Right,come on fellow women....

Discussion in 'Women's Self Defence' started by Su lin, Jan 4, 2008.

  1. Taffyleigh

    Taffyleigh Valued Member

    I think that any MA that teaches groundwork has to be an advantage for women, unfortunate enough to be in the situation of being raped. At first the attacker may have the woman pinned hand over mouth, etc, but at some point they would have to remove their hands to undo victims clothing or their own clothing, thats when victim has chance to strike back, aiming for the eyes or throat, for starters. I think for realistic training you would need a partner to pin you to the ground, smother your mouth, hand on your throat, so you get the feel of things and then look at what options are open to you, and you will know what to look for in a real situation. The more realistic training, the more prepared you will be for the real thing even when the fear factor kicks in.
  2. Fire-quan

    Fire-quan Banned Banned

    Well, I think there is a lot of truth in that - and it would be nice to see some really practical, useable, anti-ground attack/escape courses/techniques drawn up - I think that will be an invaluable asset tot he whole field - and who better but the BJJ people?

    As fro being 15 - I've met some very smart 15 year olds. I was one as well, once - in ancient times.
  3. Fire-quan

    Fire-quan Banned Banned

    That's very true. Don't forget though, a lot of random attacks don't start out on the floor. The ultimate "ideal" answer to all grappling is, if possible don't go to the floor. Obviously, practically that's very difficult.

    In self defence it's usually called "coercion" - being grabbed and led away - that's the time to scream and fight.
  4. Fire-quan

    Fire-quan Banned Banned

    All very good points. Self defence has a number of "scenarios" to consider - random attack just being one.
  5. Fire-quan

    Fire-quan Banned Banned

    I didn't say she would - I'm just saying factor in the reality aspect - the difference. It's a huge mistake in martial arts that people don't realise just how different a genuinely intended attack incident is. A whole range of different emotions come in ti play - and there are martial artists who could line up to tell us that when it really kicked off, years of training went out of the window.

    Absoloutely - more training the better - but it is very hard to re-create the emotions and physical responses associated with a genuine fear of dying.

    Someone whose attitude I like on this is Steve Morris, because he addresses directly that you need to train a certain "attitude" - a switch in to a completely different, animal attack mode to totally repel the attack. In fact - look how animals do it - a lioness doesn't try to beat a lion, she tries to make it feel it's not worth his while - by meeting him with massive aggression.
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2008
  6. Moi

    Moi Warriors live forever x

    Your first couple of muay thai fights come pretty close. ;)
  7. Su lin

    Su lin Gone away

    Good discussion guys!

    See this is the thing about just doing a short course. I know from being in tournaments that you can step up after not training for long,adrenaline kicks in and you can't remember anything you have been taught!

    I personally feel that you need to be doing something on a regular basis, whether it be ground work based or essentially striking based, until you can do it without thinking under an incredibly high pressure situation. I mean,I'm lucky in that I haven't been in the situation of fending off an attacker, but now I have been studying kung fu for a while I know that a short course would not equip me with the confidence and second nature ability that you would probably get doing an ma. I'm by no means saying that I would attack in a manner that is second nature, but after fighting in tournaments, I know how adrenaline can work ,even when my life is not in danger.
  8. Taffyleigh

    Taffyleigh Valued Member

    Although not quite the same as the real thing, when we train we try to make it as realistic as possible, by using threats, shout abuse at each other when attacking so defender gets the feel of ti and gets the adrenalin going, sometimes its hard to take serious and you burst out laughing especially the kids classes, as they dont take things so serious, but we do try to drum it into them that one day it could be. Also we regularly do random attacks, eg grabbing hold of scruff of neck, rugby tackling when the kids aren't expecting anything just to keep them on their toes, although this is only done with the older teenagers and also the senior classes, as we don't want parents complaining we scared the crap out of their kids!!!! Its suprising how quickly they react to the situation, no chance to think just react.
  9. Cait

    Cait da Bionic is BACK!

    you're welcome! it's sadly depressing, isn't it?
  10. adouglasmhor

    adouglasmhor Not an Objectivist

    At 15 you do not have a lot of experience of life, you are still starting out nothing wrong with being 15 but it doesn't give you a lot of room for rhetorical pontification.
  11. I'mKira

    I'mKira Banned Banned

    What the hell are you talking about?

