Self Defense-Are People Aware?

Discussion in 'Self Defence' started by 47MartialMan, Jul 7, 2016.

  1. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    Can't find a link. Have you got one?
  2. Lotus Flower

    Lotus Flower Moved on Supporter

    I'm confused, as the website says this:

    Yet you say you teach martial arts and not self defence.

    Others say that martial arts and self defence are different, so how can other instructors call it self defence and you call it martial arts?

    What happens after 18 months? How do you get students used to the "savage, stunning strikes, multidirectional strikes"?

    As someone looking to maybe partake in a course all these differing opinions are confusing.
  3. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    There are no universally accepted definitions. Here on MAP, the delineation is kept rather strictly, but that in no way means that is an authoritative definition.

    Having said that, during the training we do address the areas associated with self-defence, and go further than any singular course I have heard of, but not, at present, in a self-contained short "self-defence" course.

    By being hit with them :)

    Although if a student expressly wishes to keep contact light, and is happy with staying at a certain level of training and understands the limitations of that, then they will never be coerced to engage in harder contact levels.

    I can appreciate that :)
  4. Simon

    Simon Administrator Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    To anyone interested I'd say jump in with both feet.

    I've found that I take away so much from these events. Enough to make you question and re-evaluate your own training.
  5. Knee Rider

    Knee Rider Valued Member Supporter

    David's postings on here do far more for the credibility of Marbo (at least his own classes) than that website. I know David probably can't publicly be seen to criticise it, but if I was him I'd distance myself from any responsibility for its content too.

    It's to David's credit that even though my opinion of his org is so low I'd actually not hesitate to contact him to at least try training if I was in the South West.
  6. Simon

    Simon Administrator Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    I think Marbo needs to decide what it is.

    A devastating self defence system akin to something the military would use, or a martial art.

    It seems from David's quote that even the instructors within the organisation don't have an agreement on the definition.

    Quotes like this don't help:

    I'm not here to bash Marbo, there are other threads on the subject and they've been done to death, but the topic is about people's awareness when it comes to self defence.

    The website contradicts what David has said.
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2016
  7. Knee Rider

    Knee Rider Valued Member Supporter

    The website reads like the love child of Ashida Kim and the architect from the Matrix.
  8. Matt F

    Matt F Valued Member

    For me, good SD is having physical and psychological fundamentals that can be adapted to any situation as best as possible and ,hopefully being able to anticipate situations before they happen and be first to leave and not even be there, first to either calm and control the situation ,or first to take action ,whilst also accepting how random the situation could be and come from and that things might have to be made up on the spot and dealt with in an imaginative way.
  9. Simon

    Simon Administrator Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    That's fine, but what should the newby look for when searching out a SD class / course / seminar?

    Are you discounting the half day awareness courses, as they're not going to be able to give you the physical fundamentals to deal with any situation?

    I think this is where as martial artists we often recommend what we want, rather than what the newby wants.

    Not all courses are created equally, but neither are the participants requirements.
  10. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    What you fail to grasp, even though I've tried to explain it to you before, is that Marbo is an organisation, not a curriculum.

    There is the common thread of the fighting system, but to become a full member you only have to pass the first grade and you don't have to do another hour's training in that if you don't want to. Maybe you want to focus on bushcraft, or conservation and forestry, or whatever.

    In modern parlance, a lot of what we do could be called peer-to-peer training.

    I always bang on about context in relation to self-defence, but I get the feeling that goes over your head. I'm not actually keen on the term self-defence, as for me it all comes under the all-encompassing umbrella of "survival".

    Specificity of intelligence is key to survival.

    In some places in the world, a smile is an insult. In other places, if you break eye contact and adopt a fence posture, you'll be given a thrashing, or if you try and walk away from someone shouting spit into your face you'll be killed.

    The skills needed by a vulnerable person with disabilities have very little to do with the skills needed by a young buck who likes to go out on the pull of a weekend.

