Not entirely accurate. Inosanto himself, in his book on JKD, says that Lee had zero interest in eskrima. As the story goes, Lee picked up two sticks and started doing moves. Inosanto remarked "that's largo mano!" Lee simply replied that that's how he'd do stickwork. Inosanto never taught Lee eskrima because Lee didn't care to learn it.
What simply is!! I have looked through all of Mr inosantos books and have not seen this statement. I have looked through 'Jeet kune do the art and philosophy of bruce lee' twice!! however I have seen this statement before but you have not said the entire paragraph. It is in 'Bruce Lee fighting spirit' by Bruce Thomas page 176 if I still had the book I would write down the whole paragraph now but I have sold it on amazon. This is how the real story goes Guro Dan Inosanto showed him a LITTLE BIT of escrima one time. He walked away not saying another word, after some time past he came back and said to Guro Dan Inosanto "now I will show you how I would do it" Then Mr Inosanto yelled out "hey that is lago mano" Bruce Lee then replied " I do not know what you call it but this is my method". however saying that the angles of striking with the nunchukus or tabak-toyoks are exactly the same and the angles of striking with the kali sticks. that is because the tabak-toyoks are a filipino martial arts weapon. From my 7 years in training in the Inosanto kali method I have learned that if you train with the sticks you are also training the angle of striking with the knife and the hands. So when I say It is a known fact that Inosanto taught Bruce Lee escrima (with comes from Kali) by teaching him the tabak-toyoks Mr Inosanto ESSENTIALLY has IN FACT taught him ESCRIMA
thank you I have found that the krav maga principles has nearly identical principles to JKD. timing, rythem, distance, half beat, blocking and hitting at the same time etc. but this is the beauty of it, its never ending its life long, it s never complete, the individual is constantly evolving and simplifying his way.
Um... no. 1) Eskrima (note the k, as there's no c in the Filipino alphabet) doesn't "come from" kali. They're two generic terms meaning essentially the same thing. And kali is a term that has found much more frequent use in the West than it's ever had in the Philippines. 2) Showing Lee a few things then having Lee come back once and do some double stick moves hardly constitutes teaching him eskrima. I'd be interested to hear where, in any of that stack of books, it actually says that Guro Dan (whom I respect greatly) DID teach Lee eskrima. 3) The fact that the angles are the same has precisely nothing to do with Lee learning eskrima. For one thing, Lee used nunchaku strictly as a screen prop. He didn't practice them as an actual combative weapon. Nor did any of his notes contain anything referring to eskrima, angles, etc. Even if angles were mentioned, they're prevalent in Western fencing as well, which WAS a known influence on Lee. I love Guro Dan. He's the one who inspired me to get involved in eskrima myself way back in 1989. But the fact remains that Lee didn't learn eskrima.
Paul Vrunak mentions that there is escrima with is part of the 26 elements in the Jun fan gung fu system. (page 13 Jeet kune do concepts & philosophies) Paul vrunak is an instructor under Guro Dan Inosanto I highly doubt that he is displaying wrong information. from this it is also evident that Dan Inosanto taught him escrimia. If you can find Mr Vrunak which I have tried to do via his website please contact him. but from what I see he HAS taught him escrima. and he added it to his system of Jun fan method of gung fu
Because some people are interested in the content and history of the systems they study? Seems a reasonable area to be interested in, IMO.
It is important because there are so many people who are exploiting or teaching the JKD philosophy incorrectly. I will not point my fingers at anyone. I have had people in the JKD community say that it is pointless to do this however if we all keep our mouths shut this philosophy and art will slowly disappear because of all the false teachings out there.
I agree, but judging by post the last couple of posts 1fightforright2 can't even spell the name of the art. In addition what Bruce did shouldn't really be necessarily what you do. This is the point of JKD. Bruce didn't learn Eskrima, it is now included by nearly all (if not all) JKD Instructors. So the fact that Bruce didn't learn it isn't really or relevance. it doesn't water down the art, In fact it adds to it. I am surprised just how wide of the mark so many JKD students are. There isn't a yardstick, there isn't even really a system to learn. Yes JKD Instructors now have a syllabus, but it isn't an historical syllabus and I bet it changes as the Instructor grows. As someone who claims to have trained and studied as much as 1fight has, I feel by getting involved in the "what is and isn't", he is falling into the classical mess Bruce hated and losing the point of what JKD is (or meant to be).
What teachings? Go out and train, cross train, ask questions, see what works and what doesn't. Absorb what is useful, disregard what doesn't work (for you) and move on. I agree there are people making a name off the back of Bruce, but if they are teaching incorrectly, either expose them or move on. There are many better than me, so I should seek them out, but there are many worse. Quite honestly I couldn't care less, I've got training to do.
"Vunak" "Eskrima" If you're going to cite these things, and hope to be taken seriously, you need to spell them correctly. I sold the book you're referring to, so I can't refer to it directly. But the most direct source we have on Lee's thoughts and training is his Tao of JKD. It is, after all, transcribed from his personal notes. Any references to his eskrima training in there? I understand the temptation here. I'm a much bigger fan of Dan Inosanto than I am of Bruce Lee. So I get the desire to believe that Lee learned eskrima from Guro Dan. But the facts aren't there. And Guro Dan doesn't, himself, claim this. The association between eskrima and JKD comes, primarily, from the fact that Lee didn't want "JKD schools." And Guro Dan didn't want to let JKD fizzle out when Lee died. So the compromise struck by Guros Dan and Richard Bustillo was to found a kali academy (so not technically a JKD school) and teach JKD to a select subset of that student body.
In spite you I have re ordered the book on amazon and I will give you the full paragraph when the book arrives. Let s not forget that Tao of JKD are only notes and not the full system of Jun fan gung fu. I will be back! when I look into the eskrima style of fighting. I have been asking my sifus questions regarding eskrima will be back with you soon!
thank you brother Introduced him to eskrima which means he showed him a littele bit. Are you on youtub or facebook? would like to add you!
Ill save you the time. The book also has a suceeding paragraph and clearly shows eskrima was a vehicle moving FORWARD in JKD as opposed to being intrinsic to development. It's a natural fit and shared commonality, but please lets not sacrifice the truth for the sake of expediency when we are studying the history of JKD For some reason MAP photo uploaded is not letting me post the image so ill keep trying
The paragraph actually explicitly states that first Lee took a dim view of eskrima, then that did an impromptu demonstration (the "no previous training" is what made it impromptu) of double stick. The paragraph supports my point. And reordering a book on Amazon just to prove yours doesn't make much sense. I did a little digging around myself, and confirmed that Paul Vunak's book does indeed include Filipino sikaran on that list of 26. But wouldn't it make more sense, given the volume of writing by the two primary sources in question, to use their own words as validation? Guro Dan states that Lee didn't learn eskrima. And Lee makes no mention of it in any of his texts. I don't know what research you plan to do on eskrima. But I'm pretty confident of what you'll find. If Lee had incorporated eskrima into his own JKD, you likely wouldn't find the division you do between "conceptual" and "original." The sticking point for many "original" proponents is the relationship between kali and JKD. Reading through this forum will reinforce that claim quickly.
