You know that TKd kick you showed is ususally done with the front leg. When using the back leg my instructor and most TKd practioners completely rotate their hips because they know thats where the power comes from.
The arm is dropped/thrown backwards to help in extending the hip, thereby generating more power. I personally do not tend to do this, rather throw the arm above my kicking leg out towards the opponents face and snap it in the opposing direction to my kick. This helped in correcting a blip in my technique where i was turning my hips over too much. A gem of knowledge i picked up from Jitti in Bangkok was leaning. I can't really explain it without showing it, but imagine throwing the shoulder of your kicking side down and diagonally acroos your opponent. Doing this causes a natural sideways lean and generates far more power, possibly because your weight is forced 'over' your kick. Peace.
Just to clarify TKD here: There is also quite a difference in technique between different styles of TKD round/turning kicks. The ITF one comes in chambered with the leg travelling at least parallel to the ground, if anything the leg should be travelling downwards on the point of impact (with added power from a sine wave motion), and gets the hips to generate momentum. At the point of impact the leg is a '45 degree' position from your body. The WTF one (that looked like the one shown in the image played earlier) tends to chamber front the front, then the body twists. This substitutes power for speed IMO.
Ikken, I don't want to sound like I'm trying to brown nose, but i reckon you're probably the best poster out there, that post was excellent, and so was your F.A.Q Good work!
Notice how Ikken said in regards to the body roundhouse -- it comes STRAIGHT THROUGH, not back and around like most people think. Plus the leg is bent at the knee, like on that picture, if I remember correctly.
May be resorecting a dead thread. But thought I'd add my bit in. We're taught to drive through and upwards with a mid point kick, you aim to hit just under the ribs, and kick through and upwards in attempt to break the lower 2 or 3 ribs? Is that near enough right? We're taught to reach over with the trailing arm, to protect yourself and so that you can get a bit more momentum in it, because apparently swinging it back would put momentum in the opposite direction, seems to sound ok. Apparently, your trailing arm should be inline with hips and leg on contact. But, then again, if you can kick harder or more comfortably with another method, do it. Look at all the fighters, none have throw the techniques the same way, it's all variations that suit them and their body.
anyone got a short video clip illustrating the thai roundhouse?.... the explanations really do help, but a clip in slo mo would be sweet!
Interesting thread Would you say that the roundhouse to the mid section in Thai is easier to perform than the Shotokan roundhouse to the mid section? Although in freestyle a lot of guy's Shotokan kind of reverts to an unchambered diagonal kick more similar to the Thai one. I'm talking more about the basic Shotokan one. Or would you say the Shotokan one is easier? In other forms of Karate the kick is more diagonal but in Shotokan it chops down. I'm not talking about power, just form, for now.....
i've always had a question about the MT roundhouse. doesn't all the momentum seriously mess you up if you miss? i mean, i throw chambered kicks (WTF TKD), and i believe i recuperate quite quickly, but i still get my ass whacked if my sparring partner has moved out of the way. when i started, i used to kick like that, as if swinging a baseball bat. even though i had more power, my follow-ups were a lot slower. i'll do a kick like that if the opportunity arises where i know i cannot miss, but otherwise, it's a huge risk IMO. another question. do you guys have spinning hook kicks? (ie. spinning the roundhouse in the opposite direction to strike with the heel)
if you miss A kick, you spin all the way through it back to where you started. you could spice it up and throw in a spinning back fist too
It should not be an issue if you are kicking in range. What I mean is that you train to throw the kick when you are at the proper range to actually land the kick. So, if you miss, it means your opponent moved out of the way. That puts him at a momentary disadvantage as well, as he is now out of range to effectively counter-attack. Remember, if you're used to WTF TKD, you're not used to the difference in range. MuayThai throws roundhouse kicks with the intention of striking with teh surface of the shinbone, not the foot. It might seem like its only a couple of inches, but it makes a HUGE difference in how you move to make your opponent miss! Also, when you 1st learn a MT roundhouse kick, you are taught to allow it to spin you all the way through. You practically perform a full 360-degree spin when you miss. But this is just a teaching tool! This teaches you the proper body mechanics for when you are throwing the kick. As you progress, you learn to gradually shorten the kick so that even if you miss, you do not expose your back. And yes, MT does have spinning hook kicks, back kicks, and spinning back kicks. They are just rarely used because they are not high percentage techniques. If you throw one of these techniques and it doesn't land properly, it often puts you in a position of serious disadvantage. Even so, if you watch enough MT fights, you will see these occassionally come into play.
Jumping on to what Brooks already said, while the roundhouse is one of the staple moves, Muay Thai has an advanced set of techniques that are less common. In my experience, most people equate MT to the striking they see in the UFC reality show, but in actuality those fighters seem to employ only the most basic techniques.
Coming from someone with both a TKD and Muay Thai backround, I find the main differences to be in the part of the foot that is used and the ending recovery of the two kicks. In TKD, roundhouse kicks aim to hit with either the top of the foot or the ball of the foot. In MT, it's not so much the foot as it is the shin. For TKD, after a roundhouse is thrown the kick is rechambered, hit or miss. In MT, kicks are thrown with such great and fully comitted force that, if you were to miss, the force would cause your body to spin full circle.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3404547572879309209&q=Muay+Thai++roundhouse+kick http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8385948868782269603&q=Muay+Thai++roundhouse+kick http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1388094036745333356&q=Muay+Thai++roundhouse+kick I don't know if i like what i see in these kick but here are some roundhouse kicks.
I wasn't taught to always step first like the guy in the first clip says. You can just twist your front foot to get power into it. The guy in the second and third vids isn't twisting his front foot as much as I was taught either, and he kinda looks like he's snapping the kick but I can't really tell all that well. And also he should keep his guard up properly. He might be a beginner or something...
"In my experience, most people equate MT to the striking they see in the UFC reality show, but in actuality those fighters seem to employ only the most basic techniques." I've always thought that one of the main strengths of Thai is the basic-ness of the fundamental techniques. Not to say that they are easy to do but that they are few in number and combine well together from the basic structure/stance. Thai is like chess...a few basic rules and options that combine into an infinite array. Rather than other arts with multiple strikes, blocks, stances etc. A person can fight perfectly well with only the standard Thai techniques.
The unchambering, travelling in a straight line quality of Thai kicks always reminds me of WC kicks, well at least WSLWC kicks. In my opinion chambering say a front kick is not so bad in that it takes two actions (although that can be taken advantage of very easily, telegraph and jamming) but rather the energy is disapated into the hips and makes you fall on your ass if don't do it just right, unlike the WC front kick which comes up straight from the ground and the lines of force are from the ground to the opponent and vice versa. I've done shotokan to the 1st kyu level and WC for a year so I know of what I speak. Same with the sidekick, unchambered in a straight line. I'm interested in checking out a Thai school oneday just to see their philosophy of kicking since it sounds (and looks) interesting.
