I am curious, having just received my purple belt in Kenpo, and going thru a couple of pins, what people receive for pins at various levels. My instructor is an MMA fighter, and Kenpo Black Belt in the Chow liniage. He is a very "old school" trainer being very physical with those that can take it (not kids and such yet). My orange belt pin was a few forearm smashes and a pretty solid punch in the stomach, not a big deal (in hindsight) my purple pin was much, much harder...makes me scared of what comes next. But I can take it, if he can give it, I can take. That said, I also take Ju Jitsu and Kickboxing, so contact isn't that foreign any more... I am just curious what peopls experience is with pins at various stages of training and in which liniage of the art, Chow, Parker, etc...
Well, the style I train it is like the military "pins", a right of passage to the next level. After my orange belt test I took a few hard blows from my trainer...much like some limitary branches get a pin put on their uniform, then everyone in their group punches the pin (which then sticks into their body). For my orange belt, I stood in square horse, my instructor came up to shake my hand and congratulate me, first, he took my arms, one at a time, and slammed his forearm into the top and bottom of my forearms, then, while still in square horse, he wound up a slogged me in the stomach, after I got up, he shook my hand. Purple belt was substantially more painful...but, the bruises are healing now, and I have begun blue belt techniques
OK, well, does nobody else have this tradition, or is it a top secret held by the pinned...I am just curious how tough people have had it in different styles, Chow, Parker, etc...as I understood it, I thought Parker kind of played down the tradition of pinning, but I might be wrong, thats what I am trying to find out.
When somebody is promoted at our school, other studetns of higher rank shake their hand and give them a shot to the solar plexus. Studetns of teh same rank or lower just shake hands. We beat on them enough during the test so no need for more... In AK they do a "kick-in" where your instructor gives you a solid body kick, but that's only at black, and it is noly one kick. What you describe sounds like sanchin kata which I am just starting to train.
Interesting...I figured each school/instructor kinda had their own traditions in this regard depending on how they were trained. For purple I took solar plexus kicks, fists and open hands as well as thai kicks to the legs. For the black belt it's a pretty brutal assault, my instructor took 3 or 4 shots to the...ummmm..."package"... The basic jist with us is that you get various shots until you don't flinch when they are coming, it's a matter of mind/body...I took a few extra open hands cuz I kept ever so slightly flinching...human instinct is hard to control some days...oddly though, the punches and side thrusts I took without flinching... after that beating I took my JuiJitsu class, probably a mistake, my tummy was kinda tender
i was going to say the same thing, i guess everyschool has there own way of doing things, but as long as i have been in kenpo we always gave a kick for black belt.
Sometimes we had dick of the day for competitions and the like where the nominated party got to run down the middle of Northumbria street and had to bu a ticket for the metro whilst only wearing there underwear but we dont have anything that comes close to what you describe.
Nothing so exotic with us, just a certificate. It might be an American thing. I was in our Air Force for 14 years and never experienced anything like that.
lightweights I suspected the severity of that tradition was very much subject to how the instructor was trained. Being trained from instructors that were very much from a military background, special ops teams and such, it's likely that was it's root. He is very much into HARD physical training and pain management.
What you are actually describing is called "hazing" and was "banned" from all U.S. military institutions back in the 1990's.
Yeah, I suppose that true, but really, the tradition as far as the liniage of Kenpo goes back much further than that...but I am just using the military hazing or whatever as a relation to "the pin", my question was really just what people were subjected to at various levels of rank, that's all, not trying to get into a debate about anything
Sorry but that's just ridiculous to me. Reminds me of a Beavis and Butthead cartoon I saw years ago with an Army Seargent telling them to kick him in the "nards'. His face got really red and he'd tell them to do it again. Their reply was... " heh heh cool." Yes, taking shots and getting used to them will toughen you up. But there is a big difference between muscle and bone shots i.e. the aforementioned sanchin kata then to a vital area that will never toughen up. Muscles have an inborn ability to adapt to damage as do bones. Your testicles do not. Plain and simple anatomy 101. Even with the usual disclaimer contract you have to sign on entering a school. I doubt any judge or jury would favor the side of the instructor when his reply to why his student had to have one testicle removed because it ruptured is because it was to toughen him up. But that's jut imho.
When I was in the Air Force, when you got new stripes some of the guys would punch the stripe, "tag 'em". As far as punching pins in to the body, that's just sadistic.
I am surprised it took this long for the "thats rediculas" response. While I agree to an extent, I also understand the pain management aspect of it...originally martial arts training was MUCH more brutal (if history is written correctly) than the watered down version typical western culture has brought it down to...personally, even though it hurts sometimes, I like it old school.
kenpo testing I have been a student of Kenpo for 18 years. I have never witnessed any of the actions described. My school is under th Dai Nippon Butoku Kai, and we are very traditional. I don't think these practices are in any way helpful to the devlopment of a karate-ka. When an exam is givven and passed the most senior instructor will present each student with their respective belts for kyu grades Yudansha grades are different. The Dan grades come from Hombu and have to be presented by Hanshi himself. There is no abuse of students to be tolerated in the dojo. The rules and guidelines are set by the DNBK and they are to be followed.
"Abuse"...haha, whatever, it's called conditioning...but of course, modern, watered-down MA doesn't believe in that sort of thing as long as they can dance the pretty katas.. Seriously though, I know everybody has their own ways of training, but to start tossing around the word "abuse" is hardly called for. If you are conditioned and used to taking strikes, as I am due to my kickboxing and NHB training, it's really not that much out of the ordinary...just enough out to make it "memorable"
well ... when you go through belt tests there should be alot of contact !!! Part of our system ... although not straight kempo (has many attributes and I have a few kempo forms ie: pinan 1,5/3 and kata 1 amongst others) there is lots of self defense and conditioning... towards the end you have to go through a "gauntlet or circle self defence" and yeah they try to punch your head off !!! You gotta appropriately defend yourself to the level of where you are at. IMHO there should be a certain degree of conditioning on all tests... The worst/hardest and longest tests in our sytem Yellow - at least 4 hours. - how much are you willing to do for that first belt? Shows me your character ... if you push through or give up. Somewhere around Blue or Blue (green stripe) - pure self defence for a few hours. Hell - soo much contact !!! Black - 6 hours (if you're by yourself) 9 hours (more than 1) Pure hell ... total exhausting, all forms, basics, workouts (continuous), self defense (all techniques, grappling, joint locks/escapes,) more than 1 time , then the circle self defense (stand in the middle of black belts and they randomly attack you - trying to punch your face off / kick you butt ... etc) Conditioning should be part of all testing and classes ... just to a certain degree. The teacher knows (should) individuals limits and should try to push it abit. Shr fu Eric
