Techniques found in sport fighting that are useless in real fights?

Discussion in 'General Martial Arts Discussion' started by Adam, Aug 16, 2004.

  1. Adam

    Adam New Member

    I see all these discussions about that and that STREETFIGHTING technique being worthless if pitted against a well-trained and tough sport full contact sport fighter. Now, I'd like to turn it around and ask you: What techniques commonly used within competitive sport fighting do you fell would be more or less useless if used in real fights?

    Just to start it off, I for one believe the triangle choke (from BJJ and MMA) to be kind of a suicidal move if pulled off against a stronger opponent intent on harming you, given the fact that he might be able to pick you up and ram you into a wall or the ground. I am also sceptical of some of the gi-using chokes, since they depend on your opponent wearing durable clothing with a heavy collar.

    Hope this won't turn into another "sportfighting doesn't work on the street" thread....
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2004
  2. YODA

    YODA The Woofing Admin Supporter

    I'm sure there are many sport specific techniques in many arts that are not suited to reality.

    However - the triangle is VERY good. ESPECIALLY against a bigger stronger attacker, ESPECIALLY if he's in your guard (Rape scenario?). If he has the knowledge on how to pick you up once you learn how to stop it we are then talking about a bigger stronger and well trained submision grappler - not your regular rapist or street thug.

    Collar chokes work well with ANY clothing that is available - you just use the clothing as an anchor rather than to apply the choke with. If there is not clothing - that's what naked chokes are for :p It's like saying the guy may be wearing a motorcycle helmet so don't bother learning to punch to the jaw.
     
  3. Timmy Boy

    Timmy Boy Man on a Mission

    I'm not the first to say this but I think the use of groundwork in an offensive way like you see in the UFC is a bad idea in real life where you're not fighting on a nice soft ring but hard rough concrete. Having said that, it obviously has its use for if you are unwillingly put on the floor, so it's more the tactics, not the techniques, that I think won't work in real life. I can't comment authoriatively though since I know less about grappling than my Grandma.

    With striking I also see tactics, though not necessarily moves, that don't work in real life. Kicks aren't the most difficult thing in the world to grab even by someone who doesn't do grappling, and if you heavily rely on kicks you may find yourself getting floored in the real world. Back kicks are another thing, in real life where people don't care about hitting you in the back they will not be as reliable.
     
  4. oldshadow

    oldshadow Valued Member

    There are some I would not use but with a triangle choke I still have a free hand, which I could use to work the person’s face over. If the person was too big I might give it a second thought.
    Now for the gi using chokes you have to modify them. I have used a T-shirt and when I tore it I just keep wrapping it around their neck and pulling it seamed to work real well.
    There are some like the flying arm bar I do not think I would try as they expose you too much but that’s not saying they will not work. The same as a head kick.
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2004
  5. Timmy Boy

    Timmy Boy Man on a Mission

    I think to say a technique is ineffective in real life because you may be fighting a bigger, stronger opponent kind of misses the point a bit, IMO. If you can see he's bigger and stronger you should just use something other than a triangle choke. Know your style, know yourself, and know what your opponent is likely to do given your experience.
     
  6. oldshadow

    oldshadow Valued Member

    It’s hard to say what will work and what will not because the situations differ so much. There’s a lot of theory on what will work and will not work but how much real experience testing it do these people have.

    Just go for what you know.

    I saw I guy knock out a guy in a bar with a rear leg round kick to the head. No jab or set up he just stood there and kicked him. Not something I would do but it worked great that time.
     
  7. Timmy Boy

    Timmy Boy Man on a Mission

    Nooooooooooo Oldshadow, high kicks aren't supposed to work in real life! :D
     
  8. Bellator Manus

    Bellator Manus Warrior of the Hand

    I thank you mean HIGH kicks are easily grabbed. Most of the time, no one ever expects a low kick to the knee.
     
  9. Knight_Errant

    Knight_Errant Banned Banned

    You are soooo turning into a nutrider :p
    some TKD kicks, some karate strikes and punches and certain wrestling manouveres are highly impractical. But that's like saying a triple pirouette backflip won't help you jump up the steps into the bus :rolleyes:
     
  10. AAAhmed46

    AAAhmed46 Valued Member

    Honestly, there are no rules though in fighting. I know this african guy from central africa, he fought with this ****ED UP fighting style. He threw me around like a rag doll. I asked him what his style was, he said it was a 'local thing'.
     
