Tragic End to a beloved Martial Arts Program

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussion' started by G50, Nov 26, 2011.

  1. ShangChi

    ShangChi KRAV MAGA!

    I may be wrong here, as I often am, but wouldn't having a 3rd or 4th Dan in a reputable martial art style make you more than capable of teaching, if you wanted to?

    Not flaming and not calling what you do/did disreputable, as I really know nothing of it, but just wondering out loud based on my own knowledge and experience.
     
  2. G50

    G50 Night Owl

    ==============

    According to the receipts and contracts (I kept them), the payments were made directly to Bally Total Fitness.

    Yes, Bally's does pay all of the Masters and Instructors.

    That 'get away week' comment I made, was just what I thought was the reason it is so difficult to get in touch with them this week. I should have made that clear.

    I got through due to a phone number of one of the higher Masters that I kept.
    When I couldn't get in touch with my actual school's Master, and had to find out what happened to TMA through Bally's staff members, I originally thought that all contacts were gone.

    I must stop making assumptions... <sigh>...

    ===========

    ShangChi - at Bally's TMA, to become/be promoted to a Master, you have to be full trained in the teaching aspects, and pass a specific test after obtaining 4th Dan to earn the position.

    I had not completed that training, and personally I do not feel ready nor confident to fully teach on my own yet. My specific disability also has an effect as well.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2011
  3. Pretty In Pink

    Pretty In Pink Moved on MAP 2017 Gold Award

    I hate when somebody calls another person "Master". Makes me go all shuddery.

    True, 4th dan is a very high rank in any other martial art.
     
  4. G50

    G50 Night Owl

    ===========

    Why?

    ---

    4th Dan isn't an automatic promotion to Master. At least, that's what I was told.
     
  5. ShangChi

    ShangChi KRAV MAGA!

    IME a lot of Masters, aren't.

    Also, culturally, the country Chadderz and I hail from takes a very, very, very jaundiced view of authority and anyone setting themselves above others, especially if it involves putting a silly title in front of their name...
     
  6. G50

    G50 Night Owl

    ======

    I understand. :cool:


    If you don't mind me asking, what country are you from?
     
  7. ShangChi

    ShangChi KRAV MAGA!

    Scotland.

    We have a phrase here, "Ah kent yer faither", that sums up our attitude to authority figures.
     
  8. Osu,


    Go to Bally, ask for a refund of the remaining of the contract, get your money, go find a kyokushin dojo, train.

    Sorted!


    Osu!
     
  9. Pretty In Pink

    Pretty In Pink Moved on MAP 2017 Gold Award

    Because somebody who asks you to call them "Master" has some serious issues.


    4th Dan in pretty much ANY martial art will grant you as an Instructor.
     
  10. Pretty In Pink

    Pretty In Pink Moved on MAP 2017 Gold Award

    Good advice.
     
  11. G50

    G50 Night Owl

    Cool.

    We have similar but still different views on Authority figures.


    After I found out what happened, I made sure to get that taken care of.

    Not going to switch arts.

    I see.

    I thought there was a degree/certification for that.
     
  12. Pretty In Pink

    Pretty In Pink Moved on MAP 2017 Gold Award

    Some places will do legitimate instructor courses that will improve your teaching ability. In general though, if you are a 4th Dan, you are either an Instructor, or training with the GM.

    So yeah,how long were you training there?
     
  13. G50

    G50 Night Owl

    =========

    13 years. I had 3 prior years at another school.

    I feel that I need more experience in teaching students, before I feel ready to teach on my own.
     
  14. Done-Gone

    Done-Gone Banned Banned

    1) I can only base things on what happened in Florida - because like I said before, I have a Bally, right next door to my own dojo - and I've seen what they've been doing for the last 5 or 6 years... 1) trying to steal my students, along with the students from all other dojos in the area - by using very nasty and negative tactics. 2) promoting "non deserving students" just to make a quick buck. 3) play with the students for a half hour class - without any real instruction - and have the audacity to call it Martial Arts. 4) tried to close me down and run my dojo out of business, by reducing their rates. 5) aproaching the parents of my students, at my front door. 6) bad mouthing my school and me, personally. 7) when told of the conflict of interest of having two Martial Arts schools, side by side - they offered to take over my space when they'd put us out of business (I was there 2 years before them)... etc,etc.

    2) If you read all the reasons I've listed above, you will understand why I feel that way... I'm sure you would to, if you were in my shoes.

