Rhee's Taekwon-Do - what do you know about it?

That's why when I attend either of my martial arts training, I show some respect by not mentioning or doing my alternate styles. Keeps everyone happy.

Besides, I figured that if I really wanted to do Style A whilst attending Style B training (and paying money for it), why not just stay home and do Style A? Or better yet, go to a Style A training session.

 

Hello Kazama

I know its 10 months later but did you ever get a chance to train under Master Chong Hyup Rhee at his Parhran Dojang in Melbourne ? I know from experience Master Chong Hyup Rhee runs a very demanding class with senior black belts training up to 4 hours a night under his instruction.

Master Chong Hyup Rhee is a living legend in the TKD world, he is one of 12 original Masters of TKD http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Original_masters_of_taekwondo
and is one of the few “originals” still actively teaching on the Dojang floor week in week out.

To answer a couple of other points raised:
*Master Chong Chul Rhee & Master Chong Hyup Rhee were from General Choi’s original Chang Hon style that predates and is parent style to both the ITF and WTF “styles”.
* The Rhee masters are very old school, one style, one master, for life. However the old adage of “don't ask don't tell” is very true amongst the younger generation of Rhee TKD Yu Dan Ja, rightly or wrongly.

 

Man that's 90% of instructors that I've dealt with. Train with me and no one else has been the mantra I've heard....just sayin....

 

Late to the party as usual. However, I may be able tyo offer some insights, as one of my current students, who grew up in Oz trained and gained 1st degree under Master Chong Chul Rhee org.

I`m not going to give my personal opinion as I dont know this Master very well, but I can pass on some insights, such as:

Patterns - very old, 1970's/karate style
Sparring - non-contact
Competition - Non-Exsistant (the first time the student ever competed was at my club, after they joined).
Self-Defence - I cannot say as he/she has some Kempo training
Destruction - few and far between AFAIA

Happy to put you in touch with them if you drop me a personal email (and they are happy to oblige of course).

I will say this however, that student left the org unhappy with many things and her friend, who had been training with them 20+ years alos left recently (she visited us too). Don't let this put you off though, as they were both instructors and it may have been things at that level that got to them, rather than kup grade training (in fact I believe it was).

Stuart

 

Greetings “Guardian of real TKD” ?

As feedback from someone that has more that a few more years of continuous RHEE TKD training than your noted source , please note commentary to your feedback in UPPERCASE.

Patterns - very old, 1970's/karate style = YES TRUE – AS PER THE ORIGINAL WAY, NONE OF THE THEATRICAL SINEWAVE.
Sparring - non-contact = YES AT KUP LEVEL
Competition - Non-Exsistant (the first time the student ever competed was at my club, after they joined). YES TRUE NO COMP’s
Self-Defence - I cannot say as he/she has some Kempo training = SD IS SCHOOLS FOCUS
Destruction - few and far between AFAIA = IN RTKD PINE BOARD BREAKING FROM 8th KUP ALL THE WAY THROUGH TO TILES & BOARDS FROM 1st KUP UP THROUGH ALL DAN's.

These x-student sources you claim are not those of the infamous TOOGEE Tae Kwon Do you have aligned yourself with in Oz are they. I noticed Robert took delight in writing up his training experience with your school in the UK. As you would be well aware Robert Frost of Toogee Tae Kwon Do was a break away of Rhee Tae Kwon Do. Robert was a 3rd Dan under Master Rhee and the day after he broke away he woke up the next morning magically as a 5th Dan Master with no accreditation from any organization or Korean Master and now just a few years later claims 7th Dan status (in 6 years he has jumped 4 x Dan levels). This is the man that actively promotes your Totally Tae Kwon Do web magazine as well as promotes your book Chang Hon for you in Australia. Obviously even though you claimed “I dont know this Master very well” your post seem to run a mutually critical line as per Frost.

Your post was interesting but revealing.

 

As having trained with Rheetkd in the 80's and still have some mates involved in it, I think that Stuart's assessment is reasonable and balanced. Yes there is a bit more destruction in the grading and some classes actually have boards or tiles to break, but on the whole it is not a regular activity in the majority of the classes.

Rheetkd in Australia was one of the most widespread martial arts associations in the early 80's many martial artists started or did some early training with them. With breakaway groups and more competition from other schools the association is not as big or as popular as it was 30yrs ago. As for how good it is.... anyone interested in training with them (or any other style) best talk to the local instructor and try his/her class out. Instructors anywhere are of various quality ranging from incompetent to excellent. So find one you are happy with.....