    So, if I know of a vulnerable person who needs some help to prevent them becoming a victim, I have students who deal with those issues for a living who I would turn to. Going to South America and need to know how to keep a fire going at altitude? Talk to a different person. Going to work in a country where the authorities go through your hotel room every day when you're out and you need to keep something secret? That's a different person again. Starting work as a door supervisor? Different person for that. Joining the service and want some prep to give you an edge in your E&E exercise? Different person again. Worried that your mum's carer is dipping into her purse? You get the picture...

    Our skills as an organisation are as broad as our membership, but the skills we have are of a professional grade. Not hobbyists parroting Geoff Thompson books and doing a show & tell of what they did in their last seminar.

    So, what about your system, integrated whatsit (honestly can't remember the name)? Is that self defence or a martial art?
  11. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    The vast majority of victimisation is social, not physical.

    What do you say to people who don't have the physical capacity to have a scrap? Too bad?
  12. Simon

    Simon Administrator Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    David, I've not done a personal attack and haven't failed to grasp anything.

    The thread is about where a newby should look for self defence and what perhaps separates good from bad.

    All I've said that the Marbo website is confusing and indeed contradictory given what you've gone on to explain.

    I predominantly teach a martial art that is very much based on entering to trapping and (mainly standing) grappling.

    The techniques in the self defence side of my system doesn't differentiate from the main syllabus, however, the pressure and attitude do.

    There is more safety equipment that will include shin guards and crash helmets.

    I also have body protectors, which thanks to Mitch have just improved.

    When doing self defence with padded sticks I use safety eye ware which resemble skiing goggles.

    Because my system include Eskrima I also use the WEKAF helmets.

    This enables the students to use the sticks as well as empty hands (think Dog Brothers).

    I do cover the legal aspect, but not in the depth that someone like John Titchen would.

    I don't currently teach courses, but would do so on request.

    Hope that answers a few of your questions and perhaps creates a few more for those thinking of adding SD to their arsenal.
  13. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    Neither have I :)

    I've already stated that:

    My post above (#50) enforces the point that an instructor having skills specific to your needs is also important.

    You mean that one use of "self-defence" that you take exception to? From the descriptions of your classes below, it seems that is more justified than your use of it, to be honest.

    Your description makes it sound like your self-defence training is martial arts with armour and a bit of legal advice :confused: . Is it a martial art or self-defence?

    We, as an organisation, can also deliver self-defence courses. What are your credentials and professional experience that you feel qualify you to instruct others in self-defence?
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2016
  14. Dead_pool

    Dead_pool Spes mea in nihil Deus MAP 2017 Moi Award

    Id add david avacado wolfe to that list too.
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2016
  15. Simon

    Simon Administrator Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    Here is a perfect example of why it's so hard for someone seeking out good self defence instruction.

    I can across this clip on Twitter.

    [ame=""]This is what a REAL KRAV MAGA MASTER looks like - YouTube[/ame]

    It has 19 likes and no dislikes.

    Here is the only comment to date. .

    I personally think it's terrible.

    At 0.40 the instructor may as well stab himself in the back.
  16. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

    Exciting and intense music is a common tactic to distract the casual viewer from what is actually happening in the clips, which is usually compliant arm-hanging.
  17. Simon

    Simon Administrator Admin Supporter MAP 2017 Koyo Award

    That's so true.

    Websites with bold red lettering telling you danger is just around the corner is also a pet hate.
  18. David Harrison

    David Harrison MAPper without portfolio

  19. Ruark

    Ruark New Member

    Yes. It's between your ears. Seems like most people still believe this myth that it's all "technique." All they have to do is learn this Double Reverse Spinning Jivaro Thumbnail Twist and they can go out and reduce an aggressive thug to a whining puppy.

    The ability to administer violence is found within, not without. 99% of all you need to know is a few basic blocks and strikes. The rest is you.
  20. Knee Rider

    Knee Rider Valued Member Supporter

    You are trying to sell ice to the Arctic if you are aiming this at me.

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