  11. alex_000

    alex_000 You talking to me?

    I'm bored of hearing what works and doesn't work on the street. If you can do it properly , in that cituation it may work. That's it. Nothing else. (Please note that i'm not talking about traditional chinese/japanese MA that don't do sparring i don't do them and i don't know about em.)

    Can you air roundhouse kick a guy in the temple ? If you can do it properly , it may work .
    Can you jump and head but a guy with your hole body horisontaly (M.Bison style but is actually a MT move) ? If you can do it properly it may work.
    Can you do a split and punch a guy in the balls? If you can do it it properly it may work. .

    On the other hand don't expect even a cross to work on the street if you can't do it properly. You may hit air 10/10 times with a jab if you dont know how to do it properly .

    What i mean is that the thing is what can you do properly? Can you side kick to the solar? Can you roundhouse the head? Maybe you think those are typical stuff that you can easily do , but you cant. People can be veary easy on themselves and think thay can do properly stuff that usually can't.

    Talking about what is more effective and easier to do in a street fight is enother thing i respect and will talk about , but all that "this works and that doesnt" rubbish i'm tired of hearing.

    "sportfighting doesn't work on the street" and that's the stuppidest thing i've heard at these kind of threads . A goddamn soccer kick may work , but "sportfighting" wont work? Oh God....

    my post doesn't talk about anyone here specificly or adam who stated the thread. It's just something i wanted to say in a long time. I'm also sorry about the aggressive tone of my post , those things make me a bit emotional. :) .
     
  12. Poop-Loops

    Poop-Loops Banned Banned

    I'd be wary to use anything that involves spinning, especially since I get dizzy easily. :p

    BUT, like Alex said, if you can get it to work, use it.

    PL
     
  13. Scarlet Mist

    Scarlet Mist Banned Banned

    Any punch, kick, takedown or choke will work if you can execute it and if it has enough force
     
  14. Timmy Boy

    Timmy Boy Man on a Mission

    I think Alex has the right idea. Too often techniques are dismissed as unworkable by people just because they can't do them and they want an excuse. It would be like me saying right hooks don't work because mine is crap.
     
  15. Topher

    Topher allo!

    Not to go off-topic, but whats is a triangle choke?
     
  16. kevamania

    kevamania Valued Member

    Everything works,but not in every situation
     
  17. Smee

    Smee Evil kung fu genius

    http://www.grapplearts.com/picofweek.php?picid=12

    Triangle choke.

    Basically, opponents in your guard (between your legs). Press his left hand against his chest and slip your right leg over his shoulder. Put right leg around the rear of his kneck and hook your left leg over your right ankle. Angle yourself at approximately 30-45 degrees to your opponent and pull his right arm across your body so that it is on a straight line between your groin and head. Squeeze your left leg down on your right ankle to apply pressure to the carotid artery with the crook of your right knee. Pull head down with left hand whilst pushing up with hips and pulling down on arm with right hand. Opponent should pass out.

    My description may be a bit p1sh as I'm a Hung Gar man with only a wee bit of grappling experience.

    Paul
     
  18. Smee

    Smee Evil kung fu genius

    FWIW - I think the triangle may have it's place in the street. The rape suggestion was valid. As is the case where you're just being mauled by a mentalist after he's picked you up and dropped you on your back (quite likely). It may a gamble but it also be your only way out. However, there's a big difference between electing to take someone down to try for a triangle in the street and being forced into that position and trying to apply it as a way out.

    My personal opinion, is that any kicks above the waist or anything that relies upon a high level of "skill" to apply is pretty much worthless - but only insofar as I personally wouldn't risk it. However, as has been said before, if you can make it work then it works.

    More on topic - I think trying a "blitz" would be a fairly significant mistake.....

    Paul
     
  19. Vanir

    Vanir lost my sidhe

    Liked this response.
     
  20. ap Oweyn

    ap Oweyn Ret. Supporter

    Or a leaping backfist, as used in point fighting.
     

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