So it pretty much devolves to, if you do Bagua, you're going to root for Bagua, and if you do Taiji, you're going to root for Taiji. Lol.
No. It most certainly does not. Nor is it a laughing matter. Go up against someone who has a lot of Ba Gua experience, for real, and you will be anhialated.
You do Bagua, I presume? And the Taiji guy will be annihilated as well? OK then, I'll be sure to watch out for any dangerous annihilation techniques from Bagua players if I ever spar with them.
I've dabbled. The Tai Chi guy is more difficult to make an assumption about, it all depends upon what he chooses to do... and whether he decides to play by the 'rules'.
Rubbish. There is no "ultimate, highest level" art. Some arts are deeper and more well-developed than others, but the highest level attainable is you working as hard as you can in one or two styles that suit your body type/personality, etc. Taiji is a very powerful, deep martial arts style, but that's all it is. It isn't the "grand ultimate supreme undefeatable divine fist." (Yes, I know some people translate "Taiji" as "grand ultimate," but that is a misleading translation of what is actually just the name of a Daoist concept). Bagua is also a powerful, deep martial arts style--so is Praying Mantis, so is Mizong-quan, so is Choi Lay Fut and so are many others. Some are better suited to different people and different situations. All have their strengths and weaknesses. None is intrinsically better or higher than the other. Mind you, I'm not saying that SOME arts aren't intrinsically better than others (Taiji=intrinsically better than Tae-bo), but once you reach the level of Taiji and Bagua, i.e. profound and complex martial arts with a high degree of maturity and depth, it starts to all come down to what the practitioner does with it.
The rules hey..... Tell me, in a real fight what rules are you talking about? The rule where the other guy cant stomp your face into the pavement? Or the one where eye raking is out? Or maybe the biting? LOL. Your post about a Bagua player annihalating some other style is as amusing as it is ignorant too. We all know assumption is the mother of all ...... ups but we seem to have found its second child too....
This post is ridiculous. "The bagua person does X" "Taichi person does Z", what a load of ... stuff. Bagua, TaiChi it all depends on the student and the teacher and how they fit within the system. Not that it matters because xingyi OWNS. Oh, and tai chi is the highest form of martial arts??? Yeah.
Why don't you find a teacher and let them guide you there? You'll get a lot of opinions about the subject, but there are probably only two that matter, yours and that of your teacher. Good luck finding a good teacher.
Onyomi, technically speaking you are correct BUT you misunderstand what happens when we transend physical contact. Pyro, if I were to be attacked by someone I would kill if I had to - not very difficult. You also misunderstand the higher arts. If you saw into the true nature of a human being you would do anything possible to avoid raising your hand to them. Pyro, you also misunderstand. This person would not enter UFC. I'm not being big-headed, I don't particularly care. If people understood this stuff it would knock the old Tai Chi vs MMA rubbish on it's ass. Someone of this level would not fight unless it meant a life. Akira2000, qigong is very good and can develop Chi. "Hard Qigong"? - Hand to hand, generally speaking, will not help in this matter. Zac duncan, it's not - but some of what you say makes sense.
You mean like when I said "xingyi OWNS"? I think this thread started out as a Bagua Vs Tai Chi thread, which I truly belive is a ridiculous question. No style ever beat another style. People beat other people. If you want to study IMA or any other type of art, find a good teacher and be a good student and maybe you'll learn something. That's really all there is to it.
What a load of ****e! It is down to the fighter. No style is inherintly better than another. Sure, some are geared towards a sport, but it doesn't take much to adapt. TKD do lots of big high kicks, we all would agree it wouldn't be the most sensible thing to do in a fight. If a TKD player uses those powerful and highly trained legs to boot you in the knee instead, you are going to know about it. It is all down to the person. You may say that martial arts provide a fighter with his tools, but a bad workman blames his tools.
By "hard qigong" do you mean like iron palm? There's no reason you can't do that simultaneously, but make sure you also use the proper medicinal liniment (dit da jow/die da jiu) and don't go too fast or overtrain, else you risk permanent damage to your nerves and joints.
I met a master in Malaysia who could do iron palm. I saw him do it once without warm up and I could hit with about the same amount of impact (very hard on a concrete wall). A few days later I stayed with him at the Grand Masters house, it took him about 45 minutes to build up to full iron palm and what happened next was shocking (well was until I learned eliminate rebound) and I was impressed. It does nothing though. Iron Palm is irrelevent in the context of our discussion.
what a riot! this thread is great, you guys/girls are too funny!! regarding the qi-traiing question: i think yang shi tai ji is the best style of taiji for training beginning level qi gong....because of the extended stretching postures to open joints/meridians and the constant slow pace that really helps to breathe into your body. for intermediate i would suggest wu/hao style, once you've developed basic strength and flexibility from the yang postures, you can continue the qi development with the comfortable postures of wu shi. then i'd recommend chen shi for advanced players who want to vary speed for martial applications and return to larger postures after developing a good foundation. just my opinion. i 100% agree with the other posts that most important is the quality of instruction and the level of student committment. regarding the bagua vs taichi jokes and descriptions: i just want to touch on some trends i've seen. i understand why someone would characterize bagua as being more aggressive and constantly attacking and that taichi just waits----this is the way that many teachers teach the beginning levels of these arts. all the taichi classes i have taken (wu, yang, chen) have emphasized sung and passivity. and the bagua classes i've taken (gao, yin fu) have emphasized peng and assertiveness. they both also teach and train their opposites. you have to have to sung to have peng and vice versa. and at their higher levels of mastery you would see very little difference between the 2 arts. they both will wait until the opponent thinks about attacking and then attack first....... but the reason for their apparent different initial emphasis, i believe, is due to their differing goals. tai chi is taught and trained mostly as a one-on-one fighting art, while bagua is taught for multiple simultaneous opponents. taichi, i think, was used more as a gentlemen's dueling art. you know, "i challenge you! my master is better!", or "you killed my father! prepare to die!" and bagua was specifically developed for bodyguards who were ambushed or attacked by gangs of opponents. fighting a single person is very different from fighting a crowd of attackers. thus, the bagua secret technique of "invisibility"! lol! well, its sorta true....
Several of techniques in Taiji are intended for multiple opponents, especially in the weapons forms. In fact, we have a short form, and we do a thing while one person does the form and names out loud the technique names, 3 others do the techniques named (one player the defender and two playing the attackers). My teacher has got a digical comcorder and we hope to start recording hand and weapon techniques for out website, perhaps we will get that up.
