My point is that you're making a strawman argument. Olympic TKD is a sport like any other sport. It has rules to achieve an end. Soccer is a different sport from basketball almost entirely due to the ruleset . . . both sports involve taking a ball and putting it into some sort of goal. Maybe it would be best for you to just pretend that the kicks in Olympic TKD aren't kicks. Call them "faloozles" instead. And the sport doesn't have its roots in a Korean martial art. Would you then be able to appreciate it just for what it is? Jiu-jitsu is a game even if you add in striking, just like MMA is a game. They ALL have rules. If you're training for SD, train with NO ruleset. The moment you add even a SINGLE rule and incorporate some sort of competitive structure, it's a sport. The ruleset of Olympic TKD is such that it would be differentiated from kickboxing and have its own identity. It also was designed to show off TKD's trademark kicks. It actually sounds pretty clever to me. Right, because every punch a boxer throws is a power shot and they never try to win on points. . . First off, I don't know what kind of jeans you wear, but I can throw any kind of kick you'd like to see in a pair of jeans. This isn't the 70s. My jeans aren't that tight. Second, I guess my real question is why are you picking on TKD? Why are you not starting the same kind of threads all around the forum? You seem obsessed with TKD's kick-centered fighting system, but again, boxers can't even defend a takedown. Not only that, you keep talking about enclosed spaces and the like. Well even a boxer needs a certain amount of distance to get his punches off. A judoka on the other hand can do his thing as soon as he gets his hands on you. So go on the boxing forum and start a thread about how their ruleset is too limited to deal with grapplers. Do the same thing for MT. Then go start a thread on the MMA board about how MMArtists are being set up to fail because MMA puts fighters in all kinds of positions where they'd be vulnerable to groin attacks and eye gouging. So if you're going to play this game, then fine, but carry the argument all the way to its logical conclusion and don't give anyone a free pass. Also, I'll point out that if you're going to make the point that a small, enclosed space favors a boxer or a TKDist, then a large open space favors someone who can both punch AND kick (as many TKDists, especially ITFers, are able to do). You may be able to make the argument that TKDists have less sophisticated punching abilities than a boxer, but boxers have NO kicking abilities whatsoever! And where are you more likely to run into a self-defense situation? On the street or in an elevator?