I do sometimes think, when I do my pitifully slow 5k runs (I'd hesitate to even call them runs), that I'd probably get injured less and recover quicker if I had a fight rather than if I made a run for it. As you approach 50 running becomes an extreme sport that must be undertaken carefully.
In all seriousness if you watch any of those police reality shows the amount of time the coppers injury themselves or are in no fit state to do anything if they catch the guy after a relatively short run is frightening, Also the energy system usage is so different between a log and an all out sprint that if you want to actually be able to run away you have to train ...well running away lol
I personally can't run. I have always taken the advice to run away to be, make distance and try to get to either away from the opponent or at least to a safer environment. However the intended audience for this talk is a running club, which got me thinking about where i would run to if I could.
if we are to give advice that also worked for people who could not run. It looks like we could agree that the advise is. "Get away from the attacker if you feel that it is possible. If getting away is not possible it might be possible to get to a more advantageous environment if you can. " This actually gets us back to the original question. “What are the properties of a space make it safer?” Several posts mention that the presence of people can deter an attack. What other properties of the environment are likely to act as a deterrent and why? In my mind this question is linked to, but no the same as, the question “What are the properties of a space that make it pose an increased risk of an attack?” I would really appreciate peoples thoughts.
Some factors... Other people (as noted). No criminal wants witnesses. Some care less than others. Although I've always thought that "people" are also the very things that will cause us trouble. Walk through Bigg Market in Newcastle, Market Square in Nottingham or Union Street in Plymouth on a Saturday night and there'll be loads of people but you'll be more in danger of attack than if you were walking down a quiet suburban street a mile away. CCTV. Many muggers, druggies and shop lifters know the CCTV coverage and blindspots in their area and will pick the location that suits them. Lighting. Anything that increases the chances of being seen. Passing traffic. Although people are unlikely to stop their cars, witnesses and people willing to call 999 are a consideration. Proximity to any security personel/bouncers/leo. Although security staff are generally loath to deal with anything not directly related to their place of work it'd be a strange bouncer or security guard that didn't help out a woman in distress. If an attacker is attempting to take you to a secondary crime scene/location then almost any effort at escape will be a benefit. If they could do the crime they have planned there and then they would. Another location of their choosing will be much more dangerous than the current one. So the inverse of that would be dark, secluded places without much footfall, no open businesses or CCTV coverage? But then such places are also unlikely to be rich pickings for potential victims and not worth your average mugger hanging around?
Crowded places have more crime. Men are more likely to be the victim of a violent attack in a town centre, also pick pockets and bag snatchers. Muggers lurk in secluded thoroughfares between busy places, though sometimes they are brazen and do it in crowded places. Personally, I'd rather face a lone mugger in a dark alley than a group of drunk men looking to prove themselves on a night out. The considerations for women are different, as they are most at risk from people they know, which is much harder to address, and it isn't something I've seen tackled by any of the big names in the self defence industry.
If you are running from the authorities, keep running. If you are in a foreign country and don't know the laws, keep running. If there are witnesses, you may want to keep running. The person being chased is usually thought of as a suspect.
Excellent, detailed post from @Simon, and I think it ties with what @Ero-Sennin says. Simon is just laying bare the steps of the decisions made and reviewed continually. An important part of training for personal safety, IMO, is to spend some effort in consciously reviewing that decision making process, such that when done for real, it is more informed. It's not about making the process in the moment complicated, it's actually the opposite. So much is situational that giving concrete answers is difficult without leaving oneself open to a yebbut answer. As I said before, I think trying to assess the nature of the attack is important. I've watched clips, as I'm sure we all have, of a victim standing one side of a very simple obstacle like a car, and playing chase round and round it. It is surprising how quickly most single attackers give up at this point. That situation would be very different if it were multiple attackers, or the victim cannot run, etc etc. Knowing what you are facing makes a difference. As for what constitutes a safe environment to flee to, I think we again have a ton of variables to deal with to avoid the yebbuts. The points raised so far all seem good to me, though we have to be careful to address the issue of fleeing from a crime to deter it from continuing, to being in a place where a crime may occur. In my own experience, the courses I have taught have had particular target audiences, and I think that helps a huge amount in the overall point of offering relevant help. I have generally taught 17/18 year olds about to leave school for university in a new town, university students and post grads, with a few other groups here and there. Often groups have been separated by gender. So in giving advice to a 20 year old female in Nottingham I can be much more specific than answering a general question that might cover different ages, genders, cultures and areas. Just my thoughts
A cognitive psychological view about thinking through stuff. Phycologists talk about schema , a schema is a "framework for understanding / making sense of a subject or problem" My aim in asking these questions is to get as many viewpoints as possible to develop my own framework for making sense of self defence. Hopefully other members will also find this helpful for themselves. Constructing and developing schema is a messy business that takes time. this is why it its good to think about all of this stuff before being confronted with a potential attack.
