Ukraine say's Russia has invaded

Discussion in 'Off Topic Area' started by Rhythmkiller, Feb 28, 2014.

  1. inthespirit

    inthespirit ignant

    http://hereandnow.wbur.org/2014/02/20/media-coverage-russia?utm_medium=referral&utm_source=t.co

    Stephen Cohen has a lot of good analysis on Russian matters, unfortunately the Western mainstream media still prefers a heavy anti-Russia propaganda approach as was seen prior to the Winter Olympics. This of course is probably not so obvious if you don't have diverse sources of information available.
     
  2. embra

    embra Valued Member

    The UK is not in any shape to get involved in any more daft punch-ups - our armed forces are thread-bare.

    Mr Hague can do his best to strut his pseudo big-cheese diplomat shoes, but I can't see anyone paying much attention.

    We should thank Mr. Putin for chemical weapons removal from Syria - not that Syria is any good shape, but the worst excesses have been removed - at least as far is tangibly visible from our national and international news services.

    UKraine is a damm complicated potato, with a lot of complicated history. Does look quite serious though.
     
  3. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    I was just reading something from another forum about how the EU didn't want Ukraine membership. Ukraine wanted it because the movement laws allow them to leave to other countries for work and a lot of EU states have Eastern immigrants as a red flag among their electorates. Dunno if its true but its interesting
     
  4. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

    It probably has more to do with Ukraine being too politically complicated. Russia would go ballistic if EU membership was a serious proposition. That's why Ukraine can never be a member of NATO - because we don't want to provoke Russia.
     
  5. Rhythmkiller

    Rhythmkiller Animo Non Astutia

    John Kerry making his way to Ukraine this week, he has accused Moscow of violating Ukraines sovereignty. Says the Rusia could lose their seat from the group of eight nations (G8) stating russia had acted with a "Brazen act of agression". He is meeting with the new Ukraine government to reinforce the US support for them.

    Baza
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2014
  6. inthespirit

    inthespirit ignant

    I dont normally take RT reports without a pinch of salt as they are just the other side of the coin so to speak, but I do find this sort of talk coming from top US government officials very amusing and this article does expand on this a bit.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2014
  7. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    I think that the Cold War merely warmed up a bit for a while, rather than coming to an end. The "Cold" War is a misnomer also, apparently more people died in warfare in the second half of the 20th Century than the first half.

    Here's an interesting take on it: http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/the-war-of-the-world/
     
  8. inthespirit

    inthespirit ignant

    Thanks for the link David, looks like an interesting documentary, will have a watch when I get some free time.
     
  9. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    What reading about this on social media and other forums has shown me is that a lot of people seem to really not like complicated situations. There has to be a clear good guy/bad guy, a clear reason why, and a clear endgame.

    Its also shown me that as much as I enjoy history and international politics, trying to learn about the build up to all of this makes my head hurt. I am definitely a "B" student.
     
  10. Rhythmkiller

    Rhythmkiller Animo Non Astutia

    Many believe that this was all set up by by the west as a way to get russia to show its hand. Ukraine trying to integrate into the EU not sitting well with Russia who still has a lot of assets in the country.

    Throw in Crimea and Russia steps up to protect the people of that area who believe they are citizens of Russia and agree with the Russian politic and at odds with the Ukraine version.

    We have to remember that Ukraine people however wanted rid of the president. Russia declared this illegal and intervened but the Ukraine people believe that the ousted president was a politcial puppet for Russia. Years of trying to get into the EU simply thrown out overnight by their president to achieve stronger ties with Russia was a major blow to the people.

    On the other hand Russia are seeing issues develope on their borders and have a right to protect their interests/assets. Threats from the west proclaiming freezing assets in respective countries is only going to fuel this issue.

    Baza
     
  11. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    Did the majority want him gone though? And even then did the majority of those people want him gone and to lessen ties with Russia or did they just want him gone for killing protesters?
     
  12. Rhythmkiller

    Rhythmkiller Animo Non Astutia

    That my friend is the question. Who knows? is the answer. It's a shame though. People shouldn't be living that life in this day and age. This is beginning to look more like a power struggle of West vs East.

    Baza
     
  13. Van Zandt

    Van Zandt Mr. High Kick

  14. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    According to what I'm reading, no. At best polls were split down the middle and Crimea was always opposed to it. What does seem a bit weird/interesting to me is that the Euromaiden protests were sort of a gradual shift from protest to revolution. In Crimea though the protesters apparently started recruiting for militias and forming "defence groups" as soon as they started protesting. The more I read about it all the more I'm sticking with my original impression that the Crimea wants this and Ukraine would be better off letting it go.
     
  15. Rhythmkiller

    Rhythmkiller Animo Non Astutia

    Yeah Ukraine would be better letting go of crimea. You got a link i could get a look at. I'm scraping round news agencies that aren't 100% accurate. The info your getting sound interesting specifically the split in the poll.

    Baza
     
  16. Bozza Bostik

    Bozza Bostik Antichrist on Button Moon

    Situations like the one in the Ukraine and the conflict in the Balkans are just too damn complicated though, with years of history behind it all. Where do you even start?

    Kate Adie wrote an interesting article about good guys/bad guys and how it affects reporting the situation. I can't find it online, but this is the gist of it (from: War of Words: Washington Tackles the Yugoslav Conflict).

    They need to sale the papers.
     

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    Last edited: Mar 3, 2014
  17. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euromaidan

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Ukrainian_revolution

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014_Crimean_crisis

    The sources I've checked so far seem to be good and I imagine with something like this the moderators are all over those pages. Being kept very up to date as well. I like that I was reading about events today on Wikipedia before they got on the bbc :p
     
  18. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

  19. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

  20. holyheadjch

    holyheadjch Valued Member

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