 

Fair call Angry

What is perplexing is that = as Stuart noted

“I will say this however, that student left the org unhappy with many things and her friend, who had been training with them 20+ years alos left recently (she visited us too). Don't let this put you off though, as they were both instructors and it may have been things at that level that got to them”

The female X-Rhee TKD Instructor with 20 years training that is now Stuart’s student would have without doubt been in a senior position of Rhee TKD school authority and as such had a real influence on how the day to day classes ran. If this x-20 year Instructor found parts of her weekly classes lacking then she would have been empowered to change them - bring in boards & tiles for the students, pull out the mats, bring in the head gear and boxing gloves, etc, etc.

Master Rhee visits every 3 months to grade student’s technique, Hyung and check spirit. To be permitted to attend grading a students instructor must have made an assessment that their student is competent in all aspects for their kup rank – if that Instructor turns a blind eye or is just lazy then that lays with that Instructor and that maybe the very reason the noted female instructor is no longer with Rhee TKD unless she was apart of a break away faction eg: Toogee.

You get lazy instructors in all schools and Rhee TKD is no different - it is just a case of how quickly these lazy leaders are identified and 1. warned & told to buck up or 2. moved on by the Master or their seniors.

However for the “Guardian of real TKD” to infer the Rhee Masters overall school standards are poor is insulting. Sometimes when younger TKD-ists start to believe their own hype they feel they have the right to publicly disrespect those few original Korean TKD Masters that have done so much to build the platform the now happily stand on. It’s very sad but truly interesting as it goes to the creditability of these parties.

 

The worst thing to ever happen to TKD as an effective art of self defense was its inclusion in the Olympics, almost overnight the sole focus of pretty much every school I have come across since is sport oriented where you play tag with your foot instead of learning realistic practical self defense.

Virtually no hand work, no guarding your face...I'm actually embarrassed sometimes to admit I have a 2nd degree in TKD

I'm sure there are a lot of schools out there staying loyal to its roots as a art of self defense but the big chain schools dont seem to be...in my experience anyway.

 

I agree protiennerd, and as a RTKD student, maybe I could add some insight to this discussion.

Yes, we have no competition, other wise like protiennerd said it becomes a game of tag.

And the non contact thing is a mis-nomer, as juniors, no contact, at senior kup level, non contact, we train with no protective gear, maybe the odd mouthguard, but you get touched up. The no contact is in the hand of the defender. The thing is if you don't move or block, you will get hit.

 

You missed the smiley bit

How would you know how long the 'source' trained their for - I dont recall mentioning any lengths of time!

Apologies if I got some different/incorrect - maybe a school by school thing or maybe I just heard it wrong - anyway, I just pasing along the info I had to the OP's question. Notice I didnt give an opinion either way myself!

No they are not. Furthermore, I havn't aligned myself with anyone.. not sure where you get your info from.

So.. he visited me when in the UK.

No.. I didnt know that, nor do I care.. I take people at face value and really dont care who they are aligned with or were previously.

Thats very kind of him - as well as the many others aroudn the world who promote the free TKD mag and/or my books. No hidden agenda's my friend.. he just likes them.

I wrote that to show its not 'a' personal opinion (ie. mine), as I dont know the Master well.. I know of him, some of his achievements, some who have trained with him etc. but thats about it!

Yes it revealed 2 things:
1. You read into it with what you wanted to get out of it - though were totally off base
2. You have an issue with another TKD instructor - which my post had nothing to do with!

Stuart

 

Again, you are reading/adding things tat i ddint write.

The person of 20 years is not my student, I said they were a friend of my student. Besides, in your last post you said it was a bloke!!!

AGAIN -- as I said in the original reply - it was instructor level sttuff, ie. things with how the org runs, as opposed to general training in theirs or any club. I deliberatly didnt get specific, as that would possibly tar all clubs under the org and give a wrong impression. Obviously your a big supporter of the org - great for you - they left unhappy - sad for them - life goes on!

And maybe not! These are assumptions you are making, they are not the facts and are incorrect anyway, even if you are guessing!

I didnt infer anything - I passed on facts from those that trained with them, facts further supported by angry, following your post. Despite what you infer, I do not have a hidden agenda.. againsts RheeTKD or anyone else.

Sorry if the facts dont fit your view of things, or even if they differ. I made no comment about the Master himself, just the experience of some who have trained within that org. Experinces differ from person to person, so that may explain the different views - but dont make out its anything other than answering the OP, cos its not. But you might want to get your shoulder chip sorted however! Glass houses, stones and all that!