Out of interest, do you broach the subject of physical and sexual assault by partners to the young women at the courses you teach?
It's all very well developing schema and learning about dead colonels, without practical training under pressure I am doubtful how effective that will be in application. There is another concept in psychology called state dependent memory. Analogous to self defence is my experience with survival training: I find it difficult to recall most of the time, but as soon as I am hungry, tired, cold, thirsty etc, it all comes flooding back because those are the states I learned in. For that reason I am very dubious of survival and bushcraft courses where you sleep in a tent, have tea and a fry up for breakfast, then learn how to make fire, procure water etc... You will remember these skills when you are comfortable, but they will leave you when you need them most. Much like martial artists who have never sparred falling apart under pressure. Any skills they may have were not learnt in an appropriate state to be of practical value. This kind of "white board learning" is more appropriate for people who can already apply these concepts under pressure and wish to teach them to others. Students should be undergoing practical exercises that bring desired qualities out, and the theory is a bit superfluous to that, IMHO. Quick primer on context and state dependent memory: https://www.simplypsychology.org/context-and-state-dependent-memory.html
I'd absolutely agree that some adrenalised training is important, but I don't think this discussion denies that, it's just looking at another aspect.
As you are neither young, nor a woman, what resources do you draw on? Are you just drawing awareness to probability of risk, or is there practical advice for prevention out there? Just interested, as it is such a thorny subject and as far as I can see it is one that self defence instructors don't generally address. Probably because it can't be solved with a kick in the balls and a headbutt!
Not young, but very youthful We talk through basic stats on perpetrators being known to an assailant, something that many have not considered before, and talk about personal safety measures they can take. Personally, I put some faith in their gut instinct; by their late teens/twenties many women have a much better radar than many men will ever have, but sometimes convince themselves to override it, spurred on by predatory verbal strategies of course. As much of what I do takes place in a University, I have the benefit of many support services I can signpost too. Though they are sometimes billed as self defence courses, and if I'm being lazy and talking to someone with no real interest I might use that phrase as a short hand, I think of it more as personal safety.
If I taught self defence courses for women (I don't but if I did) I would probably have the relevant statistics to hand on types of attack and types of attacker people are likely to face. Where and when attacks are likely to happen. I would have a hand out of further places and resources to contact in regards to domestic violence. The Suzy Lamplugh trust Suzy Lamplugh Trust Rape crisis Home | Rape Crisis England & Wales Signs of being in an abusive or controlling relationship (a strong indicator of being in imminent physical and emotional danger) https://www.nationaldahelpline.org.uk/en/What-is-abuse Help leaving an abusive relationship https://www.nationaldahelpline.org.uk/ I would make that information part of a hand out that EVERYONE on the course gets (no exceptions). So that someone in need of that information doesn't have to make it known that they need it, put their hand up, come forward or stand out. If everyone takes the handout then no one needs to feel like a special case or draw attention to themselves. There may even be women, who aren't on the course, that need the hand out and it can be passed on.
Spot on. As @David Harrison has alluded to, it is easy and potentially damaging to approach some of these issues without great sensitivity. Anyway, apologies, we have drifted off-topic again, and should probably return to the original question
Always good to refer people to those with more expertise, but I do find it interesting that people who bill themselves as self defence instructors don't directly address the most probable risks of violence for women. Not having a go at you, Mitch, I think the fact you raise the issue and refer to other groups puts you ahead of many.