    3) I'm very sorry you will be out $3000 - but whose fault is that... really?

    You keep saying the "Masters" took a week away, because they were so devastated... ONLY SLAVES HAVE MASTERS! and the reason they have gone away, may have nothing to do with the reason you've posted - rather because some of them are in this country illegally, without a visa or with an expired one - and now without any income or livelyhood... Hell, I'd disappear too.

    I also want to tell you that 4th Dan is a high grade in every other style of M/A - so why do you think it isn't in your style of TKD? I think it's because they basically promote the students, weather they deserve it or NOT - only to make a quick buck, as I've stated above. I know you don't want to change styles, but IMHO - you probably should.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2011
  15. monkeywrench

    monkeywrench Valued Member

    Your rank isn't important. Only your training is. Worse comes to worse, you may end up training with a small group or alone...or in another style.

    I know this has been quite a blow for you. I have been a member of a school that was booted out by a gym, my first school actually. It stings to just get tossed out like that.

    If even one class is cancelled at my school, I either get a text or a personal call from a Master level head instructor. If the whole school closed, I can think of no reason on heaven or earth why those running your school would not make *every* effort to inform the students and instructors immediately as soon as they found out. Especially since there is money already paid.
    The fact that they did not to me is very shady.

    In my style, 3rd Dan is when you just start getting to be really proficient. Never mind it being a high rank...which it isn't. I realize other styles view ranks differently.

    13 years of training should have more than prepared you to teach on your own. Is teaching optional? I ask because in my style it isn't for the most part. You begin assistant teaching at the brown belt level and don't get 1st Dan without some teaching experience behind you.
     
  16. Pretty In Pink

    Pretty In Pink Moved on MAP 2017 Gold Award

    Well in BJJ, Karate, Ninjutsu, JJJ, Judo, Krav Maga, and Wing Chun all consider 3rd degree a teaching rank. So it could just be you :p
     
  17. G50

    G50 Night Owl

    ====

    I can understand why'd you'd be upset at who specifically did that to you, your students, and their parents. If it's just that specific location by you, I don't understand why you'd be upset at every school of the organization. Unless there's something I'm not reading right. :confused:

    ----

    As a person, I don't wish harm on another person, company, etc. Regardless of anything they would do to me. That's just the type of person I am.

    ====

    That 'week' comment was an assumption I made. :bang:

    I realize that I shouldn't have assumed anything...

    ---

    Actually, Masters either renewed their Visas when they expire to stay with TMA, or went back to S. Korea. Now that TMA is done, they will most likely either go back to S. Korea, or open up their own studios/join CMA (organization started and run by ex-TMA Masters).


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    Because of my social disability, it takes quite a bit of time to really feel comfortable teaching, and learn ways to overcome my disability and fears to really be the kind of teacher that Martial Arts would expect.

    ---

    This definitely was a big blow to me, they all felt like a family to me all these years.

    --

    I'm not really sure why I was never contacted by my Master, and had to find out another way... I'm not going to make another mistake by making another assumption.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2011
  18. monkeywrench

    monkeywrench Valued Member

    Keep reading my post...you start learning to teach at brown belt. 3rd Dan is indeed a teaching rank in my style. Teaching however does not mean you have nothing to learn.
    :cool:

    Assumption or no, the fact remains that you were left out in the cold.
    That is wrong. Don't make excuses for them. I realize they are very close to you like family. But they make a huge mistake. Don't cover that up.

    And as has been stated already, when you get back into training make a point of keeping up with people via Facebook or whatever. There's no excuse in this day and age for a communication breakdown of this magnitude to have happened. No excuse whatsoever.

    I have a bit of social anxiety myself, so I know how you feel. I can't quite put my finger on why, but the few times I have taken over (like if the instructor needs to go greet visitors or something, or needs to step away for whatever reason) I have done well. It feels natural to me to lead people in class. It's probably due to the fact that I've been doing this sort of thing (since the early/mid 90s) for a while...just not in the same school.

    I think you would be surprised at how well you would do if you gave yourself a chance.
     
  19. Pretty In Pink

    Pretty In Pink Moved on MAP 2017 Gold Award

    Neither did I?
     
  20. Mangosteen

    Mangosteen Hold strong not


    Great Idea guys!

    @Chadderz - I'm totally gonna have the people at my club call me "Master"
     

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