Stuart

 

I have no affiliation to anyone invovled in TKD and have no interest in the political undercurrent that is evident here. What I do know is that Master Rhee has been an ambassador for TKD for many years. This dedication has, I am sure either directly or indirectly impacted on many TKD practitioners around the globe. That deserves some respect.

What I also know is that usually the person at the top (in this case Master Rhee) often has little or no knowledge (or concern) of the political gesturing of those in the lower ranks who are trying to prove something...usually to themselves. Best to keep martial arts and politics separate...imho.

With respect

Peter
(Now back to hitting people with sticks! )

 

I think the problems with TKD started much earlier than that. The Korean government decided in the 60s and 70s that TKD was going to be a diplomatic tool, which meant it needed to be [a] accessible to an international audience of martial arts laymen and irrefutably Korean.

This meant that TKD had to become a simple sport rather than a complex martial art, that a mostly false Korean history of the art had to be invented and propagated, and that the Korean innovations to the art (that is, the variety of kicks and the padded sparring) needed to be embraced as the art's central focus.

The hilarious contradiction is that the Korean elements of the art are only about 60 years old, and so clinging to a false 2,000-year history is actually preventing TKD from fully embracing its Korean-ness.

 

Now THAT is funny!

 

This is well said.

Lets keep this civil. I don't think we need to fear GM Rhee being 'dishonored' as he is probably the best known TKDist on the planet. His legacy is fairly secure. Every org has politics. You put people together (and money) and politics spontaneously emerges. So lets not get into a discussion on the politics of an organization as I think this is a beginning student asking the question.

I don't know anything about Rhee TKD in terms of class format etc. But his reputation is very solid and I think the core fundamentals would also be solid if you learned in his organization. Stuart saying it is 'karatesque' does not surprise me. As the person I quoted above mentions TKD has been rapidly evolving in the last 60 years and those that learned from an older Korean will be doing 'outdated' stuff. I have a 70+ year old korean master and it is also very 'karatesque'. Note that when I say, 'outdated', I am not inferring it is inferior (again I have a very similar background).

To the person who asked the question I would just jump in and start participating. See if you like it. If you don't you quit. That is what I tell prospective students who are on the fence...

 

Ha ha! I've just been informed via PM that we're not talking about Jhoon Rhee. Excuse my mistake.

 

This Post is about Rhee Tkd schools in Australia under Master Rhee, Chong Chul. He is noted as been one of the 'ITF' 12 masters from the early international expansion along with his brother and Rhee Ki Ha (UK). Jhoon Rhee (USA) migrated to the US prior to this period.

As this thread was about someone asking if training with Rhee tkd in Perth Australia would be a good move and this can really only be address by knowing both the student and the proposed teacher and making an assessment on if they can form a beneficial relationship in which to practice martial arts, I think we should leave it be besides the previously mentioned try out the class and see.....

Also it was a 12mth old thread.... Rhee tkd can be a emotional topic among people whom have vested interest in promoting or denigrating it.... (not saying that is happening here yet.... but see old threads on topic if still in database...)

 

Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! I share in your humility. I've been talking about Jhoon Rhee since last year. This is the real myster-Rhee and he is easy-Rhee mistaken!

 

I think this kind of reply is quite unnecessay.

You say you don't know Master Rhee (australia) very well? Do you know him at all? Having read your magazine and seen reference to your "Pioneer TKD Association" you may be interested to know that Master Rhee was a real pioneer. Introducing ITF TKD to Australia.

The whole: "I know someone who knew someone who wasn't happy there..." is pointless. "I know something bad but don't let that put you of....." Pointless.

Your whole post has a negative air to it regarding Rhee TKD. At the same time you seem to infer that what you are doing is somehow better. Having seen your rather lack-lustre performance of pattern Choong Moo here recently I would be inclined to disagree.

I have also noticed that you seem to make statements that invite criticism. Yet when this criticism comes, as it inevitablely will, you accuse your repliers of having a "chip on their shoulder". I have sen you make this comment twice recently to different individuals here.

Why do you feel the need to do this? In effect you are saying you are beyond question since your comments are in my opinion deliberatly provocative. Not everyone who questions you is going to have a chip on their shoulder. Maybe those people just find what you write puzzling since you seem to abide by a distinct set of double standards.

Also, I'm sure I am not the only person who finds your claim to be the "Guardian of Real TKD" baffling. If it is, as you claim a joke, then I think the joke has run it course. You are not the guardian of MY TKD thank you very much, and that's pretty REAL to me.