your district manager may not do that, others have. Is it a bad thing? Depends on who you are asking, what the situation is, and the quality of instruction. I'm pretty sure everybody can dream up good and bad scenerios.
  8. John Bishop

    John Bishop Valued Member

    Well lets see. A student is paying $150-$200 a month to be taught by a green or brown belt wearing a "red instructor's" belt.
    Sounds like a good thing for the people getting paid. Whole lot more green and brown belts to run schools then experienced black belts.
    Don't sound like a good thing for the people doing the paying.
  9. Almost A Ghost

    Almost A Ghost Valued Member

    Let's take yours and add to it:

    That A red belt, who's actual rank is a brown belt that is a month or two away from testing for their black belt is put in charge of a realtively new school were none of the students are above a blue belt level.

    Teaching experience *can* come before you get a blackbelt, there's nothing stating otherwise.

    Like I said, anybody can dream up good and bad scenerios about this subject. Now you can sit there all day and dream up horrible scenerios about such situations, but until you can point at a school, USSD or not, that's doing that right now, or have a personal experience with this, it's all just talk and ghost stories.
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2006
  10. bill007

    bill007 New Member

    150 - 200$ a month wow!!! I hope there's a private class each week in the package :eek:
  11. John Bishop

    John Bishop Valued Member

    So, do the students pay the same fees for classes from a "brown belt who's almost a black belt", as they do in the schools run by 6th-7th degrees etc? And is the true rank of the instructor disclosed to the student before they sign up?
  12. Almost A Ghost

    Almost A Ghost Valued Member

    Sorry, I can't answer that, it's been a number of years since I have been with the org. If you are really interested, you could try calling the district managers.

    I'm just trying to think if I've ever scene somebody that high in rank that was still running a school instead of being a district manager or something above that level....
  13. DAnjo

    DAnjo Valued Member

    Well, when Michelle Fanara, a 2nd degree, left Seal Beach CA. in 2004, it was handed over to a guy named Russle. Russle was a green belt, who wore red in class. How do I know? Because I tested in the same tests as Russle and I out-ranked him. I do know that very often, when one is enrolled in the instructor's academy, they occasionally let you "skip ranks" by being what they call "Double Promoted". That was done with Russle in the test he was in with me. I was going for Green-brown stripe and he was a purple belt that was skipped to green. The thing Russle did have, was enough money to put a down payment on the franchise. I quit one day after he took over. There was no way that I was calling someone "Sensei" and bowing to them when I outranked them. Even when he tried to correct my sparring a couple of weeks earlier, I knew that I outranked him I invited him to show me how to do it better by getting his gear on and going with me. He refused since he knew I could kick the crap out of him in sparring (I'd done it several weeks before).

    Honestly, that whole "Red Belt" thing was one of the worst things about the USSD. And, "No" you didnt get a discount for being taught by one of them.

    As to the private lessons...if your black belt instructor was too busy, you were then taught by one of their red belts instead. Horrible practice.
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2006
  14. DAnjo

    DAnjo Valued Member

    Exactly. There were a few. Like Blain Carter etc. But not many. They mostly gave those fat old boys high rank for business reasons there.

    I'm glad that my current instructor hasn't stopped teaching because he's higher than a fourth degree.
  15. Almost A Ghost

    Almost A Ghost Valued Member

    DAnjo, thanks for posting that experience.

    I have seen that happen first hand myself a couple of times. I went through the "instructors college", but I digress... I don't want to seem as a person who's "bitter", just happy things "didn't work out".
  16. KempoFist

    KempoFist Attention Whore

    In all honesty Mr. Bishop I'd put my money on alot of brown-1st dan instructors being more qualified to teach than alot of USSD high belts just on the principle that they are still within a bit more of the confines of reality, and don't get so caught up in the fear they strike into their students (at high ranks, you can demonstrate compliant techniques, and seemingly everything and anything you do will work flawlessly on your student who's afraid to offend you). At the lower ranks, you still have to prove to not only your students but yourself that what you're teaching is good. The higher up you go, the more delusional they get. :rolleyes:
  17. DAnjo

    DAnjo Valued Member

    As long as you're confining your remarks to the USSD, I'll agree with you. AS far as BJJ and Kajukenbo, I'd say that that is definitely not the case. If it were, I'd have been gone in six weeks. I'm too old to play those type of games anymore.
  18. FightingMonk2k3

    FightingMonk2k3 Valued Member

    so if i am understanding this right, students w/ USSD that have enough $$ to buy their way through the ranks instead of actually train and test their way through the ranks, can own their own place even b4 they make it to black?

    that's a huge mistake AND one of the most stupidest things i've ever heard. when i was with Villari's Shaolin Kempo, my instructors usually had black belts train the students when the main instructors were busy. at that time, there must have been, i'd say about 10 to 15 extra black belts that'd train at the location i was at before i left. now it's down to like, 3 because of people branching off to do "better things" or because of too much drama.
  19. PeterG

    PeterG Valued Member

    Is that what they said, or what the abbot said? And can you point to a non-USSD source that says that?

    What does that make the other Westerners who have studied at the temple, chopped liver?
  20. KempoFist

    KempoFist Attention Whore

    It is to my understanding that Mr. Demasco and Mattera are "representatives" of the temple, and not just students. If you read BB mag, you'll see lots of articles of Demasco speaking as a Kung Fu practitioner and representative and not a Kempo master. Everyone else are just students of the temple.

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