    She makes 4 different begginer grappling mistakes within a minute.

    1: She got dumb and happy with the upkicks. Yes, upkicks do work. But expecting to get in 4 in a row? Bronx cheer goes here.

    2: She plays "open guard" flat on her back with no hip movement

    3: Our liberal arts proffesor "rapist" just falls the **** over. No sweep. He just...falls over. Because rapists have no sense of balance.

    4: She gives up good positioning to go for some godawful ground based tae kwon do axe kicks. Yay.

    5: She gets up, not with a good tactical standup but by rolling away and showing her back.

    6: Finally, there was no resistance. None. He was literally not even trying. I don't care how carefully you make the set or what camera angle you film it from, that is LARPing.
  12. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    Very true and I appreciate where you're coming from, all I'm saying i that I've put a few years of research into "woman's defence courses" and 8/10 their rubbish.
  13. Frodocious

    Frodocious She who MUST be obeyed! Moderator Supporter

    Just wondering why you have such an interest in women's self defense courses?
  14. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    I started because my mum was raped in front of me when I was a kid and since then I've been trying to find legit classes to recommend rather than the ones that just rip people off. Believe me I understand how it looks having someone my age commenting.
  15. Frodocious

    Frodocious She who MUST be obeyed! Moderator Supporter

    Bloomin heck mate! Sorry to hear about that. It can't be an easy thing to come to terms with!

    I know this might be a bit personal, but did your mum have any self defense training before this or did she do any afterwards?
  16. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    Don't worry about it, like I said I appreciate how weird it is to have a 15 year old on here. No she didn't have any training and she still hasn't because she's overweight and thinks it'll be a problem. I've taken up MA for my own defense 'cos of frequent bullying and I've been teaching her to a degree.
  17. Stephan-san

    Stephan-san Valued Member

    I know that this is an old thread, but I just found it and found some good information for debate.

    I've been training in the Bujinkan for the last 18 years. I am a man that instructs and trains with women regularly. I'll be the first one to say that the short "self-defense" courses would only be good for transmitting verbal teaching.

    I believe that martial art is something that women should invest time in, just as many men do. Without training in physical confrontation, women and men stand equally a poor chance. It is training that gives all the ability, not just men, but also women.

    But I also believe that women's training needs to be different. I agree with an earlier post that stated attacks on women are very different than those on men. Also there are many obvious differences between men and women that should be accounted for. High heeled shoes and tight skirts are not recommended for fighting, but they are a part of fashion. Period. These things should not be thought of as an obstacle for a woman's defense, but as a fact that makes that defense different from a man's. I always teach women to do some training in heels. If they don't they won't know how. It's as simple as that. Train for real life. Tight skirts can restrict leg movement. Train in them. Learn how to adjust. And most of all, practice an art designed for truely combative situations. Learning to overcome a 250 lb. man is not difficult if you study all of the natural weaknesses of the body. After all, I've had my own butt kicked by women much smaller than me.

    Stephan Davis
    Mansfield Bujinkan
  18. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    id suggest carrying a knife.
  19. Rhea

    Rhea Laser tag = NOT MA... Supporter

    I wouldn't! I'd suggest a good set of keys carried in the hand if anyone feels it's really necessary.
    A knife won't solve anything unless you like getting arrested yourself.
  20. Southpaw535

    Southpaw535 Well-Known Member Moderator Supporter

    true but taking away the constraints of a messed up legal system i have no sympathy for any sex attacker so if you want to beat them, stab them, castrate them (seal of approval here) or whatever else be my guest. But yeah, I appreciate this isnt likely in real life so it's the same thing as normal self defence i guess: use whatever you have and can find around you, claim self defence and that it was impulse.

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